Yamaha RX-A3070 / A2070 / A1070 Aventage Owners' Thread - Page 130 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3871 of 5041 Old 09-07-2018, 09:41 PM
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I know it's a preference but just curious how much dB higher than the mains do you guys run your subs as compared to Audyssey receivers (if you had one) knowing Yamaha's low sub output?

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post #3872 of 5041 Old 09-07-2018, 11:28 PM
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Just brought home a 1070. I originally wanted a 2070 but I'm not doing anything more than 5.1 anytime soon and I just bought a JVC projector and still need to buy 4k sources. It's a lot at once and so I went the cheaper route. Won't be able to fully put it through its bases until tomorrow when kids aren't asleep. Hopefully I won't notice drop in output as it is lower than my previous receiver.

Edit: watch TDK last night and it lacked some of gut punch from shotgun blasts in bank scene but I think that was ypao's fault. Will have to play with it.

Listening to classical this morning. Tchaikovsky's 1812 is always a favourite for auditioning. Canons approaching!

Also love the app. I use a harmony so I never want to touch the main remote again but having easy access to all receiver functions on an iPad is great, especially for playing with all the DSP modes for music.

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post #3873 of 5041 Old 09-08-2018, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by xb243 View Post
I know it's a preference but just curious how much dB higher than the mains do you guys run your subs as compared to Audyssey receivers (if you had one) knowing Yamaha's low sub output?
+3
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post #3874 of 5041 Old 09-08-2018, 07:58 AM
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I know it's a preference but just curious how much dB higher than the mains do you guys run your subs as compared to Audyssey receivers (if you had one) knowing Yamaha's low sub output?
Do you have an SPL meter?

Right after YPAO does its dance through all speakers/subs,
I go onto Setup>Manual>Configuration change all speakers to Small, 80Hz crossover.

Then go to Test Tone>On>Level and go to one speaker at a time (Master Volume around -15)
I make sure all speakers are putting out the same SPL from my MLP. (YPAO is close but not always prefect)

When I get to the sub channels I make sure they are putting out at least 10dB higher than the speakers.
But don't adjust the levels in the AVR over "0" to avoid clipping the signal, use the gain/volume knob on the subs.

For Dual Subs, Because the test tones calibrate each sub out separately, you also gain another +3dB naturally. (+6dB if subs are co-located)
The way our ears work, the lowest frequencies need to be significantly higher to be "felt", especially for movies with significant LFE/ULF content.

It's fine to have a Flat Frequency Response for Music, but most Bass Heads prefer to run a House Curve for movies.
Great read here on how our ears perceive bass, and why 30Hz frequencies need to be +8dB higher than 100Hz frequencies to be "felt" the same:

https://www.hometheatershack.com/for...ed-how-do.html

House curves were the running topic in the Movies with Bass thread on AVS over the past couple weeks now too:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...harts-348.html

If you want to get serious about Sub EQ, since YPAO does almost nothing to calibrate your sub(s)
(limited to 4 bands of EQ and nothing below 31.3Hz)

I strongly suggest spending ~$75 on a UMIK-1 mic and downloading REW (Room EQ Wizard)
to find out what YPAO is really doing for your room. Moving your subs around and adding room treatments, bass traps
Will help you narrow down what you can do physically to get the most out of your space.

...But when it comes to making digital EQ corrections, an Antimode or MiniDSP is the superior solution.
(in addition to being the best way to calibrate and integrate multiple subs) YPAO does not calibrate the sub channels together,
So you may be getting cancellation (standing waves) creating a NUL at your MLP.

a ~$200 MiniDSP 2x4HD has 2 inputs, 4 outs (for up to Four individual sub outs)
each channel with its own delay/distance, levels, and 10 bands of EQ, accurate down to 10Hz)



More on REW, miniDSP and BEQ (Bass EQ) here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...l#post56610134

Just raising your sub output levels won't guarantee you a "house curve" because that will also usually increase output around your crossover point.
Here's an example from my room taken from REW, but before putting the miniDSP in the chain to tame the peak ~70Hz.



