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post #11641 of 12079 Old 05-02-2020, 12:39 PM
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Yes, my fans run when using external amps. It's programmed to, for some reason.
That's odd. I didn't get it. Figured if there was less or no load on the amp, there would be less heat. I haven't tried it in a while. Perhaps it's been fixed in a firmware?

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post #11642 of 12079 Old 05-02-2020, 02:49 PM
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Does this receiver support Dolby Vision passthrough?
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post #11643 of 12079 Old 05-02-2020, 03:20 PM
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Does this receiver support Dolby Vision passthrough?

Yes
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post #11644 of 12079 Old 05-03-2020, 04:52 AM
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Yes, the "Rhye distortion" is happening before the signal is reaching the amps/preamp outputs. The distortion issue you are seeing is obviously something different.
Which hopefully means NAD can fix the "Rhye" issue with a software release. I do use external amps on the mains which explains why I couldn't hear this other new distortion. I must say I have never heard the fan.

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post #11645 of 12079 Old 05-03-2020, 04:55 AM
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Is there anybody that has used one of their DIRAC slots for single seat/narrow one person measurement and other slots for wider dispersion, long couch/multiple people measurement and did you notice a big difference at the MLP between the two?
Nope. Let us know if you try it.

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post #11646 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 03:22 AM
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Hi,

I need your help. My setup is a Goldenear SuperSat50 ( left and right ) with the big reference center, Sub is the Supersub X and the rare speakers along with the atmos ones are supersat 3 ( setup is 5.1.2 ) we wont be upgrading. We only use it for Movies. its in our lounge and never listen to the movie at high volumes.

I have an option to buy the following 3 receivers for around the same price :

- NAD T 758 V3
- Marantz 7013
- Marantz 6014
- Denon X3600
- Yamaha RX-A2080

I have used Marantz before and i really liked the Audyssey dynamic EQ, Makes my surround/Atmos speakers come alive at low volumes.

Which one would you think i should go for?

( All the extra features and HDMI I/O is not important at all ), Just sound quality for movies and surround effects.

Thank you.
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post #11647 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 03:28 AM
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Originally Posted by hemo cave View Post
Hi,

I need your help. My setup is a Goldenear SuperSat50 ( left and right ) with the big reference center, Sub is the Supersub X and the rare speakers along with the atmos ones are supersat 3 ( setup is 5.1.2 ) we wont be upgrading. We only use it for Movies. its in our lounge and never listen to the movie at high volumes.

I have an option to buy the following 3 receivers for around the same price :

- NAD T 758 V3
- Marantz 7013
- Marantz 6014
- Denon X3600
- Yamaha RX-A2080

I have used Marantz before and i really liked the Audyssey dynamic EQ, Makes my surround/Atmos speakers come alive at low volumes.

Which one would you think i should go for?

( All the extra features and HDMI I/O is not important at all ), Just sound quality for movies and surround effects.

Thank you.
The Denon measured excellent: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-review.12676/
If you want to experiment with room correction then the NAD 758 v3.
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post #11648 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 05:37 AM
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... but if you do not listen at reference volume levels, measurements mean almost nothing. The NAD measured very, very bad on that page. Nonetheless, it sounds sooo much better than it's predecessor, a Denon 3500 with XT32. Dirac Live is miles ahead if you ask me. Bass response, sound imaging and overall homogeneity is just great. DynEQ or something similar does not exist but I did never felt I would need it in contrast to the Denon which sounded dull and lifeless without.
The NAD has it's flaws e.g. HDMI handshake issues but I can live with it doe to the sound which I just love!
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post #11649 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:06 AM
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But is Dirac so much better than XT32? Would we be able to distinguish a proper calibration using both tools?

Or is XT32 trickier to use, thus a regular user will have worst results, while with Dirac its easier to achieve a better result?
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post #11650 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by hemo cave View Post
Hi,

I need your help. My setup is a Goldenear SuperSat50 ( left and right ) with the big reference center, Sub is the Supersub X and the rare speakers along with the atmos ones are supersat 3 ( setup is 5.1.2 ) we wont be upgrading. We only use it for Movies. its in our lounge and never listen to the movie at high volumes.

I have an option to buy the following 3 receivers for around the same price :

- NAD T 758 V3
- Marantz 7013
- Marantz 6014
- Denon X3600
- Yamaha RX-A2080

I have used Marantz before and i really liked the Audyssey dynamic EQ, Makes my surround/Atmos speakers come alive at low volumes.

Which one would you think i should go for?

( All the extra features and HDMI I/O is not important at all ), Just sound quality for movies and surround effects.

