The "Official" Monoprice Monolith HTP-1 Owners Thread - Page 55 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1621 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Any significant changes when bass management is engaged and the number of speakers is increased?
No significant changes that I could see as I was validating/monitoring and setting up for the parallel testing. With the APx-585 I could actually test 8 processors in parallel, 1ch. The AP PDM 16 option can support up to 16!

They just rescheduled my Dr. appt. I should be able to capture some 7.1 tests on each processor.

I need to start a Patreon to help me purchase an APx. I only need about $20k towards a 585! But seriously, I am talking to the local AP rep about the entry-level APx-515. I have fallen in love with the APx500 software. I never want to touch another analyzer interface again (except for acoustic measurements: Smaart and REW).
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post #1622 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
Hi Mark,

I'm no EE, but is the test methodology consistent with the Trinnov (and Storm?) Pro-level i.e. +4dBu output level? AFAICT all others are consumer level, -10dBv.
↑These low levels are nominal and don't really have any real world significance. See below for the levels I felt make the most sense to test. I will perform some sweeps to determine the optimal levels for each. Time permitting, I will also test the NAD M15HD which is the unbalanced version of the M17 (which ASR @amirm tested). It should measure lower than the M17 (up to 6dB), but it doesn't seem to. Then I've agreed to send it to @amirm .

The Trinnov and Bryston/Storm perform relatively poorly at +4dBu (1.23Vrms). This is the HTP-1's optimal region, about +4dBu to +10dBu (2.5V). The others are starting to catch up as levels rise. The Trinnov's peak performance occurs close to it's limit of +18dBu (6.15V). The Storm maxes out around +21dBu.

The Lyngdorf incredibly keeps rising all the way to 16Vrms which I believe where the APx maxes out (it is only rated at 5Vrms max). I may have to connect a scope to determine if it goes any higher before clipping.

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Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
I believe testing at the following levels should cover everyone's needs.

0 dBV = 1V (rms)
6 dBu = 1.55V
6 dBV = 2V
12 dBu = 3.1V
12 dBV = 4V
*18 dBu = 6.15V
*18dBV = 8V
*24dBu = 12.3V
*24dBV = 16V

*if supported.
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post #1623 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Thanks for posting these. Especially for the ITU-R 468 graph as it correlates better to what we actually hear.
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Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
ITU-R 468
What I am learning from this is that most of these numbers have very little to do with actual in room performance. The room dominates! Most people are better off hiring an HAA pro (@appelz, @desertdome , @Marc Alexander , etc.) to calibrate rather than assuming money spent on hardware will provide greater performance. Even better is to hire someone (HAA, @Nyal Mellor , etc.) to assist in equipment selection, placement (speakers and seating).

The cost of these processers is not directly tied to component costs but the software development, licensing and processing.

The HTP-1 is still a work in progress but IMO it is already serious threat to the 16ch Bryston/Storm SP4 and Focal/Storm Astral 16. This is with far less development time [so far] than StormAudio and Trinnov.

This Bryston SP4 under test is for sale (being replaced by HTP-1). I'll be posting it in the classifieds tonight.

I'm not planning to replace the Trinnov (except with another Trinnov) but perhaps that day is coming.
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post #1624 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
2.0 large/XL no DSP
May I ask the input impedance setting of the AP gear?

20K ohms would be good as detailed in a previous post. If 100K ohms or so is used than this presents a much easier load than the pre-pro's will encounter in actual use.
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post #1625 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post
A $4,000 AVR should destroy a $9 unit in every possible measurement.
Play a Dolby Atmos bitstream into the $9 dongle and report back.

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post #1626 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
Play a Dolby Atmos bitstream into the $9 dongle and report back.
I'm glad we agree.

Why is there NO perfect equipment, only compromises?
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post #1627 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post
I agree with your assessment that Amirm does one-pass testing and may come to a hasty conclusion. However, no one has offered an iota of evidence that his review is wrong and he responds to all comments.

