Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs - Page 726 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #21751 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 12:10 PM
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@AustinJerry


I have ordered the cables to set all my subs up in LFE mono as you suggested. Rather than stereo subs.

I can not promise I will leave them configured in this manner, but will give it a try....


I believe for the ease of measurements ,correcting for the room and finding a optimal location, this will be the easiest route.

No matter what configuration I run, location and room response will always be the same, who knows, I might like it better this way.

I have done lots of hours of reading since you suggested this and I still need help as it gets more complex the more you understand.........when to cut, when to boost, what is room related, what is location related, what matters the most, what is non correctable or does not matter.

I am a little OCD when it comes to new things, so the journey from no understanding to just enuf to get really confused goes pretty fast, such as a 80 hours of reading in 7 days..


I am starting to get a basic understanding of all the effects that come into play now.....wavelengths, room sizes, nulls,gains, reflections, absorbtion,diffusion etc etc etc. I also have about 25 hours of youtube vids digested in the last week. Info on , recording, mastering,mixing , playback..constructing sound panels, treating reflections.......


There is quite a lot that comes into play and no easy answers as most of it needs to be accouted for...compensated for.......

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post #21752 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
As opposed to just raising/lowering your AVR 10dB?

Michael


Even easier to do it directly in REW!

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post #21753 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 01:43 PM
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I will try it.

Did you really need to quote that entire post in your reply?
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post #21754 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 02:25 PM
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Some pics of the "second" sub(s) that are nearfield next to my sectional...

Some pics....











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post #21755 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Some pics of the "second" sub(s) that are nearfield next to my sectional...



Some pics....

That's awesome how you have it setup!

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post #21756 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Some pics of the "second" sub(s) that are nearfield next to my sectional...
A few more subs would probably smooth out the overall bass response...
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post #21757 of 27461 Old 02-28-2017, 11:02 PM
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did a few more tests tonight. and got this as a result. still a tad low after 73. will work on the over 80hz range next to see how that looks. i moved my v1800 to the left wall facing straight to get rid of a few bad spots. seem to have worked. i might have things a bit hot but man it shakes things more now. way stronger than before i met REW. without the umik and rew i'd be listening to a weak system. will be continuing more tests and slight fixes. much fun.
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post #21758 of 27461 Old 03-01-2017, 05:12 AM
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Originally Posted by WormInfested View Post
did a few more tests tonight. and got this as a result. still a tad low after 73. will work on the over 80hz range next to see how that looks. i moved my v1800 to the left wall facing straight to get rid of a few bad spots. seem to have worked. i might have things a bit hot but man it shakes things more now. way stronger than before i met REW. without the umik and rew i'd be listening to a weak system. will be continuing more tests and slight fixes. much fun.
Glad you are having fun. While you continue to experiment, it would be nice to see a measurement of sub+center, up to 300Hz no smoothing. This will show how well the center is filling in the bass response above the crossover point. Below the crossover, your response looks fine.
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post #21759 of 27461 Old 03-01-2017, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by WormInfested View Post
without the umik and rew i'd be listening to a weak system.
Truer words have never been spoken...and the "silly graph" haters will seem to never get it. Their loss.
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post #21760 of 27461 Old 03-01-2017, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
Truer words have never been spoken...and the "silly graph" haters will seem to never get it. Their loss.
Well - it's also easy to understand the trepidation that some may have with regards to the initial complexity and learning curve associated with REW, as well the "fear" of seeing what their room acoustics actually look like, and the possibly daunting task of finding the appropriate remedies. But I agree, it's better to know what needs to be done, and developing a plan to make improvements, then do nothing at all.

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post #21761 of 27461 Old 03-01-2017, 01:50 PM
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Truer words have never been spoken...and the "silly graph" haters will seem to never get it. Their loss.
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Well - it's also easy to understand the trepidation that some may have with regards to the initial complexity and learning curve associated with REW, as well the "fear" of seeing what their room acoustics actually look like, and the possibly daunting task of finding the appropriate remedies. But I agree, it's better to know what needs to be done, and developing a plan to make improvements, then do nothing at all.


I find it a good tedious challenge to make sure the speakers and subwoofers sound their best. Some people might not like the time consuming but highly rewarding task of taking measurements and moving sub/speakers around. It's totally worth it in the end hearing what the toys you have can actually sound like. Sure there is some technical aspects of it but once you get through that part it makes it easier to understand what you need to do.

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post #21762 of 27461 Old 03-02-2017, 10:03 PM
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Slowly getting there... still not sure how to address the crossover issues between my subs and the mains. I tried crossing the mains over at 80, 100hz with the LFE @ 150 even and still nothing.

Tweaked with the distances of the subs and got a better response but still not perfect.