Thank you.
I missed DEQ as well but the Dirac soundstage is better. With some apps you can pump the surrounds if needed after Dirac Calibration. You "should" be able to bump the surround/tops with the curves in Dirac. It's technically not advised but if you like augmented surrounds that may work.



That did not work with version 2.2 and below but perhaps 2.5.3 will have corrected that issue.

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post #11651 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:43 AM
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But is Dirac so much better than XT32? Would we be able to distinguish a proper calibration using both tools?

Or is XT32 trickier to use, thus a regular user will have worst results, while with Dirac its easier to achieve a better result?
I would say yes! XT32 is also good at flattening bass response. But Dirac gives such a huge benefit when it comes to precisely defining the sound stage in a regular room. Each instrument can precisely be localised not only horizontally but also in the distance. Everything seems to be 3D whereas with XT32 the sound was sticking to the speakers.
An it’s the other way round. XT32 is so much easier to use in contrast to Dirac. But once you know what to do, it is pretty easy to get good results.
I would prefer the NAD with all its flaws over Denons in a blink of an eye.
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post #11652 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:58 AM
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You "should" be able to bump the surround/tops with the curves in Dirac. It's technically not advised but if you like augmented surrounds that may work.



That did not work with version 2.2 and below but perhaps 2.5.3 will have corrected that issue.
No it did not and it never will be "corrected" as DL filters are located downstream of bass management. Channel levels need to be raised upstream of bass management if the listener is unhappy with how the recording was mixed.

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post #11653 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 09:01 AM
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Without measures, i don't even trust my own ears
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post #11654 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 09:07 AM
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An it’s the other way round. XT32 is so much easier to use in contrast to Dirac.
True. Audyssey MultEQ is virtually foolproof. Dirac Live is way more difficult to learn. It's a pity that Dirac didn't take the chance to improve usability in version 2 when they started rewriting the app some years ago.

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That's odd. I didn't get it. Figured if there was less or no load on the amp, there would be less heat. I haven't tried it in a while. Perhaps it's been fixed in a firmware?
NAD support has informed me: "Please know that the amplifier and preout stage are engineered in series so they must work in tandem. Even if only the preouts - or headphone jack - are used the amplifier will remain active."
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post #11656 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by tjcinnamon View Post
You "should" be able to bump the surround/tops with the curves in Dirac. It's technically not advised but if you like augmented surrounds that may work.



That did not work with version 2.2 and below but perhaps 2.5.3 will have corrected that issue.
No it did not and it never will be "corrected" as DL filters are located downstream of bass management. Channel levels need to be raised upstream of bass management if the listener is unhappy with how the recording was mixed.
@markus767 I know increasing the height channels should not work and haven’t been corrected BUT I have twice (including last week) added 2 slots to my NAD of DIRAC filters that are the same (roomfeel) except that in the second slot I have added a 5dB increase in the height channels but following the same curve.

I toggle them back and forth with both movies, tv and Music and it is significantly louder and more noticeable in my ceiling speakers when the roomfeel with a 5dB height increase is playing vs the regular roomfeel.

It is not placebo and it is not subtle. The volume is noticeably louder when in MLP and with ears close to the speakers in ceiling when toggling.

How is this possible if what you say is true?

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post #11657 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 08:04 PM
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Is there anybody that has used one of their DIRAC slots for single seat/narrow one person measurement and other slots for wider dispersion, long couch/multiple people measurement and did you notice a big difference at the MLP between the two?
Nope. Let us know if you try it.

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I am amazed that out of all the Dirac users no one on this forum has directly compared the single seat to the wife couch corrections to see if there is much difference in the same room at the MLP.

I will get to it eventually to find out...just didn’t think I’d be the first after this long of the receiver being sold

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post #11658 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 10:29 PM
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I am amazed that out of all the Dirac users no one on this forum has directly compared the single seat to the wife couch corrections to see if there is much difference in the same room at the MLP.

I will get to it eventually to find out...just didn’t think I’d be the first after this long of the receiver being sold
I did it!

The difference was noticeable. My default measurement is "Sofa narrow" and I compared it against "Chair". The latter was significantly closer to the sound without Dirac. It almost sounded like Audyssey XT32 limited to approx. 500 hz correction. Bass response was tight but the sound stage was not that good. Sound was sticking to the speakers and there was no depth in the sound stage. "Sofa narrow" produces the great sound stage I so much love. Sound was natural and kept the characteristics of my speakers while broadening sound stage and giving it a certain depth. Every instrument can clearly be localized. It may be that in a very good listening environment "Chair" is closer to the "original" sound but in my typical L-shaped living room "Sofa narrow" is a significant benefit!
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post #11659 of 12079 Old 05-04-2020, 10:50 PM
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@markus767 I know increasing the height channels should not work and haven’t been corrected BUT I have twice (including last week) added 2 slots to my NAD of DIRAC filters that are the same (roomfeel) except that in the second slot I have added a 5dB increase in the height channels but following the same curve.

