"OFFICIAL" 2019 Denon "S-Series" / "X-Series" AVR Owner's Thread + FAQ (Posts 1-8) - Page 12 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #331 of 611 Old 08-15-2019, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by photobriangray View Post
The Magnolia guy at my store said that he thinks they about to start carrying more of the new lineup in store soon as the clearance pricing has all but cleared inventory for the previous models.
I just ordered an x3600 from one of my local Best Buys. Only one store showed a unit in stock, and when I went to buy it they couldn't find it. I had them order one since I'm going to be gone for a few days anyway.
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post #332 of 611 Old 08-17-2019, 04:40 PM
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My 2015 AVR-X6200W died - Best replacement option now?

I think my 2015 AVR-X6200W was killed by a power outage/surge yesterday (it shows no signs of life at all). I'm still holding out some hope that I can replace a fuse or something to get it working again, but I'm also considering replacement options. I am/was happy with my 6200, except that I wish it had two more built-in amps. I want Atmos with 9 speakers (9.2) in my main room, plus two more speakers in Zone 2. I use Zone 3 to drive wireless headphones (not Bluetooth).

I'm also using most or all the rear inputs on my 6200 (including the phono preamp input). I've been planning to buy an external amp (maybe a 3-channel Monoprice Monolith) for the front three speakers, thinking that I could use the internal amps for all the others. But I'm concerned that this might not work - since I think I read that you can only re-assign the front amps when you have an 11-channel setup. I would actually have a 9.2 in one room, and 2-channel stereo in a second room/zone. I currently use the All Channel Stereo setting frequently when going back and forth between rooms, but I also want to be able to run them independently (different sources) at times.

Other than it only having 9 built-in amps, my 6200 did what I wanted. I think the next years model added two additional amps, so it would have been ideal (negating the need to buy an external amp - which sounds fun, but probably wouldn't make much difference in the actual sound compared with just using internal amps).

So, the options I'm considering are:

(1) Move the AVR-X3200W I have in my bedroom to our main room and make do with it for another year or so until the 2020 version of the AVR-X6500H comes out. I'm sure I'll miss some capabilities of my 6200. I don't recall if the 3200 it supports Zone 2 (or 3). Not having at least Zone 2 with multi-zone stereo would be a big issue.

(2) Buy an AVR-X6500H (2018 model) now. Since it is actually a year-old model (though still current), maybe there are some good deals available. However, assuming it is still going to cost me roughly what I paid for my 6200, I hate to invest that much in a device that I know will have upgraded HDMI ports next year. But I don't know how important the new HDMI standard will be - I have a 75" 4k Dolbyvision TV that I like. I can't imagine getting an 8K TV in the foreseeable future (8K seems beyond the point of diminishing returns to me unless we have a 12' screen or something). But maybe 8K will be the standard in a few years.

(3) Buy an AVR-X4500H (2018 model). It seems quite comparable to my 6200 (amps for 9 channels, processing for 11). I do like the Amazon Alexa voice support (we use Alexa to control many things in our home). I think this is on all the newer models.

(4) Buy a 2019 AVR-X3600H. These are discussed very positively here, and are in many ways comparable to the 4500, but at a much lower price point. Then again, it being brand new, maybe the real world price difference between the 3200 and the "old" 4500 won't be as large as MSRPs would suggest.

(5) Buy some other Denon or Marantz receiver I haven't yet considered - any suggestions?
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post #333 of 611 Old 08-18-2019, 01:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougb59 View Post
(5) Buy some other Denon or Marantz receiver I haven't yet considered - any suggestions?
The X3200W and X3600H only support Zone 2, rather you must step up to the X4500H to add Zone 3 support.
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post #334 of 611 Old 08-19-2019, 04:28 AM
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Thanks. I went ahead and replaced my dead 6200 with a 3200 I had in my bedroom, and this is working okay. I did a little online shopping for the 6500, and was pleased to see that it appears to be available for better prices than I'd expected. Given the fairly reasonable prices, I was talking myself into just getting a new 6500 for the following reasons:

(1) The extra two built-in amps (11) would let me run a 9.2 Atmos setup in my main listening room, while simultaneously powering a pair of stereo speakers in Zone 2. Can I do this? I had assumed I could, but some discussion I've read makes me wonder. I would like to be able to watch a movie in 9-channel Atmos (or other similar 9-channel decoding) in my main room while listening to either the same program, or some other source in stereo in Zone 2 at the same time, without having to re-configure anything (other than selecting sources). Is this possible? I'm sure the receiver is designed with the idea that most will use an 11-channel setup in one room, but I don't ever expect to go beyond 9 speakers and a couple of subs.

