StormAudio I.ISP 3D.16.12 16-Channel Integrated AV Processor Hands-On - Page 24 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #691 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by rblnr View Post
In Theta speak, I'd consider the 'stock' output stages shipped in the ISPs to be Premium. The new 4 channel would likely be considered Superior or Extreme in Thetaspeak.
So, the "Premium" output stage is audibly defective, requiring money and upgrades to be actually transparent to the source?

Last edited by RUR; 05-22-2019 at 06:24 PM. Reason: output stage, not DAC
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post #692 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
So, the "Premium" DACs are audibly defective, requiring money and upgrades to be actually transparent to the source?
Sure, if you believe there's either defective or correct in terms of sound -- everything competently designed sounds the same -- you're right.

Really, what's the purpose of your post in this forum?
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post #693 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by rblnr View Post
BTW, there's new beta firmware out; the most significant upgrade is visualization of EQ curves created for any channel, and for all the channels overlayed. This is very useful readout for those using the extensive EQ abilities of the piece. Further, you can import filters created in REW. Some other updates as well. The platform keeps getting better.


How can we access this firmware ? I don’t find any firmware on their website

Thanks


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post #694 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
So, the "Premium" DACs are audibly defective, requiring money and upgrades to be actually transparent to the source?
What a weird, silly thing to say ! No they are not obviously defective ! 🙄🙄 Storm ISP Elite PrePro sounds terrific !
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post #695 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 06:21 PM
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Many of us (including myself) enjoy spec sheet porn. Some more than others (like those who won't ever consider anything PC-based or with SMPS for example). The fact that the StormAudio platform is DSP not PC -based is relevant to some "audiophiles". However, on paper the StormAudio is simply ho-hum in terms of dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratio. All processing (even Dirac off) is done at 48kHz.

All of this may or may not be audible. But premium options surely won't be worse. Why leave any performance on the table? I believe more "audiophiles" will jump on this bandwagon if the following is delivered:
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass
• ≥96kHz processing for 2ch audio
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post #696 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Apgood View Post
I noticed that the I.ISP is no longer on StormAudio's product page. Anyone know why that is?
Perhaps it will be sold exclusively as the Focal Astral 16 moving forward?
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post #697 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Many of us (including myself) enjoy spec sheet porn. Some more than others (like those who won't ever consider anything PC-based or with SMPS for example). The fact that the StormAudio platform is DSP not PC -based is relevant to some "audiophiles". However, on paper the StormAudio is simply ho-hum in terms of dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratio. All processing (even Dirac off) is done at 48kHz.

All of this may or may not be audible. But premium options surely won't be worse. Why leave any performance on the table? I believe more "audiophiles" will jump on this bandwagon if the following is delivered:
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass
• ≥96kHz processing for 2ch audio
Storm sounds incredible, better than most PrePros that process at 96Kz. Tells you that there is a lot to how a PrePro is implemented and what makes one sound better than another, and I am sure they can make it even better ! There is always better.
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post #698 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Many of us (including myself) enjoy spec sheet porn. Some more than others (like those who won't ever consider anything PC-based or with SMPS for example). The fact that the StormAudio platform is DSP not PC -based is relevant to some "audiophiles". However, on paper the StormAudio is simply ho-hum in terms of dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratio. All processing (even Dirac off) is done at 48kHz.

All of this may or may not be audible. But premium options surely won't be worse. Why leave any performance on the table? I believe more "audiophiles" will jump on this bandwagon if the following is delivered:
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass
• ≥96kHz processing for 2ch audio
Curious of your thoughts re the noise floor/signal to noise ratio on the SP4. I know a very respected calibrator who has informed me the noise floor is quite high on the Storm units. Even if this is the case, wondering if the Bryston units have a lower noise floor.
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post #699 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 11:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Many of us (including myself) enjoy spec sheet porn. Some more than others (like those who won't ever consider anything PC-based or with SMPS for example). The fact that the StormAudio platform is DSP not PC -based is relevant to some "audiophiles". However, on paper the StormAudio is simply ho-hum in terms of dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratio. All processing (even Dirac off) is done at 48kHz.

