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-   -   Marantz AV8805 15.2 XLR Pre/Pro Official Thread (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/2930176-marantz-av8805-15-2-xlr-pre-pro-official-thread.html)

RetiredandLovingIt 10-19-2019 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sal1950 (Post 58702646)
What inputs have you used?
The turntable if used straight in should get plugged into the Phono-Audio-In jack. Pg 88 of the manual.


The outboard Nobsound phono preamp sould get plugged into a Analog In socket like Media Player #5

Then check the Input Assignment settings, Pg 206, and set the Analog column for Media Player to #5 just like you see on pg 206


Then just choose whichever input you configured with the remote, you should have sound
Good luck

I have a feeling I am not setting up the Analog portion of the Inputs correctly. Will go through the manual again as suggested to see what I can come up with. All of my HDMI Inputs are being used, so I will have to figure out how to assign an Analog signal to that input.

Thank you for the help.

Steve

jdsmoothie 10-19-2019 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetiredandLovingIt (Post 58704062)
With the Phono input selected but nothing connected, I do get a very faint hiss when the Volume it turned up all the way. No luck if the TT is connected to the Phono Input.

I am sure there must be something wrong with the way I have set up the inputs.

Thank you for your help.

Steve

Sal1950 listed the directions required for a proper setup. If still no joy, the issue most likely lies with a defective turntable.

Sal1950 10-19-2019 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetiredandLovingIt (Post 58704062)
With the Phono input selected but nothing connected, I do get a very faint hiss when the Volume it turned up all the way. No luck if the TT is connected to the Phono Input.

I am sure there must be something wrong with the way I have set up the inputs.

Thank you for your help.

Steve

Strange, the phono input is a dedicated input and is not configurable as a assignable input. The only thing I can think of is if you renamed it to another input. See page 208 and maybe "reset defaults". What type of cartridge is in the TT? The phono input will only accept a MM, not a MC.

RetiredandLovingIt 10-19-2019 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sal1950 (Post 58704114)
Strange, the phono input is a dedicated input and is not configurable as a assignable input. The only thing I can think of is if you renamed it to another input. See page 208 and maybe "reset defaults". What type of cartridge is in the TT? The phono input will only accept a MM, not a MC.

The TT is so old I have forgotten what type of cartridge it is. I tried the Phono input again with no luck. However, I have gotten it to work by connecting to the DVD Analog Input and then selecting the Analog Input for the signal. Bad explanation but I am sure you understand. Since the TT did not work with the Phono Input I have a feeling the cartridge must be an MC type. Cartridge is an Audio-Technica TC236EP.

I had previously connected the TT to another Analog Input but did not realize I had to go in and select the type of signal (HDMI/Analog). I thought that when I chose that input that the proper signal would automatically be selected. Know better now.

Thanks to all for their help and suggestions.

Steve

Cleveland Plasma 10-19-2019 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sal1950 (Post 58676658)
And to think $10 for a Monoprice Certified will get you as good a performance as you could ever ask for. ;)

Yep I use some of those myself....

Quote:

Originally Posted by drh3b (Post 58678192)
I guess I could spend almost a million on a watch. Or continue to use the time on my cell phone that is based on an atomic clock. Decisions, decisions.

lol, you are right......

m. zillch 10-19-2019 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetiredandLovingIt (Post 58704062)
With the Phono input selected but nothing connected, I do get a very faint hiss when the Volume it turned up all the way. No luck if the TT is connected to the Phono Input.

I am sure there must be something wrong with the way I have set up the inputs.

Thank you for your help.

Steve

So we know that the internal phono preamp seems to work because it does, as expected, generate hiss when you select that input.

Here's another test but don't start off at a high volume. Start at a normal setting and then gradually increase the volume.