Whats hard to see is that the tweaked Left and Right response are VERY close to each other, as opposed to the originals where they were totally out of whack.

But here you go.

Left


Right


Subs

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post #21763 of 27461 Old 03-02-2017, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Slowly getting there... still not sure how to address the crossover issues between my subs and the mains. I tried crossing the mains over at 80, 100hz with the LFE @ 150 even and still nothing.



Tweaked with the distances of the subs and got a better response but still not perfect.



Whats hard to see is that the tweaked Left and Right response are VERY close to each other, as opposed to the originals where they were totally out of whack.



But here you go.



Left





Right





Subs



Try lowering the SUB channel by 6db or so and rerunning. Could just be because the subs look like they're being run hot.

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post #21764 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 02:08 AM
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Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Slowly getting there... still not sure how to address the crossover issues between my subs and the mains. I tried crossing the mains over at 80, 100hz with the LFE @ 150 even and still nothing.

Tweaked with the distances of the subs and got a better response but still not perfect.

Whats hard to see is that the tweaked Left and Right response are VERY close to each other, as opposed to the originals where they were totally out of whack.

But here you go.

Left
[...]
Reverse polarity on your sub(s).

Markus

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post #21765 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:01 AM
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Try lowering the SUB channel by 6db or so and rerunning. Could just be because the subs look like they're being run hot.
True, may try to see what I can do there but I like the subs hot........


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Reverse polarity on your sub(s).
Not sure how I'd do that. I've got 2 DIY subs, one a Ultimax 18 in a 4 cubic foot box, the other 4 Infinity 1262w's in a 6 cubic foot box. Both being driven by a Crown XLS2000 fed via RCA's connected to the Sub 1 and Sub 2 pre-outs respectively.

I've got a balanced MiniDSP thats being built into a custom enclosure for me soon and I know with that device I should be able to do that, however is it possible with my current setup to do?

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post #21766 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:30 AM
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Not sure how I'd do that. I've got 2 DIY subs, one a Ultimax 18 in a 4 cubic foot box, the other 4 Infinity 1262w's in a 6 cubic foot box. Both being driven by a Crown XLS2000 fed via RCA's connected to the Sub 1 and Sub 2 pre-outs respectively.

I've got a balanced MiniDSP thats being built into a custom enclosure for me soon and I know with that device I should be able to do that, however is it possible with my current setup to do?
Simply reverse +/- amp out going to the subs.
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post #21767 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:44 AM
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Simply reverse +/- amp out going to the subs.
So since I'm using speakon connectors on both sides of both subs, your telling me to switch the wires so that instead of -1 being negative and +1 being positive that I have -1 being positive and +1 being negative on the amp end correct?

Do I also need to switch it at the sub end as those connections are also wired where -1 is negative and +1 is positive.....

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post #21768 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:46 AM
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So since I'm using speakon connectors on both sides of both subs, your telling me to switch the wires so that instead of -1 being negative and +1 being positive that I have -1 being positive and +1 being negative on the amp end correct?

Do I also need to switch it at the sub end as those connections are also wired where -1 is negative and +1 is positive.....
If you would also switch it at the subs you would end up with the same wiring as before
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post #21769 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:49 AM
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If you would also switch it at the subs you would end up with the same wiring as before
DOH! Its Friday, and I'm blaming being up to 1:45am doing these sweeps and then back up again at 4:00am because of stupid dogs and storms and small children

So just this correct?

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Switch the wires so that instead of -1 being negative and +1 being positive that I have -1 being positive and +1 being negative on the amp end

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post #21770 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 11:06 AM
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YES on the above. You can do it on whichever end is easiest. This will effectively take your subs 180 degrees out of phase with the rest of your speakers which could fix the situation completely. Try the two different subs separately and then together too just to see what yields the best results.
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post #21771 of 27461 Old 03-03-2017, 05:37 PM
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After reversing polarity it looks a bit better....





Left and Right Final for the night

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Quote: There exists, for everyone, a sentence - a series of words - that has the power to destroy you. Another sentence exists, another series of words, that could heal you. If you're lucky you will get the 2nd, but you can be certain of getting the 1st. - Philip K. Dick

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post #21772 of 27461 Old 03-06-2017, 10:50 PM
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Do I have REW setup wrong?

I have been playing around with REW and started using it on a new computer.

The measurements are showing some weird trends.

If I make a single measurement at any FFT size, I get fairly flat response above the bass range.

If I make two measurements at 256K or less, I also get fairly flat response.

However, if I make two or more measurements at 512K or 1M, I get large dips in some areas above 4000 Hz. It's really weird. Wasn't happening on my other computer. Using a USB UMIK-1, same one I used with my other computer.