All of this may or may not be audible. But premium options surely won't be worse. Why leave any performance on the table? I believe more "audiophiles" will jump on this bandwagon if the following is delivered:
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass
• ≥96kHz processing for 2ch audio
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass = I would have purchased this last year sight unseen. I don't care about the high end DAC as my preference is to upgrade the individual component as technology progresses, but the analog bypass and xlr would be a game changer.

I ended up with a trinnov 32 (I'll never ever use that many channels, but it does what I want).

This storm processor is buttugly, but I guess ... perhaps the next gen they'll add the above mentioned and make the face attractive. LED screens are cheap .. the entire front sound be a beautiful OLED panel.

As it turns out - almost moments after I purchased the trinnov our central ac took a dookie.. and had to shell out another 18k!

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post #700 of 844 Old 05-22-2019, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by G-Rex View Post
Curious of your thoughts re the noise floor/signal to noise ratio on the SP4. I know a very respected calibrator who has informed me the noise floor is quite high on the Storm units. Even if this is the case, wondering if the Bryston units have a lower noise floor.

SP4 is Storm equivalent- and there should be no difference in measurements IMHO.
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post #701 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 12:40 AM
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SP4 is Storm equivalent- and there should be no difference in measurements IMHO.
Perhaps, but from what I have been told from a Bryston dealer, it is not a 100% identical hardware clone of the Storm, (nor is the MX160 an identical hardware clone of the MP-50.).
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post #702 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 01:58 AM
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I can say from experience, the Storm more reliable than Trinnov and sounds better, that's why I pushed the Trinnov aside. The Storm has a background noise like Datasat not hearing from the listening position, with 4-XLR the noise is gone. Please write the suggestions / improvements to StormAudio.
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post #703 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Many of us (including myself) enjoy spec sheet porn. Some more than others (like those who won't ever consider anything PC-based or with SMPS for example). The fact that the StormAudio platform is DSP not PC -based is relevant to some "audiophiles". However, on paper the StormAudio is simply ho-hum in terms of dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratio. All processing (even Dirac off) is done at 48kHz.

All of this may or may not be audible. But premium options surely won't be worse. Why leave any performance on the table? I believe more "audiophiles" will jump on this bandwagon if the following is delivered:
• A XLR-2 in and XLR-2 out with high end DACs and analog bypass
• ≥96kHz processing for 2ch audio

Marc,

As you are aware, I am one of those “audiophile” types you are talking about. Unless the Bryston SP has made some improvements relative to earlier concerns that I have for this platform that were reported to me (i.e. noise), I will be passing for a forthcoming SP that appears to check all the boxes. All I can say at this time is, not all info posted on this and a related thread is entirely accurate. Exciting times ahead.

I am sure the Storm, Bryston and Focal SPs are formidable processors that sound great, and as tempted as I am to jump in at this time to one of these DSP based units, I will likely hold off.
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post #704 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I can say from experience, the Storm more reliable than Trinnov and sounds better, that's why I pushed the Trinnov aside. The Storm has a background noise like Datasat not hearing from the listening position, with 4-XLR the noise is gone. Please write the suggestions / improvements to StormAudio.
Can you expand on what “more reliable” and “sounds better” than Trinnov mean? Did you own an Altitude or are you on the dealer side and referring to a showroom environment? Curious what your experience was...

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post #705 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 08:14 AM
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Perhaps, but from what I have been told from a Bryston dealer, it is not a 100% identical hardware clone of the Storm, (nor is the MX160 an identical hardware clone of the MP-50.).

Your dealer is wrong/mistaken- it is 100% identical HW from Storm with minor SW differences (as told by Bryston folks to me).


Edit- this cannot stop 'audiophools' from hearing differences between two similar models like Lex/Oppo bluray player or discover differences between Bryston SP3 and JBL SDP45/Lex MC14 as well
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post #706 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 08:53 AM
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Perhaps, but from what I have been told from a Bryston dealer, it is not a 100% identical hardware clone of the Storm, (nor is the MX160 an identical hardware clone of the MP-50.).
I think the MX160 has enough different components that it can't be considered a rebadge, like the Storm.

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post #707 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Kishore View Post
Your dealer is wrong/mistaken- it is 100% identical HW from Storm with minor SW differences (as told by Bryston folks to me).