(2) The support for Amazon Alexa control. We use Echo Dots and Alexa a lot to control lights and other devices (including some A/V). If this works well in the new Denon AVRs to allow us to control volume, mute, switch inputs, turn on/off All Channel Stereo, etc. that would be very handy.

The main thing holding me back on purchasing a new 6500 is that it doesn't support HDMI 2.1. I tend to keep A/V equipment for a long time, and while HDMI 2.1 doesn't matter to me now, it may if I replace my TV in 2-3 years and new devices using 2.1 become common and there are sources and content I want that support it. I'm not a gamer, so that's not much of a consideration for me (though my son might use it some). I know the 2020 version of the 6500 (AVR-X6600H?) will support HDMI 2.1, and if my 6200 hadn't died, I wouldn't be looking to upgrade now, but I'm debating about how soon I'll wish I had HDMI 2.1 (or will I be wanting/needing a new receiver by then anyway - say 5-6 years or more from now?).

Also, on another topic, what do you recommend as an effective surge suppressor to protect my receiver from being fried by power spikes such as what I think killed my 6200? I had it plugged into a typical older surge protector/power strip, but obviously that wasn't enough.

Thanks
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post #335 of 611 Old 08-19-2019, 04:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougb59 View Post
Thanks. I went ahead and replaced my dead 6200 with a 3200 I had in my bedroom, and this is working okay. I did a little online shopping for the 6500, and was pleased to see that it appears to be available for better prices than I'd expected. Given the fairly reasonable prices, I was talking myself into just getting a new 6500 for the following reasons:

(1) The extra two built-in amps (11) would let me run a 9.2 Atmos setup in my main listening room, while simultaneously powering a pair of stereo speakers in Zone 2. Can I do this? I had assumed I could, but some discussion I've read makes me wonder. I would like to be able to watch a movie in 9-channel Atmos (or other similar 9-channel decoding) in my main room while listening to either the same program, or some other source in stereo in Zone 2 at the same time, without having to re-configure anything (other than selecting sources). Is this possible? I'm sure the receiver is designed with the idea that most will use an 11-channel setup in one room, but I don't ever expect to go beyond 9 speakers and a couple of subs.

(2) The support for Amazon Alexa control. We use Echo Dots and Alexa a lot to control lights and other devices (including some A/V). If this works well in the new Denon AVRs to allow us to control volume, mute, switch inputs, turn on/off All Channel Stereo, etc. that would be very handy.

The main thing holding me back on purchasing a new 6500 is that it doesn't support HDMI 2.1. I tend to keep A/V equipment for a long time, and while HDMI 2.1 doesn't matter to me now, it may if I replace my TV in 2-3 years and new devices using 2.1 become common and there are sources and content I want that support it. I'm not a gamer, so that's not much of a consideration for me (though my son might use it some). I know the 2020 version of the 6500 (AVR-X6600H?) will support HDMI 2.1, and if my 6200 hadn't died, I wouldn't be looking to upgrade now, but I'm debating about how soon I'll wish I had HDMI 2.1 (or will I be wanting/needing a new receiver by then anyway - say 5-6 years or more from now?).

Also, on another topic, what do you recommend as an effective surge suppressor to protect my receiver from being fried by power spikes such as what I think killed my 6200? I had it plugged into a typical older surge protector/power strip, but obviously that wasn't enough.

Thanks
AMP ASSIGN = 9.1 + Zone 2 is the factory default setting.

Only you can decide if worth waiting until Sep 2020 for the successor model.