Instead of the turntable, connect a run-of-the-mill stereo RCA analog cable to the Marantz phono input and see if tapping the center pins of the other (exposed) end produces a thump/buzz/hum sound. WARNING: Again, this can be very loud so start off at a low volume and gradually turn the volume knob up while tapping one of the the tips.

mlknez 10-21-2019 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tigerhonaker (Post 58701640)
Click on link below for Full-Specifications,

https://www.us.marantz.com/us/produc...oductid=av8805



Terry

They didn't retroactively change the specs on the AVRs that they did add the feature to via firmware

gsr 10-21-2019 09:44 AM

Do I recall correctly that the AV8805 uses a "quick" switch feature that always keeps the HDMI inputs active to expedite handshakes? If so, is there a way to turn that feature off so that inactive inputs will go off? I've got a Maestro RX from HDFury connected to one of the inputs and it will go into a power save mode if the other end of the connection shuts off and I'd like to be able to take advantage of that.

leboche 10-22-2019 05:53 AM

its possible whit the 8805 to mix xlr cable to rca cable.

thank you for answer.

Leeliemix 10-22-2019 08:18 AM

Marantz AV8805 15.2 XLR Pre/Pro Official Thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by leboche (Post 58715556)
its possible whit the 8805 to mix xlr cable to rca cable.



thank you for answer.



If you mean to use some XLR pre-out and some RCA pre-out then yes, i use XLR for front, center, subs and RCA for surrounds.

m. zillch 10-22-2019 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leboche (Post 58715556)
its possible whit the 8805 to mix xlr cable to rca cable.

The RCA and balanced XLR outs work concurrently but mirror each other only, i.e. they don't have independent settings so as you change one XLR output channel's delay , level, or EQ (or for that matter the master volume of all of them) it alters the equivalent RCA output too. You can use all outputs simultaneously if you wish.

If you are asking if there are adapters which change an XLR to RCA connection the answer is yes, but your signal will no longer have any of the advantages of a balanced connection if you use them. [Using balanced connections at both ends of the journey have better immunity from the signal picking up common mode noise as they travel along the wire, especially useful in long runs.] So you might as well just use the Marantz RCA outs for that application.

gsr 10-22-2019 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsr (Post 58711946)
Do I recall correctly that the AV8805 uses a "quick" switch feature that always keeps the HDMI inputs active to expedite handshakes? If so, is there a way to turn that feature off so that inactive inputs will go off? I've got a Maestro RX from HDFury connected to one of the inputs and it will go into a power save mode if the other end of the connection shuts off and I'd like to be able to take advantage of that.

Anyone?

leboche 10-23-2019 07:36 AM

thank you M.ZILLCH and LEELIEMIX.

avsBuddy 10-30-2019 04:15 PM

Questions for 8805 owners
  • Can processor upscale 5.1 and 7.1 HD Master, DD and DTS etc soundtracks to 5.1.4 Atmos? If it can, how effective is it?
  • I have a 50ft active H9DMI cable running from processor to projector for 4k HDR that works perfectly directly from blu ray player. If I insert Marantz in the middle and have, say 10ft HDMI from player to Marantz, will I still get reliable HDR signal to projector?

DAK 10-30-2019 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avsBuddy (Post 58754754)
Questions for 8805 owners
  • Can processor upscale 5.1 and 7.1 HD Master, DD and DTS etc soundtracks to 5.1.4 Atmos? If it can, how effective is it?
  • I have a 50ft active H9DMI cable running from processor to projector for 4k HDR that works perfectly directly from blu ray player. If I insert Marantz in the middle and have, say 10ft HDMI from player to Marantz, will I still get reliable HDR signal to projector?

  • Yes, very effective.
  • Sure, it's an active cable, so not an issue.

jdsmoothie 10-30-2019 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avsBuddy (Post 58754754)
Questions for 8805 owners
  • Can processor upscale 5.1 and 7.1 HD Master, DD and DTS etc soundtracks to 5.1.4 Atmos? If it can, how effective is it?
  • I have a 50ft active H9DMI cable running from processor to projector for 4k HDR that works perfectly directly from blu ray player. If I insert Marantz in the middle and have, say 10ft HDMI from player to Marantz, will I still get reliable HDR signal to projector?

