Denon X4400 or Anthem MRX1120 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 17 Old 03-11-2019, 05:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Denon X4400 or Anthem MRX1120

Arrghhh....the Denon meets my feature needs and is at a very good price point right now with the 4500 coming out. The other option I was looking at was the MRX1120 which has 2 extra channels I won't use but does have ARC (I really wish there was a 920).

Basically, is ARC worth the extra $2000 over Audyssey MultEQ XT32?

Home Theater - Video: Sony KDL-55W800B - Audio - 7.2 - AVR: Denon 2809CI, Left/Right: DT Studio Monitor, Center: DT CLR 2002, Surrounds: Sonance IS4, Subwoofers: Paradigm RVC-12SQ with X850 Amplifier - Upgrade in Progress!

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post #2 of 17 Old 03-11-2019, 10:25 PM
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I think this is a first: someone asking for advice concerning a $3500 AVR vs a $900 AVR.

If you've got that kind of budget, maybe you should toss an AVR with Dirac into the mix. I've never used it, but it is supposed to be superior to all other room correction software, including ARC. Perhaps an Arcam AVR390 or AVR550.
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post #3 of 17 Old 03-11-2019, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylia View Post
Arrghhh....the Denon meets my feature needs and is at a very good price point right now with the 4500 coming out. The other option I was looking at was the MRX1120 which has 2 extra channels I won't use but does have ARC (I really wish there was a 920).

Basically, is ARC worth the extra $2000 over Audyssey MultEQ XT32?
No way ARC is worth an extra $2,000 over Audyssey MultiEQ XT32!

Just get the Denon X4400.
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post #4 of 17 Old 03-11-2019, 10:34 PM
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Interstingly, how would you guys suggest comparing MRX 1120 with SR8102. Does MRX really provide a huge value and is worth that hefty 3500 price tag ? I am
Also looking to upgrade and the options at the table are denon 4500, Yamaha 3080 SR8012 and was thinking about MRX1120.
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post #5 of 17 Old 03-11-2019, 10:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post
No way ARC is worth an extra $2,000 over Audyssey MultiEQ XT32!

Just get the Denon X4400.
Yeah, I think I'm leaning that way. I also saw all the Marantz are on sale as well, and the 7012 which is basically the same as the 4400 but much more attractive (to me despite owning Denon's since 2003) is also very attractively priced. Just running down if they resolved the HDR passthrough issue with Apple TV 4K.

Home Theater - Video: Sony KDL-55W800B - Audio - 7.2 - AVR: Denon 2809CI, Left/Right: DT Studio Monitor, Center: DT CLR 2002, Surrounds: Sonance IS4, Subwoofers: Paradigm RVC-12SQ with X850 Amplifier - Upgrade in Progress!
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post #6 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 03:58 AM
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The only thing that really sets apart mid-level and up AVRs is the room correction method (Audyssey, ARC, etc).

When listening to Pure Direct unprocessed sound, there is no audible difference:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...listening.html

While a bit older, this thread is definitely still worth a read regarding a get together testing most of the common room correction systems. It was a real toss-up regarding what people thought of each one.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...nsas-city.html

I have a Denon 4300 and am perfectly happy with it especially considering I couldn't hear a difference between it and the Marantz 8802. I'll only need to upgrade due to HDMI or other changes though the upcoming Monoprice with Dirac might get me to consider a trial to see if I can hear the difference with that.

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post #7 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 04:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylia View Post
Arrghhh....the Denon meets my feature needs and is at a very good price point right now with the 4500 coming out. The other option I was looking at was the MRX1120 which has 2 extra channels I won't use but does have ARC (I really wish there was a 920).

Basically, is ARC worth the extra $2000 over Audyssey MultEQ XT32?
Keep in mind the X4400H (as well as the SR7012) are 2017 models released in Sep 2017 while the X4500H/SR7013 were released in Sep 2018.
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post #8 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorax2 View Post
The only thing that really sets apart mid-level and up AVRs is the room correction method (Audyssey, ARC, etc).