Instead of thinking "locally" (home theater equipment), think "globally" (all electrical appliances in the home) by having an electrician install a whole house surge protector.

https://happyhiller.com/blog/whole-h...ng-storm-tips/
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post #336 of 611 Old 08-19-2019, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougb59 View Post
I did a little online shopping for the 6500, and was pleased to see that it appears to be available for better prices than I'd expected. Given the fairly reasonable prices, I was talking myself into just getting a new 6500 for the following reasons.

Thanks
Word of caution, “Products purchased from an unauthorized dealers do not qualify for warranty coverage.”
https://usa.denon.com/us/wheretobuy/dealersearch
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post #337 of 611 Old 08-19-2019, 11:18 AM - Thread Starter
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The Spotify Connect app can now stream Spotify with either a "FREE" or "PREMIUM" account.

https://www.spotify.com/us/connect/
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post #338 of 611 Old 08-19-2019, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The Spotify Connect app can now stream Spotify with either a "FREE" or "PREMIUM" account.

https://www.spotify.com/us/connect/
jdsmoothie,

Can we stream now from Spotify Connect App to hour HEOS setup? Before you needed Premium Spotify account for it to work. I went and tried from my iPhone and when selecting Devices my HEOS are grey out saying that I still need Premium account.
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post #339 of 611 Old 08-20-2019, 01:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mylopr View Post
jdsmoothie,

Can we stream now from Spotify Connect App to hour HEOS setup? Before you needed Premium Spotify account for it to work. I went and tried from my iPhone and when selecting Devices my HEOS are grey out saying that I still need Premium account.
Apparently the Denon webmaster posted the new feature update in error, in that a "Premium" account is still required.
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post #340 of 611 Old 08-20-2019, 02:40 PM
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I just got an X3600 and am looking to add back surround speakers to my setup wirelessly. Is there a wireless extender for heos that would allow me to use my own speakers?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
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post #341 of 611 Old 08-20-2019, 03:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dirk Manderin View Post
I just got an X3600 and am looking to add back surround speakers to my setup wirelessly. Is there a wireless extender for heos that would allow me to use my own speakers?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
HEOS speakers are not designed to work as main zone speakers with the models in this thread, rather only for use as independent speakers in other rooms.
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post #342 of 611 Old 08-20-2019, 06:19 PM
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Beginning a journey from 1080 to 4K

I have a Denon 2309CI. Apparently I bought this in Jan 2009. Has it been 10 years, already? Huh.

And it seems to have started to fail. A few years back the analog upconverter died, so my Wii is now plugged directly into the TV. At the same time I can't get on-screen menus for setup (I'm guessing a common component). Earlier this month I had to do a hard power reset to get it to display anything. And today, while watching my TiVo, the picture kept dropping, as if there was a HDMI resync happening.

So I figure it's time to upgrade. And since I was looking at getting a new screen...

Today I have:
TV: Samsung UN50EH6000
DVD Player: Samsung C500
BluRay Player: Sony BDP-S590
Cablebox: TiVo HD
HTPC: Apple Mac Mini
Game Box: Wii

The DVD/BluRay/TiVo/Mac all go into the 2309CI and that outputs to the TV's HDMI1 input. The Wii used to, with the receiver upconverting, until that died.

So far, so very old school.

So I'm looking at the S950H and the X2600H. I'm trying to work out what can be a "drop in" replacement for what I have now, and what will allow me to do incremental updates. Obviously, first, a 4K TV with ARC. But then maybe a new TiVo. And then maybe maybe a 4K BluRay player (I do prefer physical media to streaming).

From what I can tell, the biggest difference between the two receivers is that the X2600H will upconvert 1080 to 4K but the S950H won't, so the TV will have to do it. And neither upconvert analog signals.

But other than that, would either receiver meet my needs?

(Minor side note: I currently control the 2309CI via serial and have written scripts ( https://github.com/sweharris/denon ) but I'm guessing both receivers can be equivalently controlled over the network; I see the X2600H has a serial port. )

Rgds
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post #343 of 611 Old 08-20-2019, 08:27 PM
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Does anyone have any inside info on when the x600 series will come out?


Rip
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post #344 of 611 Old 08-21-2019, 01:22 AM
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Does anyone have any inside info on when the x600 series will come out?
The X1600H, X2600H and X3600H are available now. The X3600H can be a decent replacement for the 2018 X4500H - see here a comparison between them.

