NAD 758 v3 - Page 233 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6961 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by adg12345 View Post
When I received my 758, I ran all of the system updates, then started going through all the OSD menus to look at the different settings. I disabled and renamed inputs, changed the speaker configuration, etc. At some point, I think I changed some of the Listening Modes. Maybe I was just experimenting, or was trying to figure out how to get the "EARS" mode to show up (side note, I don't think I could because I run a 3.1 setup). I can't connect the timing of changing those settings to when I started having issues with DD+.

However, since doing a factory reset, I haven't touched any of the Listening Mode settings. Have you changed those settings since doing a factory reset? I can post the values I have in my OSD once I'm home later, although they should be the default settings.

I believe this issue is solely between DD+ and the NAD. I tried two different streaming devices and different HDMI cables, and I didn't have issues playing local 5.1 content using Kodi on the Fire TV, or Infuse Pro on the Apple TV.

I am hesitant to change my Listening Mode settings out of fear of reintroducing the problem I was having, but I'm hoping we find that you have different Listening Mode settings than me, as maybe that will get us closer to figuring out how to reproduce this issue.

The only other thing I'm wondering about is if there is something about me running a 3.1 setup that is confusing the NAD. I never had this issue when using my old Yamaha RX-A1070, or multiple Denon receivers before that.
Gotcha. Yes I think this is me, too. I did make changes in that menu, but I'm 99% sure it was AFTER I did the factory reset and tested DD+, to see if it would fix the problem. I think I reset, and immediately tested DD+ to see if it resolved the issue. I may have to try again just to be sure.
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post #6962 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post
I would consider that limitation totally unacceptable for that price point. It's downright insulting.
I believe any processor running Dirac Live is limited to 48KHz. Does that mean all processors with Dirac Live are totally unacceptable? And what exactly is it about 96KHz that you find absolutely necessary?
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post #6963 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
I believe any processor running Dirac Live is limited to 48KHz. Does that mean all processors with Dirac Live are totally unacceptable? And what exactly is it about 96KHz that you find absolutely necessary?
Does it mean that if I play a 192khz file on my Oppo 103 it will be down sampled to 48khz????
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post #6964 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by xhattan View Post
Does it mean that if I play a 192khz file on my Oppo 103 it will be down sampled to 48khz????
If you are using Dirac Live, that is my understanding. If I am wrong, I am sure someone will correct me.
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post #6965 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by jake51 View Post
I'm pretty happy with my Pioneer LX901
But I can't stop thinking about Dirac and how it may transform the sound in my room
Is it hard to run (guess it's not plug and play)? The manual doesn't say much about the actual process
Also, I don't have a laptop for running the software in my living room

The process is relatively simple, and you don't need a computer in the same room, if you've got a decent network it should work that way (you can plug the mic into the AVR, rather than the computer)
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post #6966 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by xhattan View Post
Does it mean that if I play a 192khz file on my Oppo 103 it will be down sampled to 48khz????
If you use Dirac with fullrange stereo speakers in 2.0 configuration it will be downsampled to 96kHz.
In any other configuration including 2.1 it will be downsampled to 48kHz.


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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
I believe any processor running Dirac Live is limited to 48KHz. Does that mean all processors with Dirac Live are totally unacceptable? And what exactly is it about 96KHz that you find absolutely necessary?
If I'm not wrong, Datasat downsample to 96/24.

Dirac Live on PC is capable of 192/24, but it lacks bass management, of course.

For me, 96/24 is quite enough, but in 2.1 configuration.

There is a number of 96/24 recordings and also DSD/SACD which do sound somewhat better than appropriate 44.1/16.
And if I build a high quality combined Hi-Fi and HT system, I would like to be able to reproduce them.

Of course, I would rather choose well recorded and produced 44.1/16 than mediocre 96/24, but well recorded and produced 96/24 could sound really fantastic on appropriate system.

BTW, with downsample to 48kHz hi-res Tidal loses its purpose.


For price range and expected quality of NAD T758 v3, I don't find downsampling to 48kHz a problem.
But for M17 v2 (and Arcam 850 / 860), hmmmm...
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post #6967 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Delija View Post

For price range and expected quality of NAD T758 v3, I don't find downsampling to 48kHz a problem.
But for M17 v2 (and Arcam 850 / 860), hmmmm...
My understanding is that the downsampling is required, by or caused by, Dirac Live, not by the hardware. So whether you are talking about a reasonably-priced 758 or a considerably more expensive M17, it doesn’t make a difference. The MiniDSP 88A that I am using also is restricted to 48KHz.
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post #6968 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 04:31 PM
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I wrote above - Datasat RS20i downsamples to 96kHz. Not 48kHz.
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/...cessor-review/

And it does make a difference. For that amount of money ($6k + amp) I demand 96/24
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post #6969 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 04:50 PM
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Theta Digital Casablanca IV / IVa should also be 96kHz processor.
https://www.thetadigital.com/casablanca-iva/
https://www.dirac.com/buy-products-w...-our-partners/
https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/...cessor-review/

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post #6970 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
I believe any processor running Dirac Live is limited to 48KHz. Does that mean all processors with Dirac Live are totally unacceptable? And what exactly is it about 96KHz that you find absolutely necessary?

