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post #1 of 20 Old 02-21-2020, 09:38 PM - Thread Starter
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connect PC to 5.1 receiver

I want to send 6 channels of music, created in the pc from 2-channel WAV at playtime out through a USB 2.0 port to a 4K/HDCP2.2 HDMI port on the Denon AVR X1500h. PC does not have HDMI or spdif

Though USB 2.0 is slow vs 3.0 it has plenty of capacity. 6 channels of WAV would be 4.25 meg per sec and USB 2 tops out at 450meg per sec. [Edit add] My WAV are 44.1hz x 16 bit so one channel is 705kbs

What is needed to connect a USB 2.0 port to a Denon incoming HDMI port?

Last edited by Chuck5.1; 02-22-2020 at 05:35 PM.
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post #2 of 20 Old 02-21-2020, 09:42 PM
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I don't know whether it's possible.

Doe the PC have an optical output? You could use that.
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post #3 of 20 Old 02-21-2020, 10:16 PM - Thread Starter
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PC does not have an optical output
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post #4 of 20 Old 02-21-2020, 11:16 PM
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A quick search shows that USB to HDMI adapters do exist so it is definitely possible. I just don't know if there are audio limitations but you can always get one off of Amazon and try it.
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post #5 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 02:27 AM
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Does the PC not have any DisplayPort outputs that can be converted to hdmi?
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post #6 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 02:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck5.1 View Post
I want to send 6 channels of music, created in the pc from 2-channel WAV at playtime out through a USB 2.0 port to a 4K/HDCP2.2 HDMI port on the Denon AVR X1500h. PC does not have an HDMI port

Though USB 2.0 is slow vs 3.0 it has plenty of capacity. 6 channels of WAV would be 4.25 meg per sec and USB 2 tops out at 450meg per sec.

What is needed to connect a USB 2.0 port to a Denon incoming HDMI port?
If you don't have any optical output on your PC, probably the easiest thing to do is to get a USB audio adapter with spdif. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FEDHHKE this one is $22 and will handle it. You'd play back your audio to this then hook up the optical output to your receiver.

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post #7 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
If you don't have any optical output on your PC, probably the easiest thing to do is to get a USB audio adapter with spdif. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FEDHHKE this one is $22 and will handle it. You'd play back your audio to this then hook up the optical output to your receiver.
That won't work. OP wants to send an LPCM stream, spdif can only do 2 channel PCM


USB to HDMI adaptors are hit and miss how many channels of audio they support, the ones I found would only do stereo.

Assuming you have a desktop and not a laptop, get the cheapest videocard you can find that has HDMI out.

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post #8 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
That won't work. OP wants to send an LPCM stream, spdif can only do 2 channel PCM


USB to HDMI adaptors are hit and miss how many channels of audio they support, the ones I found would only do stereo.

Assuming you have a desktop and not a laptop, get the cheapest videocard you can find that has HDMI out.
I'm not familiar with the details of digital audio, but what makes you think that the OP wants LPCM? The mentioned data rate is 4.25 Mbps, which I think means the total for 6 channels. That appears to not be a high bit rate. (Uncompressed: 96kHz x 24 bits X 2 channels = 4.6 Mbps.)
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post #9 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by bobknavs View Post
I'm not familiar with the details of digital audio, but what makes you think that the OP wants LPCM? The mentioned data rate is 4.25 Mbps, which I think means the total for 6 channels. That appears to not be a high bit rate. (Uncompressed: 96kHz x 24 bits X 2 channels = 4.6 Mbps.)
Because he is processing 2ch into 6ch using software on the PC. It will not be encoded into Dolby Digital nor DTS which are the only multichannel formats you can use across SPDIF. For PCM over SPDIF only stereo is supported.

He could get a soundcard that supports Dolby Digital Live or the DTS equivalent but then it will be lossy due to compression but it would let him use SPDIF.