So instead of hastily assuming the HTP-1 is flawed and instead of hastily assuming we should ignore the only real tests done on this unit, why don't we head over to the review and post intelligent questions to try to get to the bottom of this. Personally I won't buy a $4,000 unit that has the flaws he may have found.
The whole rant about the HTP-1 truncating 24-bit audio to 16-bit was not correct, neither was his assessment of what was going on. Then the "correction" is a few pages deep into the thread. There is only a small EDIT pointing to the post, yet all of the original review and criticisms remain in the original review.
Spoiler!

IMO this is not cool. @amirm is a trusted advisor and I feel that some responsibility comes along with that. There are many impressionable consumers that have no technical understanding who will read the review and just latch on to "the HTP-1 is only 16-bits".

I am going to encourage @amirm to edit his original review.
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post #1628 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
@amirm is a trusted advisor and I feel that some responsibility comes along with that. There are many impressionable consumers that have no technical understanding who will read the review and just latch on to "the HTP-1 is only 16-bits".

I am going to encourage @amirm to edit his original review.
While the HTP-1 is not a perfect product, I agree with you that it shouldn't be a headless pink panther. What I would like to know, if I purchase one, how do I avoid the issue amirm discovered? Is it simply setting the volume below a certain parameter?
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post #1629 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
The whole rant about the HTP-1 truncating 24-bit audio to 16-bit was not correct, neither was his assessment of what was going on. Then the "correction" is a few pages deep into the thread. There is only a small EDIT pointing to the post, yet all of the original review and criticisms remain in the original review.
Spoiler!

IMO this is not cool. @amirm is a trusted advisor and I feel that some responsibility comes along with that. There are many impressionable consumers that have no technical understanding who will read the review and just latch on to "the HTP-1 is only 16-bits".

I am going to encourage @amirm to edit his original review.
Amir said he was going to update his review to correct the "mute" issue in his post below, but I guess he forgot.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-4#post-326492

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post #1630 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 02:42 PM
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Many thanks to @Marc Alexander and others for their help in getting to the facts here.
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post #1631 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post
While the HTP-1 is not a perfect product, I agree with you that it shouldn't be a headless pink panther. What I would like to know, if I purchase one, how do I avoid the issue amirm discovered? Is it simply setting the volume below a certain parameter?
To avoid the behavior (not an issue), there is a user adjustable setting.


The behavior is not at all like initially characterized (only 16-bit, not 24). It is simply an erroneous reading by the analyzer. The digital stream must be identified and properly decoded before outputting any audio, to avoid [potentially speaker damaging] noise. Emotiva has had issues with DSD streams doing this.

There are usually delay & settling parameters in the analyzer to prevent this behavior. The newer APx-500 series does not appear to exhibit this behavior at its defaults, but it does defined settling parameters engaged by default.
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post #1632 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 03:31 PM
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In the Amir's review multitone was measured with 4 volts. Wouldn't that also be much better with lower voltage? So that leaves just jitter. Is it going to be the same with all inputs or would HDMI perform differently? Is @Marc Alexander able to test those points with his AP system?
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post #1633 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
The whole rant about the HTP-1 truncating 24-bit audio to 16-bit was not correct, neither was his assessment of what was going on. Then the "correction" is a few pages deep into the thread. There is only a small EDIT pointing to the post, yet all of the original review and criticisms remain in the original review.
Spoiler!

IMO this is not cool. @amirm is a trusted advisor and I feel that some responsibility comes along with that. There are many impressionable consumers that have no technical understanding who will read the review and just latch on to "the HTP-1 is only 16-bits".

I am going to encourage @amirm to edit his original review.

Amir's site is somewhat technical. Almost everything audio on the Internet is very dumbed-down. Does Amir's site have to fit that mode as well? Does very AV site have to be written for the most technically challenged? Why should Amir cater to, and many of us have to read a site that is dumbed down for; "impressionable consumers that have to technical understanding?"

