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post #1 of 15 Old 08-06-2019, 03:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Need help for new home theater AV atmos setup

Hello,

I know there are forums for Atmos but my question is for a specific set up so was hoping you experts could quickly aid me in purchase options.
My new theater should be completed by contractor in a few days. I purchased the EPSON 5050UB projector.

I have the following receiver Onkyo TX-NR575 and was going to do a 7.1 setup. Then I came here and would see Atmos Atmos Atmos and started researching and got hooked. So I purchased the following speakers to get a 7.4.2 set up:

Polk Audio in wall speakers
Front Left and Right: Polk 265 - RT
Center speaker (mounted under screen): Polk 255C-RT
Side and rear surrounds: Polk 65 – RT
Ceiling surrounds: Polk 70-RT

Having looked for 11.2 AV receivers and seeing the pries for now and having the Onkyo unused in a box and not returnable, I've read here about getting a separate amp for the Atmos ceiling surrounds and can be affordable.

Do you all have any recommendations on a receiver or amp that could run the Atmos ceiling speakers in tandem with the Onkyo handling the 7 speakers and 2 subs?
What kind of price range would there be being a secondary receiver?
How does it run in tandem with av receiver, does it plug into it or do you split HDMI from cable box/dvd player into each receiver?

Any help is greatly appreciated!!
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post #2 of 15 Old 08-06-2019, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scosdaddy View Post
Hello,

I know there are forums for Atmos but my question is for a specific set up so was hoping you experts could quickly aid me in purchase options.
My new theater should be completed by contractor in a few days. I purchased the EPSON 5050UB projector.

I have the following receiver Onkyo TX-NR575 and was going to do a 7.1 setup. Then I came here and would see Atmos Atmos Atmos and started researching and got hooked. So I purchased the following speakers to get a 7.4.2 set up:

Polk Audio in wall speakers
Front Left and Right: Polk 265 - RT
Center speaker (mounted under screen): Polk 255C-RT
Side and rear surrounds: Polk 65 – RT
Ceiling surrounds: Polk 70-RT

Having looked for 11.2 AV receivers and seeing the pries for now and having the Onkyo unused in a box and not returnable, I've read here about getting a separate amp for the Atmos ceiling surrounds and can be affordable.

Do you all have any recommendations on a receiver or amp that could run the Atmos ceiling speakers in tandem with the Onkyo handling the 7 speakers and 2 subs?
What kind of price range would there be being a secondary receiver?
How does it run in tandem with av receiver, does it plug into it or do you split HDMI from cable box/dvd player into each receiver?

Any help is greatly appreciated!!
You need a receiver or processor that can process 11 channels. Currently the Denon 4400 (on discount) or the new 3600. I think the Onkyo 740 and 840 can process 11 channel setups. They both have the pre-outs for it. You would need to read te manuals.

Any of those would need a separate amp to power the last to channels as they only have 9 internal amps. Not sure if your 575 has preouts. If it does you can use that to power a pair of surrounds or overhead speakers.

The price to get an AVR that has 11 amps is a huge jump over the 9 channel AVRs.

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post #3 of 15 Old 08-06-2019, 04:22 PM
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while technically possible to use the existing 575 to drive a couple of Atmos/surround speakers, it is not worth the hassle. 1) switching it on.. you would be better off getting a pio/onk/int unit that can process 11 channels. if it is 9 amp unit, then get an outboard 2 channel amp (audiosource amp100vs/etc) and be done.

the 11 channel processing capbility with 9 on boards amps and using an outboard amp for the last 2 channels usually turns out cheaper than a unit with 11 on board amps.

all is not lost, however, with the 575.

since it is networked and in the play-fi ecosystem, you can use it to drive another room or zone. And that is the reason I am recommending you stay in that ecosystem, so you can maximize your sunk cost in the 575.

hope it helps

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post #4 of 15 Old 08-06-2019, 05:05 PM - Thread Starter
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So for my theater you both are saying that the 575 is not useable and try to re-purpose it to another room in the house?