Lower distortion, especially when you are filtering the audio. 48kHz processing may or may not be acceptable depending on the price-point. I do have a T758v3 and at the price I paid, while I'm not super happy about 48kHz, I do accept the limitation at this point in time. I do expect them to improve in the future, however. Also, Dirac Live software shouldn't actually force 48kHz processing. Their software is more about figuring out what corrections to apply to the audio and you could process that however you wanted. However I of course can't say this with 100% confidence; I haven't seen Dirac's source code.
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post #6971 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 05:04 PM
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If Datasat and Theta implementations of Dirac work internally on 96kHz and downsample to 96kHz (no matter how many channels are processed), it's obviously not limited by Dirac software.

I would say Datasat and Theta use better hardware.

We cannot expect that from T758 v3, but we should expect that from M17 v2 and also from Arcam 850 & 860.
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post #6972 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 06:46 PM
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Update for the Hum / Buzz noise from the T777v3

NAD Canada has a Solution for the Buzz / Humm Noise. Now i can send my NAD to Repair it. They have found the problem on the Mainboard.
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post #6973 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richardsim7 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
Hey guys, through much research it appears that my Sony 75Z9D does a better job with its video upscaling then the NAD. What would I have to do to ensure that only the tv handles the upscaling instead of the NAD? I have the HDMI out from the NAD going to the SONY and all the three HDMI inputs I’m using going into the NAD...

What would you guys suggest? The Sony has 2 of its HDMI being the full spectrum 4K HDR and 18 Gbs speed-one of them is the ARC but don’t know if I should be using the ARC or not?

The NAD doesn't do any upscaling, it doesn't touch the video (hence there's no on-screen OSD)
What do you mean no on screen OSD?
I thought most AVRs do upscaling but maybe I was mistaken...thank you

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post #6974 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Delija View Post
If Datasat and Theta implementations of Dirac work internally on 96kHz and downsample to 96kHz (no matter how many channels are processed), it's obviously not limited by Dirac software.

I would say Datasat and Theta use better hardware.

We cannot expect that from T758 v3, but we should expect that from M17 v2 and also from Arcam 850 & 860.
So to be clear:

If I am paying for TIDAL with my NAD and listening to more then just two speakers then I might as well just pay less for Spotify since I won’t hear any sound improvements at 48KHz with DIRAC on???

Am I correct with this?

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post #6975 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Jakub Hyzyk View Post
Gotcha. Yes I think this is me, too. I did make changes in that menu, but I'm 99% sure it was AFTER I did the factory reset and tested DD+, to see if it would fix the problem. I think I reset, and immediately tested DD+ to see if it resolved the issue. I may have to try again just to be sure.
Just to be sure!

RESET T 758 TO FACTORY DEFAULT SETTINGS
Using front panel buttons only, press and hold [SOURCE s ], then press and release [MENU] - “Factory Reset..complete.” is shown in the front panel display.
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post #6976 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
What do you mean no on screen OSD?
I thought most AVRs do upscaling but maybe I was mistaken...thank you
There is an OSD, it's just not the video overlay type. So what he means is the NAD only has audio features. It does not touch the video in any way because it lacks the hardware to do so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
So to be clear:

If I am paying for TIDAL with my NAD and listening to more then just two speakers then I might as well just pay less for Spotify since I won’t hear any sound improvements at 48KHz with DIRAC on???

Am I correct with this?
I'm not a subscriber to Tidal, but isn't there more to it than the sampling rate of the files?

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post #6977 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delija View Post
If Datasat and Theta implementations of Dirac work internally on 96kHz and downsample to 96kHz (no matter how many channels are processed), it's obviously not limited by Dirac software.

I would say Datasat and Theta use better hardware.

We cannot expect that from T758 v3, but we should expect that from M17 v2 and also from Arcam 850 & 860.
So to be clear:

If I am paying for TIDAL with my NAD and listening to more then just two speakers then I might as well just pay less for Spotify since I won’t hear any sound improvements at 48KHz with DIRAC on???

Am I correct with this?
Even with downsampling, Tidal HiFi would still offer 16bit/44khz and Tidal Masters 24bit/48khz, still a jump from 320kbps Spotify.
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post #6978 of 10058 Old 01-16-2019, 11:12 PM
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^^ This. And it's not really downsampling anyway since, as is pointed out, Tidal Hifi streams run at CD quality (44 kHz). Now, if you bought 96 kHz or 192 kHz files from HDTracks or similar, then the effects of downsampling would be in play (assuming they're audible - but the benefits of room correction certainly outweigh any supposed benefits of high resolution recordings).

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
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post #6979 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 01:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KKK101 View Post
Update for the Hum / Buzz noise from the T777v3

NAD Canada has a Solution for the Buzz / Humm Noise. Now i can send my NAD to Repair it. They have found the problem on the Mainboard.
Is is possible to share what they found and what the solution is?

Might help the others
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post #6980 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
So to be clear:

If I am paying for TIDAL with my NAD and listening to more then just two speakers then I might as well just pay less for Spotify since I won’t hear any sound improvements at 48KHz with DIRAC on???