Also Amir's site is Amir's site. Amir provides measurements and gives a few opinions. Like any other side on the Internet, if you don't like the site don't go there. Also note; Absolute Sound subscriptions are available at very low cost.

Also note, it is hard to be a fan of Amir's site if you are a fanboy of any product. Overtime Amir will upset almost everyone. Lose objectivity and visit Amir's site and you'll likely soon have an unpleasant time.
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post #1634 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post
While the HTP-1 is not a perfect product, I agree with you that it shouldn't be a headless pink panther. What I would like to know, if I purchase one, how do I avoid the issue amirm discovered? Is it simply setting the volume below a certain parameter?

That is Amir's opinion. Certainly he is entitled to his opinion. Amir gives headless pink panthers to many products with what are good results. Have you actually read much of the Audio Science site.

Here is one example of product with fabulous measurements:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-review.10986/

Amir says, "So overall the Auralic Vega G2 is fine but can't get my recommendation due to its performance relative to its cost."

No doubt Auralic fanboys aren't happy about that. But hopefully they get over it. It is just his opinion. Sometimes cost matters, sometimes not. Some time appearance is important, sometime not. Are his opinions always consistent? Not as far as I can tell, but so what, the data is there. The data is there so that the reader can form his own opinion. The comments that follow the reviews often take other positions, pro and con on any one product. The comments should also be read as well. Sometime the comment even have measurements by others.

If you insist on being spoon-fed, and perhaps more importantly if you want someone else to make judgements for you, then Amir's site isn't for you IMO.
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post #1635 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguyca View Post
That is Amir's opinion. Certainly he is entitled to his opinion. Amir gives headless pink panthers to many products with what are good results. Have you actually read much of the Audio Science site.

Here is one example of product with fabulous measurements:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-review.10986/

Amir says, "So overall the Auralic Vega G2 is fine but can't get my recommendation due to its performance relative to its cost."

No doubt Auralic fanboys aren't happy about that. But hopefully they get over it. It is just his opinion. Sometimes cost matters, sometimes not. Some time appearance is important, sometime not. Are his opinions always consistent? Not as far as I can tell, but so what, the data is there. The data is there so that the reader can form his own opinion. The comments that follow the reviews often take other positions, pro and con on any one product. The comments should also be read as well. Sometime the comment even have measurements by others.

If you insist on being spoon-fed, and perhaps more importantly if you want someone else to make judgements for you, then Amir's site isn't for you IMO.
But the Auralic gets a positive review and a happy pink panther. I’m a contributor to the site , both a donor and a contributor, and I’m entitled to my opinion that the HTP-1 deserves a recommendation even if Amirm thinks otherwise, which is the antithesis to being spoon fed.
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post #1636 of 1726 Old 02-14-2020, 08:24 PM
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I don't even own an HTP-1 and I feel like Amir is being unnecessarily harsh on the HTP-1 because of his opinions of AVRs/AVPs. Basically, he will never give them a good review as they will never meet his standards. In the end that means all we can really do with his test results is compare AVR/AVP to AVR/AVP and currently that puts the HTP-1 on top according to the results. The only legitimate complaint that he seems to have uncovered is in relation to the confusing "Amp Sensitivity" setting which is ambiguous at best and possibly a work-around for a poorly implemented volume control system at worst.

I also agree that it is a bit disingenuous to leave the 16-bit claim in the review when he was obviously mistaken (not only was it not related to bits, it can be easily resolved by changing a setting clearly defined in the user manual). It's his site and he can do as he pleases, but such events serve as a footnote against his credibility and only reveal his bias against AVRs/AVPs IMO.



Getting away from Amir and back to the volume system; If what @bigguyca discovered is true, I wonder if Monoprice will release a revision to the board that fixes the design issue? That might dig into the profit margin a fair bit though so maybe that's not even in the realm of possibilities.
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post #1637 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 08:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99rook99 View Post
I see that they have updated the manual as of today
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Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Yes, all Emotiva amps. Are you running just Emos or do you have another brand. Subwoofers? I do suggest running Dirac again once you have polarity sorted.
I wanted to follow up on this. As I posted earlier, audyssey did not report any phase problems with my system. I am using an emotiva xpa 5 gen 1 and an outlaw 7000x in a 7.1.4 setup with Marantz 8805. I reversed the speakers at the speaker outputs of the emotiva amp as you suggested and auyssey now reports the 5 speakers connected to the emo all as out of phase. I think it may just be the gen 3 emotiva amps that have the pins reversed.