1. AVR/AVP owners have generally been far more impressed with the Dolby Surround and DTS Neural:X simulators then the actual Atmos/DTS:X audio tracks as the mixers don't often take as much advantage of the height speakers as most would prefer.
2. Unknown. You'll have to give it a go to know for sure as some cables work better than others, not to mention, some active cables of that distance don't work that well at all when connected to an AVR/AVP.

eziggy 10-30-2019 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leeliemix (Post 58628410)
You dont need to place it perfectly over the vent holes, the ac infinity draws air from its bottom and cools the whole top plate and increases air circulation through the 8805, i dont think anyone here who uses one or the ac models has a problem keeping the 8805 cool.
The 8805 runs rather hot even if very well ventilated open on all sides placement, but during winter i do remove the cooler.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I think the temperature sensor is closer to the front of the AC Infinity and the heat generated in the 8805 is at the back of the unity (above the HDMI board). But, as mentioned, it really doesn't matter it will work great regardless.

I have my 8805 in a cabinet with an open back, before the AC Infinity things would get pretty hot in the cabinet and the shelf above. After installing the AC Infinity everything is cool to the touch.

Michaeldef 10-31-2019 09:45 AM

Here is a in depth review of the 8805......https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/...cessor-review/

m. zillch 10-31-2019 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsr (Post 58631264)
Again, you're presenting how the AV8802 works as evidence of how the AV8805 works.

We now have direct evidence the AV8805 does indeed act like the AV8802 with analog XLR signals in Direct mode, as I suspected, thanks to the measurement accompanying this quote from the review linked to above:

"I measured the frequency response of the AV8805 out to 96 kHz. In analog direct, with no processing active, the response is flat out to about 86 kHz and then we see a sharp roll off immediately after that point. "

[bold text emphasis mine]

avsBuddy 10-31-2019 03:15 PM

Is there some kind of debate of AV8805 vs AV8802a that I'm missing? ;)

bigguyca 10-31-2019 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avsBuddy (Post 58759316)
Is there some kind of debate of AV8805 vs AV8802a that I'm missing? ;)


The debate may have been over which color is better: the green HDAM boards in the AV8802 or the black HDAM boards in the AV8805, or some such important topic.

bigguyca 10-31-2019 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leboche (Post 58715556)
its possible whit the 8805 to mix xlr cable to rca cable.

thank you for answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by m. zillch (Post 58716724)
The RCA and balanced XLR outs work concurrently but mirror each other only, i.e. they don't have independent settings so as you change one XLR output channel's delay , level, or EQ (or for that matter the master volume of all of them) it alters the equivalent RCA output too. You can use all outputs simultaneously if you wish.

If you are asking if there are adapters which change an XLR to RCA connection the answer is yes, but your signal will no longer have any of the advantages of a balanced connection if you use them. [Using balanced connections at both ends of the journey have better immunity from the signal picking up common mode noise as they travel along the wire, especially useful in long runs.] So you might as well just use the Marantz RCA outs for that application.


While both the RCA and XLR outputs can be used concurrently in that they will both provide a signal, this is questionable advice, in the case of the AV8805, since concurrent use seriously unbalances the XLR (balanced) connection. Unbalancing the balanced line reduces the noise immunity of the line. It also reduces the ability of a differential amplifier, even if well designed, at the receiving end to remove common mode noise. Use one output or the other for best results.

Also note that the balanced voltage signal will be 6dB (2x) higher than the RCA signal. This may cause problems depending on your use case. For example, if you drive two identical amplifiers that have the same gain, the amplifier with the XLR input will be putting out twice the voltage and four times the power.

gsr 10-31-2019 06:02 PM

^ Agreed. Mixing XLR and RCA connections for different groups of speakers, such as XLR for the front 3 channels and subwoofers and then RCA for everything else is probably a more realistic use case for using both types of outputs. But that will only work well if there’s enough adjustment range available so that all the channel levels can be adjusted to match.

m. zillch 10-31-2019 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigguyca (Post 58759634)
While both the RCA and XLR outputs can be used concurrently in that they will both provide a signal, this is questionable advice, in the case of the AV8805, since concurrent use seriously unbalances the XLR (balanced) connection. Unbalancing the balanced line reduces the noise immunity of the line. It also reduces the ability of a differential amplifier, even if well designed, at the receiving end to remove common mode noise. Use one output or the other for best results.