Edit- this cannot stop 'audiophools' from hearing differences between two similar models like Lex/Oppo bluray player or discover differences between Bryston SP3 and JBL SDP45/Lex MC14 as well

This is the info I've gotten from Storm as well. It's the same piece.

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post #708 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by G-Rex View Post
Curious of your thoughts re the noise floor/signal to noise ratio on the SP4. I know a very respected calibrator who has informed me the noise floor is quite high on the Storm units. Even if this is the case, wondering if the Bryston units have a lower noise floor.
I will definitely be paying attention to the noise floor. I'll be comparing directly to the Lyngdorf MP-50 which is dead silent (up until +6dB main volume). My speakers are very sensitive: mains (close to 100dB), surrounds (92dB), in-ceiling (89dB). Audible noise (all we should be worried about) is unbearable to me as the slightest noise becomes obvious with 15 speakers.

I have listened in Starke Sound's demo room several times. Their speakers are 92dB sensitive (7.1.4). I have never noticed any noise (StormAudio ISP, A7mk2 amplifiers). Their room is much larger [and better acoustically… like, perfect!] than mine though.
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post #709 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 10:02 AM
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I was running a 7.2.6 with the SP4 with Magico A3s, Revel center, and Wisdom Sage (bit of speaker craziness) driven by ATI 52 and 54 series amps. System was dead silent.


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post #710 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 10:23 AM
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My Scaena mains are in the mid 90s and Persona C is at 93db. Silent. No noise issues w/any client's systems either.

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post #711 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by rblnr View Post
This is the info I've gotten from Storm as well. It's the same piece.
That’s good to know. I have not heard the Storm platform as yet, but look forward to at some point.
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post #712 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 11:32 AM
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Specifications: Dynamic Range (rated output level)
Lyngdorf MP-50 120dB (16dBu/5Vrms)
Trinnov A32 118dB (18dbU/6Vrms)
StormAudio ISP 112dB (21dBu)
Acurus ACT4 >110dB (A-wt) (19dBu/7Vrms)
Marantz AV8805 105 (A-wt) (10dBu/2.5V)

Normalized to +4dBu (XLR home audio std)
Lyngdorf MP-50 108dB
Trinnov A32 104dB
StormAudio ISP 95dB
Acurus ACT4 >95dB(A-wt)
Marantz AV8805 99dB (A-wt)

I can see why someone may scoff at the StormAudio and Acurus noise floors.
Luckily for me, I can dial down the XLR input sensitivity (of my active mains) from +4dBu to +21dBu to maximize the gain structure & dynamic range of the higher end SSPs. The noise floor of the Bryston with my mains should be of concern to me as it will be inaudible. My surround amplifiers' input sensitivity 7.5dBu.

A 95dB dynamic range should be more than sufficient as very few [if any] of us have in-room noise floors under 20dB.
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I just got a great offer on the SP4 from my dealer.
One thing that concerns me is the lack of HDR10+ and Dolby Vision support. Is there a software upgrade in the pipeline?
I have to port audio only to the SP4 and going direct to my OLED TV for video content.
I am using the Panny 9000 for source.
The SP4 will be connected to my ATI 527 amp.
Can anyone confirm no HDMI lock-on/handshake problems when video and audio is separated on two HDMI ports at source?

Also, what is the Bryston cost for the Dirac Live license?

And lastly, has Bryston/Storm confirmed upgrade plans for HDMI 2.1 on the SP4?
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Yes... From my experience, input sensitivity/gain mismatch can raise the noise floor to awful levels. Had that happen back when I owned the Lexicon MC12B. The SP in relation to the amp and speaker sensitivity were not ideal, creating an intolerable hiss, which was heard from my seating position.

Hence my concerns re noise floor. Good to hear many are not experiencing this with the Storm platform.
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StormAudio I.ISP 3D.16.12 16-Channel Integrated AV Processor Hands-On

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreman View Post
I just got a great offer on the SP4 from my dealer.

One thing that concerns me is the lack of HDR10+ and Dolby Vision support. Is there a software upgrade in the pipeline?

I have to port audio only to the SP4 and going direct to my OLED TV for video content.

I am using the Panny 9000 for source.

The SP4 will be connected to my ATI 527 amp.

Can anyone confirm no HDMI lock-on/handshake problems when video and audio is separated on two HDMI ports at source?



Also, what is the Bryston cost for the Dirac Live license?