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post #10 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
Because he is processing 2ch into 6ch using software on the PC. It will not be encoded into Dolby Digital nor DTS which are the only multichannel formats you can use across SPDIF. For PCM over SPDIF only stereo is supported.

He could get a soundcard that supports Dolby Digital Live or the DTS equivalent but then it will be lossy due to compression but it would let him use SPDIF.
I wonder whether it would be simplest to just send 2 channel PCM to the AVR, and live with whatever processing that could do? That would (I hope) permit the use of the cheap USB to S/PDIF converter.
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post #11 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 04:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bobknavs View Post
I'm not familiar with the details of digital audio, but what makes you think that the OP wants LPCM? The mentioned data rate is 4.25 Mbps, which I think means the total for 6 channels. That appears to not be a high bit rate. (Uncompressed: 96kHz x 24 bits X 2 channels = 4.6 Mbps.)
My WAVE files are 16 bit 44.1hz which have a single channel of 705kbs or 1.4 meg per sec in stereo. Had always heard that no improvement will be noticed if vinyl is digitized at 96hz x 24 bit. Did a sound test a while back digitzing some vinyl lps at 96hz and 24 bits as well as 44.1hz and 16 bit with a Technics 1200 mark 5 a decent turntable. During play back, could not hear any difference so I stayed with 44.1 x 24. Maybe a better sound might be had with a higher end turntable and needle with higher end receiver-speakers but not going to spend the money to try.
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post #12 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bobknavs View Post
I wonder whether it would be simplest to just send 2 channel PCM to the AVR, and live with whatever processing that could do? That would (I hope) permit the use of the cheap USB to S/PDIF converter.
I do want to listen to music in 5.1. It was this want that I bought the Denon and the speakers. The Denon has some ability to create surround sound but my PC with the mixer gives me far more features to create pseudo 5.1. The Denon might be great as a further enhancement. But first I need to find how to connect my pc to the Denon to send 6 channels to it digital form

Looked into installing a 5.1 sound card but not acceptable. Would have needed a receiver-amp with 6 RCA jacks. Also the WAV would have gone through DAC going out of the pc then ADC going into the receiver-amp.
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post #13 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 05:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
That won't work. OP wants to send an LPCM stream, spdif can only do 2 channel PCM


USB to HDMI adaptors are hit and miss how many channels of audio they support, the ones I found would only do stereo.

Assuming you have a desktop and not a laptop, get the cheapest videocard you can find that has HDMI out.
Good to know about spdif and USB-HDMI adapter. Video card with HDMI looks to be my only option. Thanks. I definitely want digital 6 channel music going into the receiver. I did post in another reply that a 5.1 sound card was not acceptable for various reasons. My WAV are 44.1hz and 16 bit so 705kbs per channel

Wondering if music through a video card HDMI will cause all video to go to the receiver. The receiver has an HDMI out labeled monitor and something called "ARC"
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post #14 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck5.1 View Post
Good to know about spdif and USB-HDMI adapter. Video card with HDMI looks to be my only option. Thanks. I definitely want digital 6 channel music going into the receiver. I did post in another reply that a 5.1 sound card was not acceptable for various reasons. My WAV are 44.1hz and 16 bit so 705kbs per channel

Wondering if music through a video card HDMI will cause all video to go to the receiver. The receiver has an HDMI out labeled monitor and something called "ARC"
Old "CD Quality" audio? I didn't think anyone did that any more.

As far as I know, it isn't possible to use an HDMI port for audio only.

I suppose that you could set up a dual monitor configuration (one would be the AVR). You might need to connect a dummy plug too the HDMI output of the AVR, so that the PC thinks there's a display on the circuit.

There are also devices that can split out the audio (example: https://www.hdfury.com/product/avr-key/). Their main purpose was to take the audio out of 4k video and send it to an AVR that isn't 4k capable.

I hope there's a less kludgy way to do what you want, but I don't know one.