I disagree there would be any audible degradation in real world, home audio use [under controlled conditions] and Marantz would seem to side with me because nowhere* do they suggest nor warn that the two active outputs can't (or shouldn't) both be used simultaneously on the AV8805, should one want to.

*in their manual, service manual, white papers, nor advertisements for the AV8805

bigguyca 11-01-2019 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m. zillch (Post 58619550)
This flat ultra-sonic response, in cyan, for the XLR analog input on the AV8802 in Analog Direct mode would suggest to me that digitization is not occurring when used this way:
https://hometheaterhifi.com/wp-conte...or-image26.jpg

https://hometheaterhifi.com/wp-conte...or-image26.jpg

[If the link doesn't work, find the image at the review.]

Full review: https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews/...cessor-review/

Usually there is a brick wall drop at half the sampling frequency [aka Nyquist frequency] if digitized, as we see when Audyssey processing is enabled on the same input, in purple.

"I measured the frequency response of the AV8802 out to 96 kHz. In analog direct, the response is flat out to about 50 kHz and then we see a very gradual 5 dB roll-off of the high frequencies. The second plot shows what happens in stereo mode with digital signal processing and Audyssey XT32 enabled. The AV8802 downsamples the signal to 48 kHz and applies any room correction filters for each channel. You can clearly see the inverse of the room correction curve in the plot. The signal then abruptly falls off around 24 kHz. This result isn’t surprising since we’ve seen this same downsampling with the AudysseyXT32 implementation in the AV8801."

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsr (Post 58630308)
Multiple knowledgeable people have said that the XLR inputs do go through A/D and D/A conversions. This would not be the first time that Marantz support provided an answer that is incorrect...


The question of which analog inputs on the AV880X series, and likely the AV770X series, endure an ADC and then DAC process, is long running. The typically accepted answer is the 2nd quote above, which is a very unacceptable answer for many owners and potential owners.

These folks want to use the analog inputs and don't desire added processing that consists of a less than wonderful 8.5dB attenuation and ADC cycle, and then the standard, quite good DAC process. The non-standard DAC reconstruction filter used in at least the AV8805 provides added motivation to avoid this added processing.

My judgement is that the analog inputs, likely both RCA's, and XLR's where present, do not go through the ADC/DAC process in Pure Direct and likely Direct Modes as well. Here is some data and analysis to support this position:

1) The ADC IC in the AV8805, AV8802 and AV7705 is the AKM AK5358B. This ADC is operates at up to a 96kHz sample rate. The datasheet is below. The AK5358 appears to be a non-current part so the datasheet is not directly from AKM:

https://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datash...AK5358BET.html

A 96kHz sample rate means that the AK5358 can only digitize analog signals that have a frequency up to of about 48kHz, the Nyquist frequency. This is significant because in the graph above for the AV8802, and in the similar graph for the AV8805, the frequency range for Analog Direct extends to over 90kHz. This means that the analog input signal did not encounter the 48kHz frequency limits of the ADC/DAC process.

A 192kHz sample rate and 96kHz analog frequency are the ADC limits for the Lynx Two sound card used in the review. Those limits are why the frequency response in the for the Analog Direct input drops off after 90kHz. Unfortunately the reviewer doesn't understand this fact and attributes the roll off to the performance of the AV8802/AV8805. There are other issues with the review and the associated analysis of volume controls by Rich, but those are lengthy topics for another time.

2) The hardware design of the AV8805 allows for any of the analog inputs to travel through the unit to the outputs without ADC/DAC processing.