Am I correct with this?
The difference between having Dirac Live and not having Dirac Live will far outweigh the (illusory?) benefits of anything above 48KHz (unless of course you sometimes invite dogs and bats around to enjoy the music ).
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post #6981 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulburner View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
What do you mean no on screen OSD?
I thought most AVRs do upscaling but maybe I was mistaken...thank you
There is an OSD, it's just not the video overlay type. So what he means is the NAD only has audio features. It does not touch the video in any way because it lacks the hardware to do so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
So to be clear:

If I am paying for TIDAL with my NAD and listening to more then just two speakers then I might as well just pay less for Spotify since I won’t hear any sound improvements at 48KHz with DIRAC on???

Am I correct with this?
I'm not a subscriber to Tidal, but isn't there more to it than the sampling rate of the files?
Is it a good thing or bad thing hat the NAD doesn’t touch the video?
I thought the whole point of a AVR is to do video and audio?

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post #6982 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Jakub Hyzyk View Post
Just following up my Nvidia Shield Dolby digital plus issue - I have been in touch with NAD support, and done factory resets a few times as well as updated the shield. Have also changed HDMI cables just in case that was it somehow. Still can't get the 758 to recognize the DD+ stream from netflix or prime on shield. Waiting on further instruction from Nad support.
I`m having the same issue on Netflix/Prime. It seem like this is something between Nvidia Shield and NAD, because my former Xiaomi MIbox3 (also AndroidTV) recognized DD+ on Netflix (Prime is not available for Mibox3). Hope that both Nad and Nvidia find what is happen!
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post #6983 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:13 AM
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iMac Mini or other Mac used for DIRAC?

Hey all-I have heard lots of people say they use a laptop for DIRAC calibration...I don’t have a laptop but I will have a iMac mini in a couple days as well as a umik. Can I drag that with the monitor into the media room with the NAD to do the Dirac calibration?

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post #6984 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
Is it a good thing or bad thing hat the NAD doesn’t touch the video?
I thought the whole point of a AVR is to do video and audio?
I think it's a good thing. The AVR simply needs to be able to pass video from the selected source and otherwise not touch the video stream IMO. As far as video processing, your media players and display devices both have that processing built in, making such processing in the AVR redundant. Higher end AVRs (read: more expensive than the T758) may employ a chip that does better video processing than your sources or display can do, in which case there could be an advantage.

The biggest downside to not having video processing in the AVR is that it can't overlay on-screen displays on top of an image. Doesn't bother me much, but can be a problem for some.

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Transducers: Revel Concerta2 F36 (3), M16 (4); Tannoy AMS 6DC (4); Rythmik F18 (2)
Front end: NAD T758 v3; Outlaw Model 7125
Sources: Panasonic UB820; Oppo BDP-103; Toshiba HD-A2
Projection: JVC DLA-RS440; Seymour CenterStage UF retractable 110" 2.35:1

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post #6985 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
Hey all-I have heard lots of people say they use a laptop for DIRAC calibration...I don’t have a laptop but I will have a iMac mini in a couple days as well as a umik. Can I drag that with the monitor into the media room with the NAD to do the Dirac calibration?
You no longer need a laptop, you can use the dirac live app on a phone or tablet. But you need to use the pack in mic.

Last edited by mike911; 01-17-2019 at 09:40 AM.
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post #6986 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:46 AM
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You no longer need a laptop, you can use the dirac live app on a phone or tablet. But you need to use the pack in mic.
Is it accurate to use dirac live app over the phone/tablet same as using a computer/laptop?
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post #6987 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Paopawdecarabao View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike911 View Post
You no longer need a laptop, you can use the dirac live app on a phone or tablet. But you need to use the pack in mic.
Is it accurate to use dirac live app over the phone/tablet same as using a computer/laptop?
It should make no difference. If I am not mistaken all calculations are done by dirac servers, the tablet or computer acts as user interface only.
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post #6988 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
My understanding is that the downsampling is required, by or caused by, Dirac Live, not by the hardware. So whether you are talking about a reasonably-priced 758 or a considerably more expensive M17, it doesn’t make a difference. The MiniDSP 88A that I am using also is restricted to 48KHz.

Actually Dirac in itself can operate at any sampling rate. In the end it needs to be implemented somewhere however and increasing the sample rate is a fairly expensive operation in terms of computational power.

Warning: My posts might be biased even if in good faith, I work for Dirac Research :-)
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post #6989 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Delija View Post
If Datasat and Theta implementations of Dirac work internally on 96kHz and downsample to 96kHz (no matter how many channels are processed), it's obviously not limited by Dirac software.

I would say Datasat and Theta use better hardware.

We cannot expect that from T758 v3, but we should expect that from M17 v2 and also from Arcam 850 & 860.



I have an old install of the Pc version of Dirac live, there you can go up to 192Khz....
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post #6990 of 10058 Old 01-17-2019, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Johan b-lund View Post
I have an old install of the Pc version of Dirac live, there you can go up to 192Khz....
Which is 96kHz per channel!
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