You can digitally EQ out any peaks, but dips (aka Nuls) have to be fixed with different sub placement,
room treatments or by adding more subs to the room to even response across all seating positions.

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post #3875 of 5041 Old 09-08-2018, 12:36 PM
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I think it's probably been brought up already,
the pre-out line voltage on Yamaha's is only 1.0v, I think D/M models use 2.0v.

But if your subs have two inputs, using a Y-Splitter will double your line signal voltage to most subs.

When I go from single input to dual inputs on my Funk subs, the SPL goes up +6dB per sub.

RCA cable -> Y splitter -> single female in to 2 male outs -> Dual XLR adapters.



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post #3876 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 02:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
..


RCA cable -> Y splitter -> single female in to 2 male outs -> Dual XLR adapters.

..


Wait, what? Is a Y-splitter even necessary to do LFE for subs?
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post #3877 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 06:19 AM
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Wait, what? Is a Y-splitter even necessary to do LFE for subs?
no, you can use a splitter for typical subs to increase the level by +6dB, that's all.
and "level" means actual level, not the maximum volume, that stays all the same.
usually there are two places for the level adjustment: AVR setup menu and subwoofer volume control. With a splitter it's exactly the same if you would increase the volume by +6dB at the sub or in the AVR setup.
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post #3878 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Mouse View Post
no, you can use a splitter for typical subs to increase the level by +6dB, that's all.
and "level" means actual level, not the maximum volume, that stays all the same.
usually there are two places for the level adjustment: AVR setup menu and subwoofer volume control. With a splitter it's exactly the same if you would increase the volume by +6dB at the sub or in the AVR setup.

Thanks. I'm gonna try this on my HSU VTF-15 and run YPAO again to see if there is a difference.
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post #3879 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 08:38 AM
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no, you can use a splitter for typical subs to increase the level by +6dB, that's all.
and "level" means actual level, not the maximum volume, that stays all the same.
usually there are two places for the level adjustment: AVR setup menu and subwoofer volume control. With a splitter it's exactly the same if you would increase the volume by +6dB at the sub or in the AVR setup.
My SPL went up +6dB and allowed me to reduce the sub channel levels in my AVR from 0 to -3,
resulted no more clipping at peak output/high volume levels with extremely low ULF signals.

Denon/Maranz/Pioneer all use a 2.0v pre-out signal for every channel,
So Yamaha needs a tweak to provide the same. That's partially why there so many complaints in Yamaha threads about low sub performance.
Anyone using dedicated separate amplifiers for their subs, would be wise to choose one with a variable input signal selector.

If the sub gain is set too low, you cannot simply max the processors levels to compensate.
At higher volume levels there is much a greater chance of clipping the signal when you increase the level in the AVR over "0"
The real Bass-Heads on AVS recommend keeping the trim levels in the AVR in the negative zone.

Good read here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...ences.html#IIE
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post #3880 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 09:01 AM
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[rant mode on lol]
Good to hear I was hoping it was not a health issue or reality that we are all getting old, lol....
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post #3881 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 09:56 AM
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..
The real Bass-Heads on AVS recommend keeping the trim levels in the AVR in the negative zone.

Good read here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...ences.html#IIE

..

Holy ****! That post is awesome, like a Bass Bible. Will take a couple of days to absorb
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post #3882 of 5041 Old 09-09-2018, 03:33 PM
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Also do you guys know if and when AirPlay 2 may come to Yamaha receivers?


I own A2070 & A770. Seeing as many last year Denon & Marantz models got AirPlay 2 update, kind of feeling if I even made the right call getting these. I returned a $799 X4400H to Fry's to get the 2070
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post #3883 of 5041 Old 09-10-2018, 01:24 PM
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I know Yamaha hasn't been keeping up with Denon and Marantz in terms of new features and support for HDMI 2.1 and also stripping down features deemed non-essential.... however, when I got my 2070 last summer I compared the SQ to D&M and the Yamaha was the better sounding and more powerful option. Also, it has a reputation for reliability and running cooler than the competition.