Having spent almost $50k on the project which includes not only the theater but a wetbar in main area and finished bedroom, any recommendations for the most affordable receiver and secondary amp to deliver the 7.4.2 setup I had installed? Sorry but this Atmos is new to me and the 575 would have served me fine for a 7.2 system alone. The 4 ceiling speakers were an afterthought post receiver purchase so I thought there might be a temp solution until a true 11.2 receiver comes affordable?
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post #5 of 15 Old 08-07-2019, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Scosdaddy View Post
So for my theater you both are saying that the 575 is not useable and try to re-purpose it to another room in the house?

Having spent almost $50k on the project which includes not only the theater but a wetbar in main area and finished bedroom, any recommendations for the most affordable receiver and secondary amp to deliver the 7.4.2 setup I had installed? Sorry but this Atmos is new to me and the 575 would have served me fine for a 7.2 system alone. The 4 ceiling speakers were an afterthought post receiver purchase so I thought there might be a temp solution until a true 11.2 receiver comes affordable?
If you've already sunk $50K what's another $2?

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_033AVX...VR-X6500H.html

Perhaps the convenience of an all in one solution is worth it.

Or you can get a 9 channel AVR for less than $600 and just don't use the rear surrounds for now. They don't do much with most content anyway.

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post #6 of 15 Unread 08-14-2019, 02:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post
If you've already sunk $50K what's another $2?

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_033AVX...VR-X6500H.html

Perhaps the convenience of an all in one solution is worth it.

Or you can get a 9 channel AVR for less than $600 and just don't use the rear surrounds for now. They don't do much with most content anyway.

Are there any other all in ones for my setup that are under $2k?

9.2ch for under $600. Always read about a secondary amp to run the atmos speakers which would be 2pairs in the ceiling with my theater. Any recommendations for going that route?
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post #7 of 15 Unread 08-14-2019, 03:02 PM
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@Scosdaddy are you referring to single solution 11 channel box? Then yes, the Denon x6400 and x6500 can be had for that.


Yes, 9.2 expanding to 11 can be had for less than that as well, here you go!

Onkyo tx-rz730/740 and 830/840
Pioneer vsx-lx503
Denon x4400 is slightly above your target budget.
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post #8 of 15 Unread 08-14-2019, 03:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eriksells916 View Post
@Scosdaddy are you referring to single solution 11 channel box? Then yes, the Denon x6400 and x6500 can be had for that.


Yes, 9.2 expanding to 11 can be had for less than that as well, here you go!

Onkyo tx-rz730/740 and 830/840
Pioneer vsx-lx503
Denon x4400 is slightly above your target budget.
Yes I was referring to a single solution 11ch box.

I currently have a 7.2 receiver, the Onkyo TX-NR575. Can I use that to add on to for getting a full 7.4.2 setup? I have 2 pairs of ceiling speakers to use for atmos and 7 speakers (FR/FL, Ctr, SR/SL, RR/RL) and 2 subs.

Trying to figure out best and cheapest way to accomplish using all 11 speakers and 2 subs and using my Onkyo if possible. If not something cheaper until the single solution receivers come down in price.

Ideas?
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post #9 of 15 Unread 08-14-2019, 04:28 PM
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@Scosdaddy you cannot use it for more than 2 channels as it doesn't have multi channel preins but in theory you can use it as an amp to power any of those 2 speakers on the base level. However, there is a catch. Your current receiver needs to have preouts for those 2 channels and it needs to allow amp assign, iirc.

From what I have read the onkyo tx-rz730/740, 830/840 and cousin vsx-lx503/504 only allow you to add external power for the rear heights in a 7.2.4 configuration. It doesn't have amp assign, which doesn't make sense to me since there are 11 preouts, so why even have them?

Now the Denon x4400/4500 on the other hand is supposed to have amp assign to power any speakers with external amplification. So for example you could use the x4400/4500 to power 9 channels and let the 575 power 2 more.

There was just another thread from a guy who really wanted to do 11 base channels but I think the general consensus was that 5/7.1.6 was the next best thing.