3) Item 1 in the Audio system confirmation items in the AV8805 service manual is to confirm the analog path using Sound mode: DIRECT

The associated fig.A01 shows all of the analog inputs proceeding through the AV8805 without an ADC/DAC process.

3a) Item 6 in the Audio system confirmation items in the AV8805 service manual is to confirm the analog path using Sound Mode: Analog.

Associated fig.A06a and fig.A06b show all of the analog inputs proceeding through the AV8805 and using ADC/DAC process.

- Since ADC/DAC and non-ADC/DAC paths are tested (items 3 and 3a) there is a valid argument that both paths are used.

4) The measurements for Analog Input in the review are much better than would be expected based on the datasheet above for the AV5358. The opamps used to implement the 8.5dB attenuation also have lessor specifications than the test results for the AV8805. The datasheet for these opamps, the NJM2115m is linked below. See especially the distortion measurements on page 4.

https://www.njr.com/semicon/PDF/NJM2115_E.pdf


- Please comment on the above or provide additional input. -

happythanh 11-06-2019 10:17 PM

hello all,

I just upgraded from Onky PR-SC5530 to this 8805 and quite happy with it, my system is oppo 203, JVC RS640, I wonder if 8805 has video processor for 4K, if it only passthrough, should I direct the 4K video signal from oppo 203 to projector to avoid any video deterioration? how is your setup?

audiofan1 11-06-2019 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by happythanh (Post 58786606)
hello all,

I just upgraded from Onky PR-SC5530 to this 8805 and quite happy with it, my system is oppo 203, JVC RS640, I wonder if 8805 has video processor for 4K, if it only passthrough, should I direct the 4K video signal from oppo 203 to projector to avoid any video deterioration? how is your setup?

Dial in your settings in the Oppo and set the 8805 to enhanced for 4k the ip scaler set to off and conversion set to on and enjoy;)

And congrats on the 8805 welcome to the lounge:)

jdsmoothie 11-07-2019 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pappaduke (Post 58786910)
Subject
Marantz 2016 app not working correctly

Response By Email (NJ Customer Support) (11/06/2019 02:42 PM)
Hi,

We are aware of the App issue when using iOS 13.2 or iOS 3.3.0. Our Engineering team is currently working on a fix and should have it released very soon. We apologize for the inconvenience and hope to have this corrected shortly.

In the meantime, the Apps are working with the Android platform or any iOS device not updated to 13.2 or 3.3.0.

Thanks,
Marantz NA

..

Dave-T 11-12-2019 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdsmoothie (Post 58786962)
..

it was fixed yesterday with an update. I am running 13.2.2 IOS

jch2 11-12-2019 09:54 AM

I have three 6.1 setups in my house (great room, basement, and master bedroom). I just upgraded the great room to 7.2.8 (7.2.6 + CH + VoG), and used the "unified layout" for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X, and Auro3D recommended by Denon & Marantz (D+M) as supported by the Denon AVR-X8500H and Marantz AV8805.

My current great room equipment:
1) Speakers: Definitive Technology BP2000 mains, CLR2000 center, Di 5.5BPS surrounds and surround backs, UIW BPZ/A heights and CH, and Di 8R TM and VoG. Most of this is older DT stuff (late 1990s) that is better than anything they've made since. I really love the way the bipolar speakers sound and make the walls and ceiling vanish into a huge open soundfield.
2) Subwoofers: Two M&K MX-100 subwoofers, but plan on upgrading those next (probably first going to try a pair of sealed Denovo flat packs and Dayton UM18-22s, and go from there).
3) Receiver/Amps: Yamaha RX-A3070 (9 internal amps, could add two more amp channels for max 7.2.4).
4) Displays: LG C8 65" TV and Epson 5050UB projector (just upgraded from Panasonic PT-AE8000U which is headed to the basement). Screen is a motorized 120" Stewart Filmscreen Greyhawk from 2004.
5) Sources: Panasonic UB820 BD, DISH Hopper 3, Apple TV 4k, Fire TV Stick 4k, Chromecast Ultra
6) Power: Monster Power HTPS MkII

I was hoping by now the sub $8k 16-channel prepro surge would be well underway and a winner would have emerged. I was also hoping something with Dirac and HDMI 2.1 would have shown up by now, but looks like not yet. So, I'm still in a holding pattern. But, I'd like to prepare for that and fill the gap temporarily with something I can live with until a viable 16 channel processor is available.