I toggle them back and forth with both movies, tv and Music and it is significantly louder and more noticeable in my ceiling speakers when the roomfeel with a 5dB height increase is playing vs the regular roomfeel.

It is not placebo and it is not subtle. The volume is noticeably louder when in MLP and with ears close to the speakers in ceiling when toggling.

How is this possible if what you say is true?
I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
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post #11660 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 06:14 AM
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So time for my first post here on this forum after many hours of reading.

I've just pushed the order button for a T58 V3 here in Sweden since I found a good deal. This thread and all of it's contributors have been a good help in the decision making.
I'm hoping that it will be a good step-up from my Denon AVR-2310 that I have hade since 2009. Even though I don't have Atmos or 4K and still are running a 5.1 setup.
Hopes are that it will arrive before the weekend so I have some time setting it up while the kids are away. Already have my Umik-1 and put in a order fur a USB to Ethernet adapter which I hope will work.

I'm will be sure to follow the Dirac guide provided by @markus767

In the meantime I just wanted to thank you all for your efforts being put in to this thread i'ts been a great read so far!
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post #11661 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 10:33 AM
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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
I think with the tiny amount of bass sent to those channels it may not have much an impact.

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post #11662 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 10:38 AM
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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
I think with the tiny amount of bass sent to those channels it may not have much an impact.
It has an impact. Let’s say your crossover is 100 hz for the speakers. That means that bass Is being played by the sub with its individual target curve. If you now raise the target curve of the speakers, everything below 100 hz will not be loud enough and sound will become thinner.

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post #11663 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 11:02 AM
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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
It's also problematic because Dirac will often adjust channel levels to counter the changes you made to the curve. It looks infinitely tweakable, but that is an illusion created by the UI.

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post #11664 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 11:13 AM
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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
It's also problematic because Dirac will often adjust channel levels to counter the changes you made to the curve. It looks infinitely tweakable, but that is an illusion created by the UI.
Not with latest version anymore. After adjusting target curve the volumes are not changed for compensation anymore.
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post #11665 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 11:17 AM
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It's also problematic because Dirac will often adjust channel levels to counter the changes you made to the curve. It looks infinitely tweakable, but that is an illusion created by the UI.
That behavior was fixed in 2.5.2. See https://mehlau.net/audio/dirac-live-2/
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post #11666 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 11:40 AM
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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
It's also problematic because Dirac will often adjust channel levels to counter the changes you made to the curve. It looks infinitely tweakable, but that is an illusion created by the UI.
I have not found this to be a problem as switching between the 5dB louder is significantly louder in the ceiling speakers then the regular unedited curve. So I’m not sure that Dirac has corrected the levels as you say

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I never said that "increasing the height channels should not work". It will, just the redirected low frequencies going to the sub won't be raised by the same amount because they follow a different target curve. And that's why I don't recommend raising speaker levels with the target curve.
I think with the tiny amount of bass sent to those channels it may not have much an impact.
It has an impact. Let’s say your crossover is 100 hz for the speakers. That means that bass Is being played by the sub with its individual target curve. If you now raise the target curve of the speakers, everything below 100 hz will not be loud enough and sound will become thinner.
I have my crossover at 80 and don’t find this to be an issue at all...YMMV

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post #11668 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
I have not found this to be a problem as switching between the 5dB louder is significantly louder in the ceiling speakers then the regular unedited curve. So I’m not sure that Dirac has corrected the levels as you say

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post #11669 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 12:46 PM
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for tops, I would not mind that curve. They will send little to LFE.

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post #11670 of 12079 Old 05-05-2020, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
I have not found this to be a problem as switching between the 5dB louder is significantly louder in the ceiling speakers then the regular unedited curve. So I’m not sure that Dirac has corrected the levels as you say
No offense meant but I don't think you really understand what I have been trying to describe in numerous posts. So I give up for now and post the signal flow chart once again. It really doesn't get clearer or easier than that:



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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
I have my crossover at 80 and don’t find this to be an issue at all...YMMV
That's great you don't find that to be an issue but it doesn't change the fact that redirected bass from your raised speakers isn't raised by the same amount.
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