StormAudio: 9.1.6 Processing and ISP 3D.20.ELITE Processor Announced at ISE 2018 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 21 Old 02-01-2018, 07:43 AM - Thread Starter
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StormAudio: 9.1.6 Processing and ISP 3D.20.ELITE Processor Announced at ISE 2018

StormAudio is implementing native 9.1.6 (native) processing on all its immersive audio processors. It's also adding the 20-channel ISP 3D.20.ELITE to the mix, providing a free microphone kit, and shipping a 4-channel XLR expansion module that gives its 16-channel (analog output) processors 20-channel capability.

Click here to read more: https://www.avsforum.com/stormaudio-a...r-at-ise-2018/

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post #2 of 21 Old 02-01-2018, 08:08 AM
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That's impressive and crazy expensive. I wish Outlaw Audio would release their Atmos processor.
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post #3 of 21 Old 02-01-2018, 10:03 AM
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Sounds exciting Mark. I would be interested in hearing your comparison against the Emotiva RMC-1 piece when it gets released. Both 16 channels with DIRAC Live room correction. One $5K and the other $16K (triple the price). At the end of the day, Storm audio is still a $16K pre/pro that is geared at the top end of the market. Unless you're a senior editor at AVS, pretty much out of reach for most.
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post #4 of 21 Old 02-01-2018, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
StormAudio is implementing native 9.1.6 (native) processing on all its immersive audio processors. It's also adding the 20-channel ISP 3D.20.ELITE to the mix, providing a free microphone kit, and shipping a 4-channel XLR expansion module that gives its 16-channel (analog output) processors 20-channel capability.

Click here to read more: https://www.avsforum.com/stormaudio-a...r-at-ise-2018/
Mark,

One would think in 2018 they would use a larger screen... no?
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post #5 of 21 Old 02-01-2018, 11:40 PM
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My thoughts exactly

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post #6 of 21 Old 02-02-2018, 02:46 AM
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I'm glad to hear you are going full 9.1.6 Mark. I had the impression you were pretty much against using wides in your room a while ago though, what has changed?

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post #7 of 21 Old 02-02-2018, 03:50 PM
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So if a 20-channel unit can only do the same 9.1.6 as a 16 channel unit, where do the extra four channels go? Are they just independent subwoofer channels?

I have to agree with @Jish9 - these extremely pricey units from the likes of Storm Audio, Trinnov, Audio Control, Datasat, etc, are going to be hard sales once more affordable options hit the market, though it looks like that's only Emotiva this year (if they get it out) since Marantz and Denon are sticking with 13 channel solutions.

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post #8 of 21 Old 02-02-2018, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuteTibiImperes View Post
So if a 20-channel unit can only do the same 9.1.6 as a 16 channel unit, where do the extra four channels go? Are they just independent subwoofer channels?

I have to agree with @Jish9 - these extremely pricey units from the likes of Storm Audio, Trinnov, Audio Control, Datasat, etc, are going to be hard sales once more affordable options hit the market, though it looks like that's only Emotiva this year (if they get it out) since Marantz and Denon are sticking with 13 channel solutions.

It's not just the number of channels that count. The Storm ISP units have more DSP's/extensive processing capability, configuration software capability and 32 channels D/A output capability in all models (The 16 channel ISP 16.12 pictured from CEDIA below has all 32 D/A channels in it's output board. Build quality is reflected in the glowing review by WideScreen Review:

https://www.stormaudio.com/media/wsr...8_04122017.pdf

The more appropriate comparison would be between the Storm Audio ISP 3D 16 ELITE and the new stripped down Trinnov Altitude 16. The Emotiva has some of the same features but is not on the same league for build quality. If you're budget is limited to $5k tops, then the RMC-1 is a steal. But if you have invested thousands of dollars in a really high end theater system then the Storm ISP 3D.16 and Trinnopv Altitude 16 are top contenders.


Inside Emotiva RMC-1 at CEDIA






RMC-1 back panel




Inside Storm 3D ISP 16.12 at CEDIA










ISP back panel with expansion boards

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post #9 of 21 Old 02-02-2018, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterc613 View Post
It's not just the number of channels that count. The Storm ISP units have more DSP's/extensive processing capability, configuration software capability and 32 channels D/A output capability in all models (The 16 channel ISP 16.12 pictured from CEDIA below has all 32 D/A channels in it's output board. Build quality is reflected in the glowing review by WideScreen Review:

https://www.stormaudio.com/media/wsr...8_04122017.pdf

The more appropriate comparison would be between the Storm Audio ISP 3D 16 ELITE and the new stripped down Trinnov Altitude 16. The Emotiva has some of the same features but is not on the same league for build quality. If you're budget is limited to $5k tops, then the RMC-1 is a steal. But if you have invested thousands of dollars in a really high end theater system then the Storm ISP 3D.16 and Trinnopv Altitude 16 are top contenders.