The X4600H, X6600H will be available next year, with HDMI 2.1 ports - this year the 2018 X4500H and X6500H HDMI 2.0b models are carried over instead of new 2019 models.

More details in the first posts of this thread.
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post #345 of 611 Old 08-21-2019, 01:26 AM - Thread Starter
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The recent firmware update now allows for a FREE Spotify Account to be used to stream Spotify via the HEOS app as well as to HEOS speakers.
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Last edited by jdsmoothie; 08-21-2019 at 04:47 AM.
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post #346 of 611 Old 08-21-2019, 05:13 AM
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The recent firmware update now allows for a FREE Spotify Account to be used to stream Spotify via the HEOS app as well as to HEOS speakers.
Confirmed.

Thanks.
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post #347 of 611 Old 08-22-2019, 06:34 PM
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Firmware update for AVR-X3600H is out at least in the US. Adds support for Dolby Atmos Height Virtualization. Updating mine now.
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post #348 of 611 Old 08-23-2019, 08:17 AM
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I just bought a AVR-X3600h, and would like to get a moderate price 2 channel amp. Suggestions are welcomed.
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post #349 of 611 Old 08-23-2019, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
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I just bought a AVR-X3600h, and would like to get a moderate price 2 channel amp. Suggestions are welcomed.
Refer to post 8 of this thread for more info.
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post #350 of 611 Old 08-24-2019, 12:30 PM
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"Adds support for Dolby Atmos Height Virtualization. Updating mine now."

Same for my X2600H.
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post #351 of 611 Old 08-24-2019, 12:31 PM
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"moderate price 2 channel amp. Suggestions are welcomed."

I used the Onkyo M something for years with my X4200.

Onkyo M-5010
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post #352 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 09:36 AM
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Hey All

I'm looking to upgrade from my Denon AVR920W - as I am wanting to move from a 5.1.2 to a 5.1.4 system.

Speakers are below in my signature (klipsch for the fronts/front heights/sub/center - and looking to add Pioneer SP-EBS73 for the rears/rear heights)

I'm kind of waffling between the x4500H and the X6500H; but read on here the X3600 might not be a bad trade off - any thoughts on which to go with for my particular setup? I have an XBR 77A9G so I can watch the IMAX Enhanced stuff as well.

I do have a separate outdoor 2 speaker setup I'd been running off my Zone 2 on my current amp, but had to disconnect it when I went to a 5.1.2 setup

any thoughts appreciated!

Living Room - XBR77A9G / X800M2 / X4500h / Klipsch RP260F - RC62 II - R-112SW - R-41-SA (Atmos) Pioneer Elite SP-EBS73-LR (Surrounds + Atmos)
Bedroom - 65VT30

Last edited by MrKyle; 08-25-2019 at 12:54 PM.
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post #353 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 12:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MrKyle View Post
Hey All

I'm looking to upgrade from my Denon AVR920W - as I am wanting to move from a 5.1.2 to a 5.1.4 system.

Speakers are below in my signature (klipsch for the fronts/front heights/sub/center - and looking to add Pioneer SP-EBS73 for the rears/rear heights)

I'm kind of waffling between the x4500H and the X6500H - any thoughts on which to go with for my particular setup? I have an XBR 77A9G so I can watch the IMAX Enhanced stuff as well.

I do have a separate outdoor 2 speaker setup I'd been running off my Zone 2 on my current amp, but had to disconnect it when I went to a 5.1.2 setup

any thoughts appreciated!
Oops! Wrong thread. The X4500H/X6500H are 2018 models covered in the 2018 Denon Owner's thread --> https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...sts-1-8-a.html
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post #354 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
Oops! Wrong thread. The X4500H/X6500H are 2018 models covered in the 2018 Denon Owner's thread --> https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...sts-1-8-a.html
Ahh gotcha - wasn't sure if this was covering them as they re-used for 2019 - I'll post over there as well!

what are your thoughts on the X3600 for the setup I'm looking at? From reading thru this thread seems like a possible tradeoff from the X4500

thanks!