Someone with more than a simple set up like mine will probably have to verify first. Google beyond 7.1.4 atmos and look at that thread, it's amazing! See pic for wiring ideas for your 575.
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post #10 of 15 Unread 08-15-2019, 06:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank You everyone for your ideas.

Looks like these are the single box options I've seen on top 10 lists out there for a 7.2.4 setup (which i have already wired into completed theater walls):

Denon AVR-X6400H 11.2-Ch $1,499 on Amazon...says "discontinued by manufacturer". Is that a killing point to consider it like they won't do warranty work?

Denon AVR-X6500H 11.2-Ch $2,199 on Amazon

Onkyo PR-RZ5100 THX-Certified 11.2-Ch $1,299 on Amazon...called a "Pre-Amplifier" not receiver but says it can do my setup

Onkyo TX-RZ3100 THX-Certified 11.2-Ch $2,137 on Amazon..has a 'con' of low power-140 W/Ch (8 Ohms, 1 kHz, 0.08% THD, 2 Channels Driven). Power is quoted at only 1 kHz, rather than the usual 20 Hz–20 kHz

Pioneer SC-LX901 Elite 11.2-Ch AV Receiver $1,682.49 on Amazon...has a 'con' of No Hybrid Log-Gamma (HLG) pass-through


Onkyos have THX certification plus Wi-Fi, AirPlay, Bluetooth and Chromecast.
Denons have Alexa, echos, etc

Was going to use my Onkyo for 7.2 and not using the height speakers til the $2k prices come down for a single solution. But now seeing the 5100 above for $1,299, Denon for $1,499, and Pioneer for $1,683 more enticing to perhaps pop for one. Are these old and inferior to the ones at the $2k price point?
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post #11 of 15 Unread 08-15-2019, 01:07 PM
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@Scosdaddy the x6400 is an awesome piece of equipment. however if you like Onkyo, get your amex out...https://www.onkyousa.com/product/web-only/tx-rz3100-2/
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post #12 of 15 Unread 08-16-2019, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
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@Scosdaddy the x6400 is an awesome piece of equipment. however if you like Onkyo, get your amex out...https://www.onkyousa.com/product/web-only/tx-rz3100-2/
Wow its much cheaper on Onkyo's website. Now they are the same price. You think the discontinued Denon is better? Would they even warranty that model?

The THX certification of the Onkyo sounds good to me.
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post #13 of 15 Unread 08-16-2019, 02:47 PM
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@Scosdaddy yes looks like the rz3100 comes with a full 3yr warranty. It is a few years older and only has 5 hdcp 2.2 inputs, but is their flagship avr and has class D power, so keep that in mind.

x6400 is newer, a lot more inputs that are all hdmi 2.0b (earc) and a little warmer sounding with xt32 and class AB power.

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post #14 of 15 Unread 08-16-2019, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eriksells916 View Post
@Scosdaddy yes looks like the rz3100 comes with a full 3yr warranty. It is a few years older and only has 5 hdcp 2.2 inputs, but is their flagship avr and has class D power, so keep that in mind.

x6400 is newer, a lot more inputs that are all hdmi 2.0b (earc) and a little warmer sounding with xt32 and class AB power.
The Denon 6400 is the one that is discontinued and i worry about a warranty. The newer model is the 6500 listed at $2,199 on Amazon.

The Onkyo is not discontinued and is available for same price as the Denon. Was curious if anyone has heard both an would recommend for my setup of 7.2.4 in a dedicated theater 13.5ft wide and 23ft deep.
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post #15 of 15 Unread 08-16-2019, 04:21 PM
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@Scosdaddy oh yea where are you buying it from? I think only used on Ebay or from a 3rd party will have no warranty. AC4L usually has 1 year.

The x6400 had a firmware update in May 2019 and rz3100 in July so looks like they are both still being supported.

Looking through all of these rz3100 vs x6300 threads is tough. One person says the Onkyo is 12lbs heavier and Class D and it kicks the Denon's ass all day. Then the next guy says he had both and the Denon is much better sounding, is warmer, has better bass and is much better for movies.

Good luck!
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