I found a couple of threads on the emotiva forum where the same findings were reported when using older emotiva amps. I am paranoid now and may just switch to rca cables.
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post #1638 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 08:42 AM
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I agree but the question was "why does a $9 dongle outperform a $4000 processor"? I doubt it's the BOM or licensing fees or extremely expensive manufacturing in countries like China
Does it? The dongle is measured with 1v whereas the htp 1 is having the same level of sinad with 2.7v.
There are some inconsistencies with amirs league table as the output level is not always the same. There are also some avr reported with 1.5v (eg Yamaha 1080) whereas others with their 2v levels (eg denon x3500). It is good to have someone done this since almost all reviews of that stuff is dumbed down but he needs proper peer due diligence of his results.
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post #1639 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 10:26 AM
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@MonolithGuy Is the two channel mix down output working yet? I don't think that it is.

It would be nice if it could be configured for fixed output level. I'd treat it as a tape out to feed my multi-room audio system (Sonos).

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post #1640 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 10:33 AM
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@MonolithGuy Is the two channel mix down output working yet? I don't think that it is.

It would be nice if it could be configured for fixed output level. I'd treat it as a tape out to feed my multi-room audio system (Sonos).
It was enabled and then turned off in the final V1.3 release (2-10--2020).

These features are not yet ready. The are to be enabled by software updates.

USB Audio (USB DAC function) not yet supported.
The secondary “downmix” output remains disabled in v1.3 pending a fix to mute transition noise.
Alexa Smart Home Skill has not yet been certified by Amazon so you cannot find it in the Alexa stores.
You cannot yet configure WiFi connectivity from the front panel: You must configure it through the wired Ethernet.
Roon compliance not complete.
WiFi causes dropouts on BlueTooth. Turn off WiFi to use BlueTooth.
Bluetooth audio can have (subtle) glitches. This is a software issue.
Some infrared remote keys (color, ABCD, 1234, BT Pair) are not implemented.
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post #1641 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 10:35 AM
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HTP-1 Release Notes, version 1.3
February 10, 2020


Welcome to version 1.3. The following bugs have been tested and found to have been fixed by the developers:

541: Static IP assignment not working. The procedure to select a static IP address was broken in v1.2. It is restored here.
557: Dirac trim sliders not consistent or remembered. When adjusting the channel trims in the Dirac Live tool, the trim settings were not remembered and applied for the calibration. This is corrected.
355: Limit precision of displayed Dirac trim. The UI is updated to show the correct amount of precision.
561: Subwoofer redirect level doesn’t scale with sub number. Now the redirected signal is scaled just like the LFE signal when the number of subs changes.
560: PEQ parser doesn’t accept decimal point frequency. In previous versions, specifying a non-integer frequency to PEQ would result in a bad filter setup.
463: Blasting volume slider. When the volume slider was selected it was possible to get the volume “stuck” at full volume. The volume slider is reworked and this no longer happens. (new volume config?)
553: Update the master volume when the amp sense is changed. In previous versions, changing the amplifier sensitivity did not immediately change the output volume. Now it does.
DTS:X to DTS 192k transition: Playing a DTS:X stream and switching to a DTS-MA 192k stream with the sample rate converter engaged (Dirac or upmix) would not play correctly. Fixed.
Do not turn off bass management on exiting Dirac early: Previously exiting the Dirac Live tool before completing the calibration would turn off the bass manager.
User Guide updates. Download version 1.3 from the help page and see the Revision History for what has changed.
IR remote code over HTTP support has been added. See below.
The ‘Speaker Map’ link on the ‘System Configuration/SPEAKERS’ page links to a picture of the back panel overlaid with the speaker mappings. This shows the correct XLR connectors for the particular channels if they were enabled. If the speaker is not enabled, no sound will be produced.

