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post #991 of 1915 Old 04-13-2020, 02:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steakhouse_ View Post
Right. Plus I would not boost below 40Hz and also follow the natural roll off there.
Probably doesn't matter much as there's bass management filters applied on top of the DL filters so the speaker doesn't see much content down there anyway.

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post #992 of 1915 Old 04-13-2020, 02:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meetloaf13 View Post
I actually just ran DIRAC for my first time. If I'm reading this correctly, it looks like my Revel F206s were already on the curve pretty well, and the SW had a few dips that will be boosted (really un-ideal room)? The other big issues I think i'm seeing won't be relevant because I have the speakers set to small, and the crossover at 80, so sound won't be playing out of either group at the most offending frequencies. Am I reading this right?

Thanks!
Yep. More detailed discussion: https://mehlau.net/audio/dirac-live-2-avr-crossover/
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post #993 of 1915 Old 04-13-2020, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Basically you want the response to follow the intended target curve and set the crossover frequency according to your speaker's capabilities. If you experience "harshness" then your speakers aren't up for the task. Get better speakers!
So you boost above where the speaker naturally rolls off? I would of thought this would increase distortion.

I myself do not correct above 5K as microphones such as the UMIK-1 / UMM-6 are know even with a calibration file to be inaccurate at the higher frequencies.

The speaker is well in control at this point so I rely on my room treatments.

To get a microphone that is truly accurate at these frequencies you are going to be spending well into the four figures.

Partially also due to having to use the microphone at 90 degrees & also how microphones interpret sound compared to humans.

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post #994 of 1915 Old 04-13-2020, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
So you boost above where the speaker naturally rolls off? I would of thought this would increase distortion.
You mean below the frequency the speaker rolls off? Yes I do – within the capabilities of the speaker. If you don't you might create a hole in the combined (sub + sat) frequency response.

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I myself do not correct above 5K as microphones such as the UMIK-1 / UMM-6 are know even with a calibration file to be inaccurate at the higher frequencies.
The speaker calibration file is what makes it accurate. Or are you talking about mic directivity? Even very expensive microphones have some sort of directivity (on purpose or because of physics).

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To get a microphone that is truly accurate at these frequencies you are going to be spending well into the four figures.
The difference is insignificant for our purpose. Even cheap mics will do when they are calibrated.

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Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
Partially also due to having to use the microphone at 90 degrees & also how microphones interpret sound compared to humans.
?? That's why we have tools like Dirac Live that interpret measured data for us.
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post #995 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
You mean below the frequency the speaker rolls off? Yes I do – within the capabilities of the speaker. If you don't you might create a hole in the combined (sub + sat) frequency response.
I was referring more to the higher frequencies where roll off occurs instead of using a flat target curve to 20,000Hz.

I was watching the video below about EQ & what Matthew Poes thinks about the microphones in this price bracket.


Starts at 22:30.

Interested to hear your thoughts on this.
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post #996 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 03:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAttewell View Post
I was referring more to the higher frequencies where roll off occurs instead of using a flat target curve to 20,000Hz.

I was watching the video below about EQ & what Matthew Poes thinks about the microphones in this price bracket.

[...]

Starts at 22:30.

Interested to hear your thoughts on this.
Larger than 10dB error?!? Pretty sure he or DL did something wrong. There's no way to see that kind of deviation with a proper mic calibration file.
Error at lower frequencies is usually noise. Easy to spot when you do successive measurements and see increasing magnitude response differences.
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post #997 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 10:51 AM
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As a whole, are you all happy with your Arcam gear? Do you think they will fix their current issues and become more reliable?
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post #998 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 10:53 AM
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is anything in hifi getting fixed during covid19???doubt it.

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300 LG oled c9 77
Speakers: Focal aria 948, Focal cc900, Klipsch synergy KSF 10.5, Magnepan LRS, Audioengine A2+
Subs: Rythmik FV25HP, Rythmik FV15HP, Velodyne HGS 12, Velodyne VA1512
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post #999 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 12:05 PM
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Based on past cadence of updates (every 2 weeks) there should have been an update within the past 2-4 days. I’m guessing we won’t see any more updates until the lockdown is lifted in the UK.
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post #1000 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:07 PM
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Regarding Dirac Filters, I am using the Harman Default curve for all my speakers (and the Harman Large subwoofer curve for the sub). Does it matter how low I set the filters on the speakers since I am also using bass management with 80Hz crossover?

For instance, the Harman curves default to the curtains starting at 18Hz for all speakers. Obviously not going to ever play that low but I was too lazy to change them. This isn't an issue since the crossover is set to 80Hz anyways, right?
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post #1001 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post
Regarding Dirac Filters, I am using the Harman Default curve for all my speakers (and the Harman Large subwoofer curve for the sub). Does it matter how low I set the filters on the speakers since I am also using bass management with 80Hz crossover?