Yamaha reminds of Nintendo and D&M more akin to Sony/Microsoft. They kinda do their own thing for better or worse, but the name is still one of best in the business and they have a loyal following despite any complaints or shortcomings in having the latest tech.

Considering I don’t use about 80% of the extraneous features on my 2070, the parts I do use matter the most... a very clear, detailed sound with ample power and great bass. Add to that legendary reliability and build quality, and I can overlook any shortcomings.

Anyhow, just my 2 cents. And I wouldn't complain if Yamaha did add the requested features the D&M have/will get via firmware update.
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post #3884 of 5041 Old 09-11-2018, 06:02 PM
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I need to know if the feet of A2070 will sit ok on a 16 inch deep shelf. Console is open back so not worried about connections just that front and rear feet will sit ok on my shelf.
TIA

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post #3885 of 5041 Old 09-11-2018, 06:20 PM
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I need to know if the feet of A2070 will sit ok on a 16 inch deep shelf.
TIA
Yes
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post #3886 of 5041 Old 09-11-2018, 07:30 PM
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I know Yamaha hasn't been keeping up with Denon and Marantz in terms of new features and support for HDMI 2.1 and also stripping down features deemed non-essential.... however, when I got my 2070 last summer I compared the SQ to D&M and the Yamaha was the better sounding and more powerful option. Also, it has a reputation for reliability and running cooler than the competition.

Yamaha reminds of Nintendo and D&M more akin to Sony/Microsoft. They kinda do their own thing for better or worse, but the name is still one of best in the business and they have a loyal following despite any complaints or shortcomings in having the latest tech.

Considering I don’t use about 80% of the extraneous features on my 2070, the parts I do use matter the most... a very clear, detailed sound with ample power and great bass. Add to that legendary reliability and build quality, and I can overlook any shortcomings.

Anyhow, just my 2 cents. And I wouldn't complain if Yamaha did add the requested features the D&M have/will get via firmware update.
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I need to know if the feet of A2070 will sit ok on a 16 inch deep shelf. Console is open back so not worried about connections just that front and rear feet will sit ok on my shelf.
TIA

If it doesn't fit the 16" shelf just put a small 3/8" piece of plywood under it with the four rubber feet on the corners. I've done this with a smallish entertainment center where the shelves were too short to hold a rather large HK 990 integrated amp. IIRC I used half inch plywood for the 50 pound beast. I had to cut a hole in the back just to get the 990 to fit behind the glass door.

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post #3887 of 5041 Old 09-11-2018, 07:36 PM
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The feet are about 12" apart, center to center,
Feet are around 2.25" diameter and set a bit over 2.5" center to front and rear face of the case.

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post #3888 of 5041 Old 09-12-2018, 05:27 PM
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Talking

This Just In...



Swap over from the old RX-A3050 should be easy enough, HDMI, RCA's and Banana plugs.
...just one less HDMI from my Oppo 203 to the OLED (that had to go direct to display for Dolby Vision)
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This week my Xbox1x isn't allowing me to change my DSP setting. It says it's on 2 channel, but the display shows the constant Atmos, which was already a glitch. Yet, the audio is playing surround.

If I try to change to any other DSP setting it says "not available."

Seems to be only the Xbox.

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post #3890 of 5041 Old 09-12-2018, 05:49 PM
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This week my Xbox1x isn't allowing me to change my DSP setting. It says it's on 2 channel, but the display shows the constant Atmos, which was already a glitch. Yet, the audio is playing surround.

If I try to change to any other DSP setting it says "not available."

Seems to be only the Xbox.

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It's 100% an XBO issue, not Yamaha

There's a lot of discussion in the XBOX One X section,
Denon/Marantz users are all experiencing the same issues

Check here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/141-x...thread-10.html
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post #3891 of 5041 Old 09-12-2018, 05:49 PM
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This Just In...