Open Issues

The HTP-1 software team expects to continue updating this product for some time. The team expects to address the list of open issues.

Anomalies

523: Glitches in the audio stream from BlueTooth and Roon. This is most easily observed using a sine wave as a test source.
556: When no subwoofer is provided, the signal provided to the large speakers seem like a mono feed. This is because a bass redirection filter is not running. As a work around, declare a subwoofer and make all speakers small with the minimum 40Hz cutoff.
These issues are easily worked around:

558: On startup, the loaded Dirac filter may not be restored. This seems to happen at cold start, but we have had trouble duplicating it. When this happens, clicking Dirac on and off has no effect on the sound because no Dirac calibration is loaded. Go to the calibration page and select a Dirac calibration and everything will be fine.
564: Wides with no center not supported. Requesting this (8.1) will silently result in a 6.1 configuration without wide channels. There is no immediate plan to support wides with no center.
These features are not yet ready. The are to be enabled by software updates.

USB Audio (USB DAC function) not yet supported.
The secondary “downmix” output remains disabled in v1.3 pending a fix to mute transition noise.
Alexa Smart Home Skill has not yet been certified by Amazon so you cannot find it in the Alexa stores.
You cannot yet configure WiFi connectivity from the front panel: You must configure it through the wired Ethernet.
Roon compliance not complete.
WiFi causes dropouts on BlueTooth. Turn off WiFi to use BlueTooth.
Bluetooth audio can have (subtle) glitches. This is a software issue.
Some infrared remote keys (color, ABCD, 1234, BT Pair) are not implemented.
IR Remote Code Feature:
The URL is http://192.168.1.100/ircmd?code=XXXX where XXXX is the ‘NEC Code’ from the ‘IR Code Table’ in the User Guide. You should replace 192.168.1.100 with the actual IP address of your unit. More than one NEC Code may be sent by separating them with comma. Note that the code must be sent exactly as described in the User Guide: 4 hexidecimal digits, lower case, and without 0x prefix. The following example uses the ‘wget’ and the ‘curl’ command:

Selects HDMI 1, Native upmix mode, unmute:

wget "http://192.168.1.100/ircmd?code=0ff0,1ee1,4cb3"
curl "http://192.168.1.100/ircmd?code=0ff0,1ee1,4cb3"
Selects HDMI 2, Direct upmix mode, mute:

wget "http://192.168.1.100/ircmd?code=10ef,4bb4,1be4"
curl "http://192.168.1.100/ircmd?code=10ef,4bb4,1be4"

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post #1642 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 03:38 PM
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(reposting from ASR)

Excuse my ignorance, but from what I can tell, aren't the results from the HTP-1 fairly positive? As long as you listen to content at reference volume (or lower) and your amp sensitivity is less than 4v then everything works as expected, correct? Under reference volume and under 4v there is no clipping/compression? The rest of the measurements put the HTP-1 above all the previously tested receivers/processors? Functionally (stability and features) it appears to be miles ahead of other competitors like Emotiva as well.

Just curious as to why so many people are immediately dismissive of the HTP-1 now (even going as far as to recommend older Denon/Marantz models with far worse measurements)? Do that many people really listen above reference volume or at higher voltages?
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post #1643 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 04:25 PM
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The "Official" Monoprice Monolith HTP-1 Owners Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maconi View Post
(reposting from ASR)



Excuse my ignorance, but from what I can tell, aren't the results from the HTP-1 fairly positive? As long as you listen to content at reference volume (or lower) and your amp sensitivity is less than 4v then everything works as expected, correct? Under reference volume and under 4v there is no clipping/compression? The rest of the measurements put the HTP-1 above all the previously tested receivers/processors? Functionally (stability and features) it appears to be miles ahead of other competitors like Emotiva as well.