For example, if I run a 1M measurement 15 to 20000 Hz with TWO sweeps, I get a fairly wide dip around 9000 Hz. If I run it with 8 sweeps, I get four separate wide dips at various frequencies starting at 4000 Hz. Running only one 1M sweep and it shows flat.

Any idea what is going on? It's almost like the various sweeps are interfering with each other?

I can post a pic if desired comparing runs...

Thanks!

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post #21773 of 27461 Old 03-06-2017, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by danielrg View Post
I have been playing around with REW and started using it on a new computer.

The measurements are showing some weird trends.

If I make a single measurement at any FFT size, I get fairly flat response above the bass range.

If I make two measurements at 256K or less, I also get fairly flat response.

However, if I make two or more measurements at 512K or 1M, I get large dips in some areas above 4000 Hz. It's really weird. Wasn't happening on my other computer. Using a USB UMIK-1, same one I used with my other computer.

For example, if I run a 1M measurement 15 to 20000 Hz with TWO sweeps, I get a fairly wide dip around 9000 Hz. If I run it with 8 sweeps, I get four separate wide dips at various frequencies starting at 4000 Hz. Running only one 1M sweep and it shows flat.

Any idea what is going on? It's almost like the various sweeps are interfering with each other?

I can post a pic if desired comparing runs...

Thanks!
I figured I'd post a picture. This has 4 runs. All 15 Hz to 20000 Hz. One run with 1 sweep, another with 2, another with 4, and another with 8.

Note how the dips are different depending on how many sweeps I did. Shouldn't they all result in the same curve regardless of the number of sweeps?

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post #21774 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 12:02 AM
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@danielrg I've seen this misbehavior in the past so I don't use multiple sweeps. If you need to improve SNR then using a lengthier sweep is usually good enough.
In any case, report this bug to @JohnPM
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post #21775 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 12:39 AM
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My UMIK-1 decided to stop measuring properly over the weekend. It worked just fine on Saturday and Sat night. Sunday morning it just will not record proper readings. I have tried several USB cables. The blue LED illuminatesband the UMIK is registered by windows and REW but SPL readings appear to be only registering background noise at all times whether a tone, sweep, or loud is taking place.

The mic is 14 months old. Is there any way to reset the mic via dip switches? I can seem to find anything and MiniDSP hasn't responded to my inquiries.

I'm ordering another from CSL but I'd like to resurrect this one if possible.
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post #21776 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 01:19 AM
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My UMIK-1 decided to stop measuring properly over the weekend. It worked just fine on Saturday and Sat night. Sunday morning it just will not record proper readings. I have tried several USB cables. The blue LED illuminatesband the UMIK is registered by windows and REW but SPL readings appear to be only registering background noise at all times whether a tone, sweep, or loud is taking place.

The mic is 14 months old. Is there any way to reset the mic via dip switches? I can seem to find anything and MiniDSP hasn't responded to my inquiries.

I'm ordering another from CSL but I'd like to resurrect this one if possible.
Does the meter in the Windows sound control panel show any input?

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post #21777 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Does the meter in the Windows sound control panel show any input?
Yes, but the voice recognition setup doesn't detect any speech.
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post #21778 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Yes, but the voice recognition setup doesn't detect any speech.
"voice recognition setup"? If you see input from the mic the problem is obviously your computer configuration.

Markus

"In science, contrary evidence causes one to question a theory. In religion, contrary evidence causes one to question the evidence." - Floyd Toole
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post #21779 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 08:30 AM
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Did you try rebooting the computer?
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post #21780 of 27461 Old 03-07-2017, 08:44 AM
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My UMIK-1 decided to stop measuring properly over the weekend. It worked just fine on Saturday and Sat night. Sunday morning it just will not record proper readings. I have tried several USB cables. The blue LED illuminatesband the UMIK is registered by windows and REW but SPL readings appear to be only registering background noise at all times whether a tone, sweep, or loud is taking place.

The mic is 14 months old. Is there any way to reset the mic via dip switches? I can seem to find anything and MiniDSP hasn't responded to my inquiries.

I'm ordering another from CSL but I'd like to resurrect this one if possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Does the meter in the Windows sound control panel show any input?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Yes, but the voice recognition setup doesn't detect any speech.
Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
"voice recognition setup"? If you see input from the mic the problem is obviously your computer configuration.
Obviously? The mic is acting like there is just ambient noise, no matter what the noise in the room is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Hanna View Post
Did you try rebooting the computer?
Yes, rebooted… no change. I am going to try my other PC's to verify this is not my computer configuration. I am going order another UMIK from CSL.

Sounds like the answer to my question about resetting the mic is that there is no known way. What is the function of dip #4?
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