Living Room - XBR77A9G / X800M2 / X4500h / Klipsch RP260F - RC62 II - R-112SW - R-41-SA (Atmos) Pioneer Elite SP-EBS73-LR (Surrounds + Atmos)
Bedroom - 65VT30
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post #355 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 03:17 PM
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I have a Demon s950h. It worked great for about six days. On the sixth day it attempted a firmware update, over Ethernet. It's now stuck with an 2B02 error code. Even restoring the firmware fails at 97%. Any help is appreciated 😊.
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post #356 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Trevor Ginn View Post
I have a Demon s950h. It worked great for about six days. On the sixth day it attempted a firmware update, over Ethernet. It's now stuck with an 2B02 error code. Even restoring the firmware fails at 97%. Any help is appreciated 😊.
Refer to post 5 and do a "Restart."
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post #357 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Ahh gotcha - wasn't sure if this was covering them as they re-used for 2019 - I'll post over there as well!

what are your thoughts on the X3600 for the setup I'm looking at? From reading thru this thread seems like a possible tradeoff from the X4500

thanks!
There is a lot of very helpful information provided in the first 8 posts of each of these Denon threads. Post 1 indicates the X4500H/X6500H are covered in the 2018 thread.

The X3600H would work well, just depends on whether you want any of the additional features provided on the X4500H (eg. Auro 3D, Zone 3, etc.).
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post #358 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 05:44 PM
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The restart doesn't help. Neither does any other form of button pushing hard or soft resets that I can figure. I have firmware on a USB, but I cant keep the receiver on the heos input to use it.
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post #359 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguyca View Post

The preouts and the inputs to the onboard power amplifiers have been known to be in parallel. This reduces the impedance seen by the preamp output, which is the output of the volume control. These outputs are limited in their ability to drive low impedances, which in turn can lead to distortion. The more robust output provided by preamp output buffers, such as the HDAM's Marantz AVR's would alleviate this effect.

It was previously not clear that the parallel connection of the volume control output also resulted in distortion causing signals entering the preamp signal, from the input of the onboard power amplifiers, from clipping of the onboard power amplifiers. This same effect is evidently occurring in Marantz SR8012 units that have HDAM's because the distortion would be fed back into the preamp signal chain after the HDAM.

The negative effect of clipping in the output of the onboard power amplifiers on preamp output signal quality, would appear to occur at a lower level if the eco mode is used since the lower rail voltages on the power amplifier stage would result at clipping at a lower output level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmax67 View Post
Showing higher distorton using a $35,000 dollar piece of testing equipment doesn't necessarily mean it's audible distortion that's number one. Denon receivers have been bench tested to fully power an external power amp without audible distortion up to 2VRMS which is generally accepted as a proper pre out sensitivity. If an external amp has at least 29dB of gain(input sensitivity) which most do then you should have little to no issue reaching an amp's maximum potential using the Denon's pre outs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioHolics.com
Eco Mode - Avoid like the Plague! - it's going to starve your speakers of power. With Eco mode engaged, it limited power on the bench to 20 watts/ch no matter how many channels were driven. This is worse than the dreaded 4-ohm impedance switch many receiver companies are using today. Make triple sure you NEVER set this receiver to Eco if you plan on using the internal amplifiers.


So when using the X3600 (or any other Denon X with Pre-outs) as a pre-amp and hooking up all speakers via external amps some people use Denon's Eco-mode to reduce the internal heat quite a bit (see my posts) and don't care about the reduced rail voltage or limited power output of the internal amps because they weren't being used at all.

But if you do use external amps and Eco-mode does this effect the pre-amp output signal quality going to the external amp in any audibly discernible way?

Or is this just theatrically possible and for the absolute best possible pre-amp output signal quality one should never engage Eco-mode and deal with the added heat?


You guys got the left side of my brain working...


SCG
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post #360 of 611 Old 08-25-2019, 10:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevor Ginn View Post
The restart doesn't help. Neither does any other form of button pushing hard or soft resets that I can figure. I have firmware on a USB, but I cant keep the receiver on the heos input to use it.
Doesn't help how? What happens when the "Restart" procedure is used? Did you try a "Network Reset"? If none of the resets listed in post 5 is able to remove the error, you'll want to return the unit to the seller for an exchange.
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