For instance, the Harman curves default to the curtains starting at 18Hz for all speakers. Obviously not going to ever play that low but I was too lazy to change them. This isn't an issue since the crossover is set to 80Hz anyways, right?
https://mehlau.net/audio/dirac-live-2-avr-crossover/

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post #1002 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

I get how to set them and all that, my question (which the article doesn't address) is if it is OK to just leave the Dirac correction curtain as low as possible since the speaker will never need to play that low based on bass management or if having low curtains will still result in unnecessary computational power/issues?
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post #1003 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post
I get how to set them and all that, my question (which the article doesn't address) is if it is OK to just leave the Dirac correction curtain as low as possible since the speaker will never need to play that low based on bass management or if having low curtains will still result in unnecessary computational power/issues?
The article does address the question. Not sure what you mean by "unnecessary computational power/issues".

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post #1004 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
The article does address the question. Not sure what you mean by "unnecessary computational power/issues".

I know coming from Anthem ARC that if you confined the correction area you could get "better" results (flatter frequency response to the target curve) due to more points of correction being available. Wasn't sure if this is the same with Dirac?
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post #1005 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post
I know coming from Anthem ARC that if you confined the correction area you could get "better" results (flatter frequency response to the target curve) due to more points of correction being available. Wasn't sure if this is the same with Dirac?
DL filter resolution is the same regardless of where you set curtains.

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post #1006 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
DL filter resolution is the same regardless of where you set curtains.

Ah thanks. So in the article you posted I see where it says to just "delete the control points below the 1 octave point of the crossover" so for an 80Hz crossover, just delete any points under 40Hz. But based on your response quoted here, it also doesn't really matter does it? As in, following the curve even down to 20Hz for my mains (meaning they are being boosted to fit the curve even that low by DL) makes no difference since the crossover is set to 80Hz?



I am merely wondering if I need to go back and change my curtains to end at the 1 octave point or if it doesn't actually matter that they go lower.
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post #1007 of 1915 Old 04-14-2020, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post
Ah thanks. So in the article you posted I see where it says to just "delete the control points below the 1 octave point of the crossover" so for an 80Hz crossover, just delete any points under 40Hz. But based on your response quoted here, it also doesn't really matter does it? As in, following the curve even down to 20Hz for my mains (meaning they are being boosted to fit the curve even that low by DL) makes no difference since the crossover is set to 80Hz?



I am merely wondering if I need to go back and change my curtains to end at the 1 octave point or if it doesn't actually matter that they go lower.
At 20Hz the response is already reduced by 48dB because of bass management filters (assuming a 80Hz crossover). So not really necessary to use curtains or "draw" a subsonic filter using the target curve.
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post #1008 of 1915 Old 04-17-2020, 08:05 AM
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V1.24 is out


Fix list: IMS20780: Show album art.

IMS20890: IMAX Enhanced fixes.

IMS20910: When front display set to off, also turn off backlight.

IMS21071: Implement Auro-3D.

IMS21377: If clipping occurs with Dirac calibration, there are audio artefacts on exit.

IMS21382: In Dirac level setting screen there is a noise from the other speaker before selected speaker.

IMS21410: Mode direct IR commands fixed.

IMS21411: No unsolicited messages on mode change.

IMS21431: RS232/IP Display information type (0x09) does not respond.

IMS21433: RS232/IP Stereo mode (0x10) always returns mono. IMS21539: Adjust level to match “mid green” setting for Dirac calibration

IMS21434: RS232/IP MCH mode (0x11) always returns mono.

IMS21508: Implement periodic LF sweep for subwoofer Dirac calibration level setting.

IMS21545: If subwoofer set to none, L/R forced to large, even if Ch13/14 and/or Ch15/16 set to subs. IMS21549: Auto-standby disabled during update.

IMS21553: AMP+RIGHT toggles HDMI Zone1 outputs.

IMS21557: Sub distance lost for Dirac off when toggling Dirac on/off.

ISM21574: Increase time counter to 999:99 minutes for internet radio.

IMS21590: Disable all gains/delays/processing when running Dirac capture.

IMS21595: Add Power, volume & mode controls to web GUI. IMS21644: RTN key (sub trim) has no effect if ch13/14 or ch13-16 only set as subs.
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post #1009 of 1915 Old 04-17-2020, 08:36 AM
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A filter export issue for some sample rates that was not detected in Dirac Live 2.5.2 has just been fixed in update 2.5.3... immediately available:
https://live.dirac.com/download/
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Warning: My posts might be biased even if in good faith, I work for Dirac Research :-)
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post #1010 of 1915 Old 04-17-2020, 09:47 AM
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Warning: My posts might be biased even if in good faith, I work for Dirac Research :-)
That's nice, someone from Dirac to ask.. i hope you don't mind the ot-Question.
Why isn't it possible to edit a project, while the System you want to edit it for, is offline?
Is that a technical issue or a licensing issue?
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post #1011 of 1915 Old 04-18-2020, 03:27 AM - Thread Starter
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V1.24 is out
[...]
IMS21071: Implement Auro-3D.