An irrelevancy: ARC is Audio Return Channel. It is for sending audio from a TV back through the HDMI cable to the receiver. (It's a bi-directional interface.) Its limitations are similar to S/PDIF, though. New receivers hav eARC, which supports high definition multichannel audio (and Atmos and DTS:X).
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post #15 of 20 Old 02-22-2020, 07:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bobknavs View Post
Old "CD Quality" audio? I didn't think anyone did that any more.

As far as I know, it isn't possible to use an HDMI port for audio only.

I suppose that you could set up a dual monitor configuration (one would be the AVR). You might need to connect a dummy plug too the HDMI output of the AVR, so that the PC thinks there's a display on the circuit.

There are also devices that can split out the audio (example: https://www.hdfury.com/product/avr-key/). Their main purpose was to take the audio out of 4k video and send it to an AVR that isn't 4k capable.

I hope there's a less kludgy way to do what you want, but I don't know one.

An irrelevancy: ARC is Audio Return Channel. It is for sending audio from a TV back through the HDMI cable to the receiver. (It's a bi-directional interface.) Its limitations are similar to S/PDIF, though. New receivers hav eARC, which supports high definition multichannel audio (and Atmos and DTS:X).
For the most part I am a music dinosaur (what I listen to and format). Much of it is not digitally available in anything higher and most of what is, I chocked on the price. Amazon HD might be on par with cd which does not gain anything for me. Don't like concert recordings. Won't buy remastered vinyl for my days of digitizing vinyl are through.

Will look into a dual monitor set up. I still have a vga monitor as well as a digital one. As long is it works.
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post #16 of 20 Old Yesterday, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Chuck5.1 View Post
Wondering if music through a video card HDMI will cause all video to go to the receiver. The receiver has an HDMI out labeled monitor and something called "ARC"
Back a decade ago I used a HTPC combined with a NAD T775 and a plasma TV set up with two mirrored HDMI video outputs, one going to each device. The NAD didn't have any display connected and it worked fine.

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post #17 of 20 Old Yesterday, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
Back a decade ago I used a HTPC combined with a NAD T775 and a plasma TV set up with two mirrored HDMI video outputs, one going to each device. The NAD didn't have any display connected and it worked fine.
I wonder whether the HTPC cared about HDCP in those days?
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post #18 of 20 Old Yesterday, 10:40 AM
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I wonder whether the HTPC cared about HDCP in those days?
I didn't play any HDCP protected material at the time as everything was ripped from disc.

An AVR will happily terminate HDCP for HDMI 1.3, it is just HDCP for HDMI 2.0 that requires a proper sink on the end.

OP is looking to use PC generated LPCM streams and those don't care about HDCP

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post #19 of 20 Old Yesterday, 01:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
Back a decade ago I used a HTPC combined with a NAD T775 and a plasma TV set up with two mirrored HDMI video outputs, one going to each device. The NAD didn't have any display connected and it worked fine.
Did not know about HTPC. Did a quick overview but need more reading about it. Looks like external hard drives USB are not compatible which is what my music files are on. Close to 3T worth. Read a version of Windows is part of a HTPC but will need to find out if my software to create 6 channels is compatible.

I had heard of S/PDIF and optical but thought they were the same. Wrong. Optical will carry only audio up to 8 channels. To bad my receiver and pc are not equipped with it.
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post #20 of 20 Old Today, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck5.1 View Post
Did not know about HTPC. Did a quick overview but need more reading about it. Looks like external hard drives USB are not compatible which is what my music files are on. Close to 3T worth. Read a version of Windows is part of a HTPC but will need to find out if my software to create 6 channels is compatible.

I had heard of S/PDIF and optical but thought they were the same. Wrong. Optical will carry only audio up to 8 channels. To bad my receiver and pc are not equipped with it.
S/PDIF is a digital format. It is used with Toslink optical or coaxial cable (which looks like a regular cable with RCA connectors). 8 channels through an optical port may not be standard; I believe that the normal is 5.1 (compressed).
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