Interesting, thanks for the link. They both look to have excellent build quality, and I see that the Storm Audio has the fancy web-based configuration tool that looks like it could be useful in setting things up.

I'm still not sure what the additional channels are for. Say you have a 9.1.6 setup, do the other 4 channels on the 20 channel unit go towards independently EQing multiple subwoofers sharing the same LFE channel? What about moving to the 32 channel versions? If it can't decode Atmos at, say, 14.4.14, what are they used for? Can it just matrix speakers in between the discretely addressed 9.1.6 to create extra virtual channels?

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post #10 of 21 Old 02-03-2018, 12:51 PM
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This just in from CEPro yesterday February 2, 2018:

Looks like Storm Audio is expanding their strategic footprint by licensing their excellent configuration software to Bryston for the SP4 processor and getting the excellent Bryston Cubed Series technology for Storm amplifiers in return. Not only is this exciting from a product standpoint for both companies, it adds credibility that Storm Audio / Immersive Audio Technologies (newly independent from Auro Technologies with VC funding) is here to stay. Bryston is a longstanding stable company that makes products, some with 25 year warranties. They would not be entering into a development agreement with Storm is they didn't think that (1) the processing software was first class, and (2) that Immersive Audio Technologies will be stable for the long haul as a strategic partner.


https://www.cepro.com/article/brysto...lectronics/ise


Bryston Teams with StormAudio to Jointly Develop AV Electronics

To be introduced at ISE 2018, high-performance AV companies Bryston and StormAudio are teaming up,
with StormAudio providing processing designs and Bryston providing amplification designs.

Bryston has announced a collaboration with the European electronics manufacturer StormAudio, to be showcased for the first time at ISE 2018.

The newly formed partnership between the French-based audio hardware manufacturer and Ontario, Canada-based Bryston, will help each company produce an array of new products, according to both parties.

As a byproduct of the cooperative effort, Bryston will unveil its new SP4 surround processor and StormAudio will be leveraging Bryston’s Cubed Series amplifier technology. Bryston has in past years experienced successful partnerships with respected A/V brands such as Harman, PMC, Axiom and others.



Bryston Teams with StormAudio for SP4 Preamplifier/Processor

The SP4 will be a 16.2-channel processor with an option to add four channels to achieve a 20-channel mode. The SP4 will support all popular immersive surround formats, such as Dolby Atmos, Auro-3D and DTS:X, as well as conventional formats. The SP4 will also feature Dirac Live room correction equalization technologies to provide professional integrators access to the latest technologies within a Bryston home theater the Canadian manufacturer states.

Bryston points out the SP4 will be built on a 3U modular platform to enable Bryston engineers to integrate advanced technologies and make upgrades available to consumers, extending the life of the product. The SP4 will also be compatible with popular control system platforms, including Savant, RTI, Control4 and Crestron. The Bryston SP4 preamplifier/processor is expected to publicly launch during the second quarter (Q2) 2018.

StormAudio Cubed Series-Based Amplifiers

Utilizing Bryston's amplification platform, StormAudio will introduce 2-channel and 4-channel amplifiers based on the Bryston Cubed Series technology to give StormAudio a high-performance solution with professional studio-grade performance and reliability.

No timetable has been given for the Bryston-based StormAudio amplifiers.

Bryston hasn't offered a preamplifier/processor in several years. Previously the company developed its own home theater processors that include the SP-1, the SP-1.7, the SP-2 and SP-3 solutions.

Before the partnership StormAudio also offered integrators its PA-16 Elite 16-channel amplifier.

Integrated Systems Europe (ISE) show attendees can see the Bryston and StormAudio collaboration in person in Amsterdam on Feb. 6-9 in Stand 1-N122.
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post #11 of 21 Old 02-03-2018, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuteTibiImperes View Post
Interesting, thanks for the link. They both look to have excellent build quality, and I see that the Storm Audio has the fancy web-based configuration tool that looks like it could be useful in setting things up.

I'm still not sure what the additional channels are for. Say you have a 9.1.6 setup, do the other 4 channels on the 20 channel unit go towards independently EQing multiple subwoofers sharing the same LFE channel? What about moving to the 32 channel versions? If it can't decode Atmos at, say, 14.4.14, what are they used for? Can it just matrix speakers in between the discretely addressed 9.1.6 to create extra virtual channels?