And lastly, has Bryston/Storm confirmed upgrade plans for HDMI 2.1 on the SP4?


I was splitting video and audio running video to a Lumagen Pro so I cannot speak to video switching but I ran all audio to SP4 and it was flawless. No dropouts whatsoever and always properly switched to correct audio format. Dirac 2.0 should be included with the unit and is accessed by downloading from Dirac website not the Bryston site. That firmware is no longer used. Once the Dirac software sees the SP4 on the same local network it will interface.

Don’t quote me in this, but although not stated, I believe the SP4 does pass DV.

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post #716 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreman View Post
I just got a great offer on the SP4 from my dealer.
One thing that concerns me is the lack of HDR10+ and Dolby Vision support. Is there a software upgrade in the pipeline?
I have to port audio only to the SP4 and going direct to my OLED TV for video content.
Why do you care about HDR10+? Panasonic OLED? I believe Dolby Vision to LG/Vizio/TCL already works (see the Secrets review). I can test to an LG OLED if you'd like. Sony (low-latency DV) is still in the works I believe.
Quote:
I am using the Panny 9000 for source.
The SP4 will be connected to my ATI 527 amp.
Can anyone confirm no HDMI lock-on/handshake problems when video and audio is separated on two HDMI ports at source?
This is the preferred method of connection for most. Especially those with projectors (Lumagen). There should be zero issues with this method as blanked 1080p60 is sent to the SSP.
Quote:
And lastly, has Bryston/Storm confirmed upgrade plans for HDMI 2.1 on the SP4?
In development according to Bryston.
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From my experience, input sensitivity/gain mismatch can raise the noise floor to awful levels. Had that happen back when I owned the Lexicon MC12B.
What amplification are you utilizing?

What SSP do you have your eyes on rather than the Bryston/StormAudio?
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post #717 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 01:46 PM
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@Marc Alexander ;
When do you think you will be able to revert with your first impressions on the SP4?
I need some convincing purchase advice

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post #718 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreman View Post
@Marc Alexander ;

When do you think you will be able to revert with your first impressions on the SP4?

I need some convincing purchase advice

I tried to pickup the unit from FedEx today but they said it won't be unloaded until after-hours. Do you want to call me over the w/e?

I do have prior experience with the Storm at Starke Sound. The web interface & flexibility is really what won me over. The sound is excellent but not noticeably better or worse than Lyngdorf or Trinnov. (Atmos music listened to at Starke and JTR: The Greatest Showman, La La Land, Hans Zimmer and Bohemian Rhapsody.)

I haven't listened at all in 2ch yet but I have confidence that Bryston will have an upgrade available if I find the 2ch performance lacking (I prefer 2ch to upmixing in most cases on the Lyngdorf). I actually prefer engaging the wides (copying mains but attenuated) to most upmixing. Lyngdorf makes the task of mapping in the wides (copy/matrix) then switching back to discrete decoding unecessarily arduous (requires a full reboot and a separate RoomPerfect instance).

I will have to dust my iPad off and try the IOS app. I'm getting a Harmony Elite setup & ready as well. Bryston isn't in their databass but STORMAUDIO ISP.3D.16 is.
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post #719 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 02:32 PM
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Stuart, my only critcism of the Trinnov (other than cost) is having to reboot it every 24-hours. I really hope they can automize this (or fix the memory leak that makes it necessary).

The StormAudio cannot do what the Trinnov can (3D speaker detection and remapping being #1 IMO), but I believe/hope it will serve my needs 100% over the next decade.
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post #720 of 844 Old 05-23-2019, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Stuart, my only critcism of the Trinnov (other than cost) is having to reboot it every 24-hours. I really hope they can automize this (or fix the memory leak that makes it necessary).

The StormAudio cannot do what the Trinnov can (3D speaker detection and remapping being #1 IMO), but I believe/hope it will serve my needs 100% over the next decade.



The reboot issue isn't that big of a deal:


a) it happens during normal powering off/on of the unit. So unless you leave it on 24/7, it shouldnt be a problem


b) Trinnov has an automated reboot command built into their IP drivers. So if you do leave it on 24/7, you can schedule a reboot time


if you're someone who leaves it on 24/7 *and* don't use a IP control scheme....yeah, you're out of luck a bit.
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