Just curious as to why so many people are immediately dismissive of the HTP-1 now (even going as far as to recommend older Denon/Marantz models with far worse measurements)? Do that many people really listen above reference volume or at higher voltages?


“Why” indeed. I don’t understand the groupthink over there.

You have a guy that certainly knows much more about electrical engineering than I do. But there is zero peer review of his findings, which are taken as gospel by many.

The site name includes ‘Science’ in its name. That’s great. But shouldn’t they comply with generally accepted scientific research methods?

I work in Information Security and metrics and measurements are critical. I’ve certainly made errors in my career, but I always have metrics and measurement-related findings verified by a colleague before I publish it. It’d be professionally embarrassing to publish errors, and worse, could actually increase risks


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post #1644 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 04:59 PM
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post #1645 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 05:09 PM
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I have my replacement HTP1 running V1.3.

I was watching another DTS-MA BluRay with the native mode on. I watched the HTP1 about 5 minutes in, I watched the HTP1 switch back and forth between 7.1.4 and 5.1.0 several times and then got a loud screeching noise that had me grabbing for the remote to shut off before any speaker damage. I rebooted the HTP1 (changed my underwear) and watched the rest of the movie, about an hour in It did start switching output modes back and forth again between 7.1.4 and 5.1.0 so I changed the output mode to Neural-x and was able to watch the rest of the movie without issues.
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post #1646 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 05:35 PM
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@kemac - curious- what are you using for your player?

Is the error repeatable?


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post #1647 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilbur_the_goose View Post
@kemac - curious- what are you using for your player?

Is the error repeatable?


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Oppo-203 - I have not tried to repro yet. I went from watching the UHD of "John Wick3" to the BluRay of "Fighting with My Family" and that is when things went sideways.

BTW I have reported issues previously with DTS audio and native mode not working properly with a 7.1.4 config.
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Last edited by kemac; 02-15-2020 at 05:51 PM.
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post #1648 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 06:00 PM
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You certainly have a great player!


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post #1649 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 07:28 PM
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post #1650 of 1726 Old 02-15-2020, 11:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilbur_the_goose View Post
“Why” indeed. I don’t understand the groupthink over there.

You have a guy that certainly knows much more about electrical engineering than I do. But there is zero peer review of his findings, which are taken as gospel by many.
I think it's strange to suggest that there's some kind of groupthink. People have heavly criticized ASR reviews of many things, especially speakers, and all those posts are allowed and even encouraged, despite sometimes being very rude by anybody's standards.

People on AVSForum are generally asking "which product should I buy to enjoy my content?". Amir reviews electronics products as an engineer reviewing engineering solutions to a problem: audio reproduction. The HTP-1 promises output sufficient to drive amps up to 7V based on the manual and the settings. It doesn't do that, and this is silently broken with no indication to the user. That's an engineering issue. Does it matter to most people in everyday use? Probably not. Does it matter to some people? Yes, it matters to people who need those output voltages. So it should be fixed.

I think pushing the audio industry to proper engineering standards is good, because they've had a long stretch without any strict third party evaluation of their work. And it shows in many cases.

For the HTP-1, I tend to agree that the headless panther is a bit unreasonable. The shrugging one is probably a better choice. Review conclusions there are often overly harsh for every day use. But it really doesn't matter because review conclusions aren't the valuable thing being presented on ASR. The data and testing is the value, and its quality vastly exceeds that of what any other source is presenting. Especially for speakers.

For me, I still don't think the HTP-1 offers enough value over a lower priced AVR because I'm skeptical of Dirac being $2500 better than Audyssey XT32, and I don't care about 16 output channels, I only need 13. But everybody has different needs and different budgets, which is why you can't just rely on review conclusions. I'm probably going to keep an eye on the 2020 offerings from Denon/Marantz and the JBL SDP-55 and make a purchase decision later in the year.
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Last edited by Sancus; Yesterday at 12:18 AM. Reason: typo
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