Obviously the ISP 3D.16 ELITE processor and ISP 3D.16.12 ELITE receiver can accommodate 16 channels for 9.1.6 Dolby Atmos.


--------------------------------------------------------


When you move up to the ISP 3D.20 ELITE processor, the 4-XLR expansion module lets you accommodate 20 channels for 9.4.6 Dolby Atmos including 4 subwoofers and one extra XLR output that can be used for either Near-field Mid-Bass Modules or Tactile Transducers. This is the ideal setup for most people with a single moderately sized home theater:

FREQUENCY (SPL)
It allows you to reach the optimum smoothing out of frequencies response and room modes (see Harmon paper by Welti & Devantier below) by using four subwoofers instead of only one or two on most processors.

PRESSURE (PVL)
It allows you to increase "chest slam" in the near-field 50 Hz range by incorporating and adjusting Mid Bass Modules right behind the main LP (see Below), and/or

TACTILE (acceleration)
It allows you to increase Tactile Response below 16 Hz by incorporating and adjusting tactile transducers on the seating to augment the ULF frequencies (see below)


The Ultimate Frequency, Pressure and Tactile Response Thread

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...se-thread.html

The Ultimate Four Octave Experience. Thats what I call it. My goal is to have perfect, balanced, response of all three LF/ULF components, Frequency, Pressure, Tactile.

You can't just run Near-Field Mid-Bass Modules and Tactile Transducers off your other subwoofer feeds because the time delay distance is zero. Also you would want to be able to adjust the level of SPL on the Mid-Bass Modules to augment the pressure at the seating position without overwhelming the frequency response of the whole system around 50 Hz. The same is true of the tactile transducers. You would want to be able to adjust their amplitude up to where it augments the experience of ULF without calling attention to themselves. Having the extra channel(s) to independently control Mid-Bass Modules or tactile Transducers also allow you to adjust them on the fly while watching a movie. You can also have different preset levels for you (medium), your spouse (low), or the kids (highest).

An ISP 3D.20 ELITE processor could also be used for a 7.1.4 system in your home theater, a 5.1 system in your family room, and a 2.0 Sonos whole house audio system (20 channels total). Remember that the Storm ISP processor controls are web browser based. So an iPad in the Home Theater, plus an iPad in the Den or a phone app will control all three systems even though the processor and amps are hidden in an equipment closet in one location.



Low-Frequency Optimization Using Multiple Subwoofers*

TODD WELTI AND ALLAN DEVANTIER
Harman International Industries

https://audioroundtable.com/misc/Welti_Multisub.pdf

One of the authors [19] made an in-depth investigation to determine which configurations were optimal in a rect- angular room with the typical seating arrangement shown in Fig. 4. Investigations were based on numerical model- ing of the space as well as an actual measurements in the room, which were found to be in reasonable agreement. Instead of using a flat magnitude response target, as gen- erally has been used in the past, metrics based on seat-to- seat variance were used to characterize performance. A number of different room dimensions as well as two dif- ferent seating configurations were also investigated, again with the same overall results.

By analyzing over 100 000 subwoofer configurations it was shown that for configurations of one to four subwoof- ers, location at wall midpoints is optimal. Fig. 5 shows some of the configurations tested, starting with one- subwoofer configurations and ending with 18-subwoofer configurations. Four subwoofer at the wall midpoints (configuration 11) was the best practical configuration in terms of MSV. Two subwoofers at opposing wall mid- points (configuration 6) was nearly as good and also of- fered stronger low-frequency support. Configurations with more than four subwoofers were not found to be advan- tageous, especially when cost is factored in.

Mean Spatial Variance (MSV)
The variance of the sound level2 in dB as a function of the seating location (typically four to six seats) is calculated for each fre- quency, and from this the mean variance is calculated. This is a measure of seat-to-seat consistency in the ampli- dude response.



Fig. 6 shows MSV as a function of room length and width, calculated over a 3-m by 3-m grid of 16 seats centered in the room, for six subwoofer configurations. Room dimensions range from 4 to 9 m, and the ceiling height is 2.7 m. Similar results were obtained with 2.4-m and 3.0-m ceilings. It can be seen that the performance of a given subwoofer configuration depends to some degree on the specific room. While optimizing room dimensions without a knowledge of subwoofer or seating area con- figurations is next to meaningless, choosing a subwoofer configuration and room dimensions for a known seating configuration can be very useful.