Swap over from the old RX-A3050 should be easy enough, HDMI, RCA's and Banana plugs.
...just one less HDMI from my Oppo 203 to the OLED (that had to go direct to display for Dolby Vision)
Nice. I just replaced my Denon AVR-X4200W with the RX-A2080 for DV and HLG passthrough. My HDMI situation is so much simpler now. Congrats on the new receiver!

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post #3892 of 5041 Old 09-12-2018, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
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It's 100% an XBO issue, not Yamaha

There's a lot of discussion in the XBOX One X section,
Denon/Marantz users are all experiencing the same issues

Check here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/141-x...thread-10.html
Had to be something they just updated. Wasn't doing this a couple weeks ago. Wish they'd get their audio issues settled.

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post #3893 of 5041 Old 09-12-2018, 07:29 PM
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Had to be something they just updated. Wasn't doing this a couple weeks ago. Wish they'd get their audio issues settled.

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It's been buggy for months, had my first issues over 6 months ago.
Now I only use my XB1 X Scorpio for Netflix titles I know are ATMOS titles, or ATMOS Games.
For non ATMOS Netflix I use my LG OLED's built in Netflix app

I never use the XB1 for 4K/UHD or BD disc playback,
already have an Oppo 203 and Panasonic UB900 for those.

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Congrats. Enjoy!
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Hi, I'm newbie to this 5.1.2 system. May i know does yamaha ypao rsc is good enough to calibrate the whole system or should i require purchase minidsp 2x4 HD with REW to eq the sub? If i use the REW file, does it filter the whole system or just the sub to match other speakers calibrated by ypao rsc?

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post #3896 of 5041 Old 09-13-2018, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guess21 View Post
Hi, I'm newbie to this 5.1.2 system. May i know does yamaha ypao rsc is good enough to calibrate the whole system or should i require purchase minidsp 2x4 HD with REW to eq the sub? If i use the REW file, does it filter the whole system or just the sub to match other speakers calibrated by ypao rsc?

Purchasing rx-a3070 due to good deal.

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A miniDSP can only be used with external amplifiers and/or powered subs.
The miniDSP 2x4HD only has 2 RCA inputs, 4 RCA outs. So up to 4 subs.

Other miniDSP models can handle more channels,
but you still need external amps to utilize the Dirac Live benefits.

https://www.minidsp.com/

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post #3897 of 5041 Old 09-13-2018, 08:57 PM
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My yamaha a3000 recently broke and now im in the market but am I the only one that feels dissapointed to upgrade but have the avr itself look almost identical to my now broke and outdated one?

I mean I know inside is what counts but ummm, yeah its a lot of $ for the same boring cosmetics I been staring at for the last 5 years...
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post #3898 of 5041 Old 09-13-2018, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
A miniDSP can only be used with external amplifiers and/or powered subs.
The miniDSP 2x4HD only has 2 RCA inputs, 4 RCA outs. So up to 4 subs.
Thanks for reply. Do you mean if i have only 1 sub, i do not need minidsp?

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post #3899 of 5041 Old 09-13-2018, 09:02 PM
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Thanks for reply. Do you mean if i have only 1 sub, i do not need minidsp?

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No one "needs" a miniDSP, What Sub make/model?

The Unfinished Basement Theater & Whisky Guitar Lounge | Bass EQ for Filtered Movies
JVC DLA X750 4K Projector | 120" Powered Drop Screen | 65" LG 65B6P OLED | Panasonic DMP UB900 | Oppo UDP 203 | HDFury Vertex
Yamaha RX-A3070 | 7.4.4.4 | Mission M3i x11 | Funk Audio 18.0 x2 | Velodyne DLS 5000R x2 | Crowson LvL3 MA x4 | miniDSP 2x4HD
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post #3900 of 5041 Old 09-13-2018, 09:13 PM
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Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
No one "needs" a miniDSP, What Sub make/model?
Atomh gt-sw2

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