I have a UMIK-1 and REW and regularly measure and tune.

I've been reading for months, and have narrowed down the field to a few options to get to 15 channels of amplification for bed+heights and amps for 2-4 subs.

Here are my thoughts on options:

1) Get a Denon AVR-X8500H and wait a couple years to see what shakes out for 16 channel processors and 15 channel amps. I can defer the amp purchase until I really need it, and retask the Denon to the basement or master bedroom when I do.

Or, get a Marantz AV8805 (I can get a great deal on it) and wait a couple of years until a 16-channel processor is available, and also get some amps that I would probably keep when I swap out to a 16-channel processor in a few years. So, here are my thoughts on amps:

2) maybe some good proven inexpensive starter amps that I might keep or resell and upgrade if I don't think they are keepers. I'm leaning towards the Emotiva A-700 (7x110) for good power for bed layer and A-800 (8x50) adequate for heights. I know the A-800 also doubles as a house audio amp but it has inputs per channel. And the pair of amps works and maps perfectly for 15 channels. Amp cost, around $1200, or about $80/channel.

3) Get some proven amps that will be good for a long time: an Emotiva XPA-7 Gen 3 (7x200) for bed layer and either a custom XPA-8-0-4S for heights or an XPA-11 because it will have better resale than XPA-8-0-4S. Maybe use the three extra high power channels for sub duty. Cost $4200 list plus some discount from my dealer, about $200 / channel.

4) I could do the same thing as above but with Monoprice Monolith 7x and 11x (basically ATI) for $4,100 and no discount, $227 per channel.

5) I could go all out for ATI nCores: ATI AT527NC and AT528NC for $8,000, dealer cost about $5,000 (not sure what discount I can get). At list that's $533/channel so it's probably not an option. But I've heard these sound awesome and might be the last amps I'll ever need.

6) Get the best bang for the buck I can get with pro gear and give it a try. I've got a current deal offer for 5x Behringer NX4-6000 amps for $2,000. Those are 4x440, but I think that's a peak rating, so more like 4x220 continuous. If you bridge the 4 channels down to 2 you basically get an NX6000. So, that's 20 channels of amplification, or $100 / channel. I could use one for LCR, (with a spare channel, this will give the front 3 a little extra power with one channel not driven), one for surrounds and backs, one for heights, one for tops +CH, and one bridged for two 4 ohm subs. The power is overkill but the price is awesome. I know I might need to fan mod them to be quiet, but I'm comfortable with that (I build my own PCs). Although I've heard mixed reports the NX6000 fans are not actually as loud as the old iNukes or the NX3000s so it might not be needed. I am a little worried about hiss through speakers because of low S/N, and also NX4-6000 takes a 0.775V max input signal and the AV8805 puts out 2.4V so I'd have to turn the gains and the amps way down. Does anyone use Behringer NU or NX for full range duty with their AV8805? Any noise issues?

I am thrifty and like to spend money on home theater wisely (i.e. bang for the buck). I will spend extra money on things that really make a difference. I don't mind taking some risks, but I'm not an early adopter. I like my HT equipment, audio equipment, smart home equipment, to just work. I don't mind working with companies on warranty, as long as they honor it. I don't mind paying extra for good service.

I'm leaning towards the 5x NX4-6000. I have until Nov 13 to decide what to do.

What are your thoughts? Please feel free to share ideas I haven't thought of, facts/measurements, and most importantly, your opinions. I have been around a long time and learned a lot, but I'm always open minded and always learning more. I love sharing my passion and knowledge with others and contribute frequently to help others. So, please share your thoughts. I promise I will listen and keep an open mind.

Thank you!

-J.C.


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