Nearfield Ported MBM for Increased Mid-Bass Tactile Response

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...-response.html







Crowson Tactile Motion Actuators

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...rs-thread.html






--------------------------------------------------------


When you move up to the ISP 3D.32 ELITE processor, the 16-XLR expansion module lets you accommodate 24 channels in your home theater for 9.4.6.5 (9 base + 4 subs + 6 Atmos + 5 Auro). This would allow you to play 9.4.6 Atmos movies and 7.4.5 Auro music (via up mixer) using speakers in their optimum locations.

The remaining channels could be used to array multiple speakers in a larger theater including Mid-bass modules and Tactile transducers, plus an additional 5.1 system in a den, family room or guest house plus a 2-channel Sonos whole house distributed audio system with local subs. You could also do a number of smaller systems in multiple rooms, all controlled by iPads with the equipment in one central location.

Anyway you look at it, this is one of the most flexible and configurable processors on the market. Start with the basic ISP 3D.16 and grow your system from there with additional outputs and enhanced features through expansion boards. It's an integrator's dream and much easier to configure (from what i've been told) than the Trinnov Optimizer.
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post #12 of 21 Old 02-04-2018, 07:53 PM
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Interesting product, I wonder what the feature differences are between it and the Trinnov Altitude.

It would be cool if the Altitude or the Storm Audio incorporated multiple subwoofer optimization at some point. Based on the post above, am I to understand that Storm Audio has multiple subwoofer optimization built in? Will it run sequential mult-subwoofer setting permutation simulations in order to get the best balance for the most seating positions?

Even Denon has reached 13.2 channels although its room correction may be rudimentary compared to the high end. At least it has Alexa compatibility out of the box...

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post #13 of 21 Old 02-07-2018, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satboy View Post
Mark,

One would think in 2018 they would use a larger screen... no?


Reminds me a little of...



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post #14 of 21 Old 02-07-2018, 06:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satboy View Post
Mark,

One would think in 2018 they would use a larger screen... no?
Maybe they want to reduce the light pollution in the room.

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post #15 of 21 Old 02-07-2018, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterc613 View Post
Obviously the ISP 3D.16 ELITE processor and ISP 3D.16.12 ELITE receiver can accommodate 16 channels for 9.1.6 Dolby Atmos.

Spoiler!


Anyway you look at it, this is one of the most flexible and configurable processors on the market. Start with the basic ISP 3D.16 and grow your system from there with additional outputs and enhanced features through expansion boards. It's an integrator's dream and much easier to configure (from what i've been told) than the Trinnov Optimizer.
Peterc613;
Great post, the plots, charts, visuals.
I'm going to show this to a few guys at work to show them the expertise on AVS.

I'm a budget guy, just got the Denon 13.2ch X8500H ......
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post #16 of 21 Old 02-07-2018, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
I'm glad to hear you are going full 9.1.6 Mark. I had the impression you were pretty much against using wides in your room a while ago though, what has changed?
@imagic - I'm wondering same here....
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What would be very interesting would be to find out if these models have the same processing limitations as the D&M X8500H/8805, i.e. DTS:X limited to 7.1.4 (11ch) and DSU limited to 7.1.4 (no wides support when upmixing). This leaves only Atmos for a full use of the wides (unless you disable SBs and use Neural:X in 5.1.4 or 5.1.6 + wides) as Auro 3D doesn't support front wides at all.

As apparently it's a format limitation (from Dolby/DTS) and not a hardware processing limitation from the AVR manufacturer (the X8500H has 13.1 processing channels), it's likely that the higher-end units suffer from the same limitations.

In which case, an X8500H/8805 or an Emotiva RMC-1 make even more sense, as 9.1.4 or 7.1.6 might be enough in many cases, at least until DSU/Neural-X/DTS:X are updated to support the 9.1.4 or 9.1.6...
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post #18 of 21 Old 05-13-2018, 12:46 PM
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Has anyone, other than the OP, seen one of these in the wild/owned one? Any updates on the native 9.1.6 processing?
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post #19 of 21 Old 08-21-2018, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
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Has anyone, other than the OP, seen one of these in the wild/owned one? Any updates on the native 9.1.6 processing?
Good question. I think this needs to be resurrected as there must be some updates by now...anyone?
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post #20 of 21 Old 03-23-2019, 07:26 PM
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Has anyone, other than the OP, seen one of these in the wild/owned one? Any updates on the native 9.1.6 processing?
I own one ! It sounds Fantastic!
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post #21 of 21 Old 03-24-2019, 12:53 AM
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The ISP 3D sounds better than Datasat and Trinnov 16.
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