So this is the first firmware version that Auro-3D is available on. Has anybody tried it out yet?
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post #1012 of 1915 Old 04-18-2020, 03:57 AM
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So this is the first firmware version that Auro-3D is available on. Has anybody tried it out yet?
Some Guys on German Facebook are currently onto it.
One already pointed out his hapiness with Auro.
And in the JBL SDP 55 Section on this forum some guys are already pointing out, that Auro is working great.
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post #1013 of 1915 Old 04-18-2020, 03:54 PM
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I tried 1.24 and liked the potential but I went back to 1.22. With Dirac on, I got sound cutting in and out using dts and the new auro3d processing. It worked when i turned dirac off. I'll wait for the next update.
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post #1014 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
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Hello,

I have 2 subs.

If I use SUB1 and SUB2, it's basically a splitted channel.
If I want independent calibration (volume and distance) by Dirac.

Is it better to put the first Subwoofer into sub1, and the second in channel 13-14 using a Y cable: ("Front subs)
Or using both front subs channels, 13 & 14, for both subs, and discard the "sub" channel ?

I'm afraid the second solution will remove the LFE...

I have a 7.2.4 setup. I had used sub xlr out and channel 16 xlr out for the second sub, but the two channel outputs were more than ten dB different requiring a lot of level setting compensation.

So now I am trying sub out off. I connected the left sub to 13 xlr and the right sub to 14 xlr with those set as front subs. I also now have my bass shakers connected to 15 and 16 rca with those set as rear subs.

Does this setup sound right? I haven’t experimented enough to know if turning off sub out itself loses LFE.
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post #1015 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 01:03 AM
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I haven’t experimented enough to know if turning off sub out itself loses LFE.
I'm sorry, what do you mean by losing LFE?
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post #1016 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 01:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitiqx4 View Post
I haven’️t experimented enough to know if turning off sub out itself loses LFE.
I'm sorry, what do you mean by losing LFE?
IE if you set sub out to none but use 13/14 for subs, do they still get the .1 LFE/sub track data?

I am pretty sure it is getting the bass management correct by routing other bass data to the subs. IE taking the <80hz frequencies from the center and surrounds that are set to ‘small’. But that isn’t the same source as the .1 track

I don’t think I have any tracks to test this.
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post #1017 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 02:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bachelor View Post
I tried 1.24 and liked the potential but I went back to 1.22. With Dirac on, I got sound cutting in and out using dts and the new auro3d processing. It worked when i turned dirac off. I'll wait for the next update.
I think the new FW, is pretty good, I haven't used the Auro3d yet and haeb't noticed anything wrong with DTS, I'll check the DST again later to confirm.
The Dirac calibration is much better now, Sub levels are now correct, Clipping is less of issue.

And I reconnected the MiniDsp and it works just fine, I don't know what was the issue before but it's working as it should anyway.
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post #1018 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitiqx4 View Post
IE if you set sub out to none but use 13/14 for subs, do they still get the .1 LFE/sub track data?

I am pretty sure it is getting the bass management correct by routing other bass data to the subs. IE taking the <80hz frequencies from the center and surrounds that are set to ‘small’. But that isn’t the same source as the .1 track

I don’t think I have any tracks to test this.

From what i think, normal or correct behaviour would be, if you are using two subs left and right front, in Stereomode you will get a "small" Frontspeaker, with a subwoofer for lower frequencies on each side.
Whren you have a LFE-Signal on any AVR and there is no Subwoofer, the LFE should be added to the front speaker. So in this case it will be added to your frontspeakers, which are small and it will obvously be processed by your subwoofers.
Everything else would be quite disturbing.
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post #1019 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 04:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy2Shoes View Post

I think the new FW, is pretty good, I haven't used the Auro3d yet and haeb't noticed anything wrong with DTS, I'll check the DST again later to confirm.
The Dirac calibration is much better now, Sub levels are now correct, Clipping is less of issue.

And I reconnected the MiniDsp and it works just fine, I don't know what was the issue before but it's working as it should anyway.
Interesting....

I didn't do a new dirac calibration with v1.24. I just loaded the one i did with v1.22. I wonder if that is the issue and i should rerun dirac after loading 1.24???

When you push the mode button and go to auro 3d playing any content does it work with dirac on? My sound would cut in and out and the processor was sluggish with switching between modes. DTS had the same behavior. Dolby tracks were fine.
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post #1020 of 1915 Old 04-19-2020, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bachelor View Post
I tried 1.24 and liked the potential but I went back to 1.22. With Dirac on, I got sound cutting in and out using dts and the new auro3d processing. It worked when i turned dirac off. I'll wait for the next update.
I get similar, with DTS HD I get problems with the unit becoming unresponsive (Dolby TrueHD or Atmos is fine). Also the top back right channel goes missing if Dirac is enabled and the TBL and VOG are missing if using Auro 11.1 and Dirac is enabled. I tried recalibrating and the calibration was perfect so they do at least seem to have Dirac calibration nailed in 1.24 but lock up and missing channel problems remained.

Are you using a fairly large speaker set? I'm using 7.1.6(CH/VOG)

Last edited by Krobar; 04-19-2020 at 06:54 AM.
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