When listening to Pure Direct unprocessed sound, there is no audible difference:

[
URL]https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/2670641-marantz-av7703-vs-av7702-vs-av7005-2ch-stereo-critical-listening.html[/URL]

While a bit older, this thread is definitely still worth a read regarding a get together testing most of the common room correction systems. It was a real toss-up regarding what people thought of each one.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...nsas-city.html

I have a Denon 4300 and am perfectly happy with it especially considering I couldn't hear a difference between it and the Marantz 8802. I'll only need to upgrade due to HDMI or other changes though the upcoming Monoprice with Dirac might get me to consider a trial to see if I can hear the difference with that.
Who listens in PURE DIRECT?
I have owned Denon 4200, Marantz 7010, and currently Marantz 8012. The 4200 and 7010 sound alike, however, the 8012 sounds different and much better IMO.
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post #9 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post
Who listens in PURE DIRECT?
I have owned Denon 4200, Marantz 7010, and currently Marantz 8012. The 4200 and 7010 sound alike, however, the 8012 sounds different and much better IMO.
None of us normally listen in Pure Direct. The purpose of our testing was to see if we could hear any differences from each piece of equipment without further audio processing (given the 8802 has "superior" DACs, power supply, circuitry, etc.) - which we couldn't. Similar to @Archaea and what most others on AVS post and have blind tested, the difference in sound quality is in the room correction method used rather than in the receiver or Pre/Pros themselves if a mid grade or higher. I was willing to fork over nearly 3x as much money for a 8802 over a 4200 but I couldn't hear the difference nor could they which surprised all of us. For us, there is no reason to upgrade unless there are changes in HDMI standards or a better audio processing system comes along.

It's great that you could hear the difference between your 8012 and 4200 and 7010, many of us could not hear the difference with similar and higher level equipment. The difference you may possibly be hearing is that your Audyssey calibration or volume matching was slightly different from that of your 4200 and 7010. The most important thing is that you're happy with your new 8012 and that's what it's all about

7.2.4 with Denon X4300W, ATI 2005 & 1807 Amps, Kef Reference 203 Mains, 202c Ctr, 201 Surr, Ci200RR-THX Top Rears, Q300 Frt Hts, E301 Rear Surr, Power Sound Audio PSA dual S3600i Subs,
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post #10 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorax2 View Post
None of us normally listen in Pure Direct. The purpose of our testing was to see if we could hear any differences from each piece of equipment without further audio processing (given the 8802 has "superior" DACs, power supply, circuitry, etc.) - which we couldn't. Similar to @Archaea and what most others on AVS post and have blind tested, the difference in sound quality is in the room correction method used rather than in the receiver or Pre/Pros themselves if a mid grade or higher. I was willing to fork over nearly 3x as much money for a 8802 over a 4200 but I couldn't hear the difference nor could they which surprised all of us. For us, there is no reason to upgrade unless there are changes in HDMI standards or a better audio processing system comes along.

It's great that you could hear the difference between your 8012 and 4200 and 7010, many of us could not hear the difference with similar and higher level equipment. The difference you may possibly be hearing is that your Audyssey calibration or volume matching was slightly different from that of your 4200 and 7010. The most important thing is that you're happy with your new 8012 and that's what it's all about
I have tested a VW and Ferrari. They sound the same without the engine running despite the superior parts in the Ferrari.

If you were testing all D&M equipment and could hear no difference then room correction should not change that since they all use the same RC. I never considered the D&M processors to sound any better than the AVR's. Not sure what you tested that you considered more high end than the 8012.

I compare without room correction and usually leave it turned off. I also make judgement on listening for a few days and not switching back and forth is a single sitting.
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post #11 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by zorax2 View Post
The only thing that really sets apart mid-level and up AVRs is the room correction method (Audyssey, ARC, etc).
In the same brand
Isnt one of the things you get going up in models is a beefier amp/power supply?


Quote:
Originally Posted by zorax2 View Post
I have a Denon 4300 and am perfectly happy with it especially considering I couldn't hear a difference between it and the Marantz 8802. I'll only need to upgrade due to HDMI or other changes though the upcoming Monoprice with Dirac might get me to consider a trial to see if I can hear the difference with that.
This is interesting
I had a 4520 and replaced it with an X4400. I didn't like the X400...Maybe the build quality difference from the 4520 was issue
I sold the X4400 and bought an X7200 and was good again

I also have a Marantz 8802...but it powers my main listening room and was never in the mix for being switched
I did think about trying ti back to back with my 4520 to see if I heard any difference...but I never tried

Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post
Who listens in PURE DIRECT?
I have owned Denon 4200, Marantz 7010, and currently Marantz 8012. The 4200 and 7010 sound alike, however, the 8012 sounds different and much better IMO.
I will listen in pure direct to music
I don't care for XT32 for music listening and I am not the type that like to listen to matrixed channels

Warren

Rm 1 LG65E7 Marantz 8802A prepro Sherbourn 5/1500A and HK PA2400 amps B&W CM10s..CM2 center...CM6's.rears
Rm 2 Sony 49x900E Denon X7200 Celestion 305 speaker system
Rm 3 Sony 55x930E Yamaha A1060 Kef 2005.2 speaker system
Rm 4 Sony 65Z9D
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post #12 of 17 Old 03-12-2019, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by zorax2 View Post
The only thing that really sets apart mid-level and up AVRs is the room correction method (Audyssey, ARC, etc).
This was my concern....both had all the same basic features, but what will drive how my room sounds is going to be Audessy vs ARC. Ideal world I'd have loaners of both and get them fully calibrated in my room.

Home Theater - Video: Sony KDL-55W800B - Audio - 7.2 - AVR: Denon 2809CI, Left/Right: DT Studio Monitor, Center: DT CLR 2002, Surrounds: Sonance IS4, Subwoofers: Paradigm RVC-12SQ with X850 Amplifier - Upgrade in Progress!
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post #13 of 17 Old 03-17-2019, 07:25 AM
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Not exactly the comparison, but I just moved from a Denon x3500h to the Anthem MRX 520 (I have simple needs, features-wise). I've got Emotiva T1s up front and T-Zeros on surround duty.

Room correction is one of those simple needs, and in my room, ARC does a noticeably better job than Audyssey MultEQ XT32. For me it's the difference between feeling "ok" about how my system sounds with the Denon (and a Marantz SR5012 I had before that) vs feeling "wow"-ed by the same system with the Anthem and ARC. I was also able to just "set it and forget it" with ARC, vs feeling like I had to constantly tweak and tinker with the Audyssey calibrations.
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post #14 of 17 Old 03-17-2019, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by sidhellman View Post
Interstingly, how would you guys suggest comparing MRX 1120 with SR8102. Does MRX really provide a huge value and is worth that hefty 3500 price tag ? I am
Also looking to upgrade and the options at the table are denon 4500, Yamaha 3080 SR8012 and was thinking about MRX1120.
I haven't heard 1120 but I have a hard time believing that its better then the 8012. Most value would ba a SR7013/SR6013 with power amps if you want all 11 channels
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post #15 of 17 Old 03-18-2019, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylia View Post
Arrghhh....the Denon meets my feature needs and is at a very good price point right now with the 4500 coming out. The other option I was looking at was the MRX1120 which has 2 extra channels I won't use but does have ARC (I really wish there was a 920).

Basically, is ARC worth the extra $2000 over Audyssey MultEQ XT32?
If you are leaning DM the Denon x4500h just happens to be on sale at Frys right now.
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post #16 of 17 Old 03-18-2019, 01:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eriksells916 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naylia View Post
Arrghhh....the Denon meets my feature needs and is at a very good price point right now with the 4500 coming out. The other option I was looking at was the MRX1120 which has 2 extra channels I won't use but does have ARC (I really wish there was a 920).

Basically, is ARC worth the extra $2000 over Audyssey MultEQ XT32?
If you are leaning DM the Denon x4500h just happens to be on sale at Frys right now.
Thanks for the heads up! Unfortunately I’ve blown up my renovation budget by letting the Mrs add in a kitchen remodel at the last minute, so now my heights are going to have to sit unused until summer bonus time 😞

At least I already bought the dual subwoofers 😄

Home Theater - Video: Sony KDL-55W800B - Audio - 7.2 - AVR: Denon 2809CI, Left/Right: DT Studio Monitor, Center: DT CLR 2002, Surrounds: Sonance IS4, Subwoofers: Paradigm RVC-12SQ with X850 Amplifier - Upgrade in Progress!
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post #17 of 17 Old 03-20-2019, 03:20 PM
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Thanks for the heads up! Unfortunately I’ve blown up my renovation budget by letting the Mrs add in a kitchen remodel at the last minute, so now my heights are going to have to sit unused until summer bonus time 😞

At least I already bought the dual subwoofers 😄
The X4400 has 11.2 pre-outs so you do have the 11 channels in the Denon - 2 just need amplification.
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