How does everybody have their receiver hooked up these days - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 05:14 AM - Thread Starter
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How does everybody have their receiver hooked up these days

It's been a long time since I have purchased any new equipment. My last purchase was pre smart TVs.

So my question is now, with smart TVs and being able to stream everything with the best quality direct from your TV how do you route all the HDMI cables. Does anybody use the upscaling feature of the receiver anymore or do you hook everything direct to your TV and one cable to your receiver 4 audio

For those that run through their receiver, do you use the video processing?

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post #2 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 07:11 AM
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I would suggest that it depends on your new tv's specs/capabilities (think ARC, eARC, HDCP 2.2, number of HDMI ports, what engine/cpu it has, etc) compared to your receiver's capabilities.


That said, I cabled up everything I could to the tv and then single HDMI out to amp for the audio portion.

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post #3 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 07:28 AM
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My setup has all sources with HDMI connected to their closest matching HDMI input on the receiver. I don’t have anything connected to the TV, except the ARC HDMI out from the receiver. I also use the TV with an antenna, and as such I am connecting the optical output of the TV to one of the optical input ports of the receiver. The receiver’s source settings allow me to assign the optical input as sound for the TV source. The video output of the receiver is connected to the TV via the ARC HDMI ports. My receiver is an older Denon, so my setup may be very specific to the features of my receiver. The sources I have connected are AppleTV/HDMI, Amazon Fire Stick / HDMI, DVD Player / HDMI, Turntable/RCA.


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post #4 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 07:30 AM
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I run everything thru my receiver /hdmi out to tv..Regardless of tv app capabilities. I find it so much easier and convenient. ARC to my understanding is finicky hit or miss.Never used it.

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post #5 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 07:37 AM
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Everything through my processor, tv-box, apple tv, 2x bluray players and a bluesound node2 for music streaming. I dont use the tv smart functions, the apple tv does it better.
Also ARC is a hassle and unreliable, maybe they have learned and will do a better job with eARC thats begining to appear.


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post #6 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 10:24 AM
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^^
Do you guys have ARC mixed up with CEC ? CEC is the real problem.

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post #7 of 32 Old 12-29-2018, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Skytrooper View Post
^^

Do you guys have ARC mixed up with CEC ? CEC is the real problem.


Thats true, but they are often mixed in the devices settings so arent neccessarily fully separate.


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post #8 of 32 Old 12-30-2018, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texas308 View Post
I would suggest that it depends on your new tv's specs/capabilities (think ARC, eARC, HDCP 2.2, number of HDMI ports, what engine/cpu it has, etc) compared to your receiver's capabilities.


That said, I cabled up everything I could to the tv and then single HDMI out to amp for the audio portion.
...but the only problem with connecting this way ^^^ is that you won’t get multichannel audio unless all components are eARC.
Right from the start, the if the TV doesn’t support eARC, you’re not going to get but two channels.
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post #9 of 32 Old 12-31-2018, 06:41 AM
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Agreed and a very good point to make... To clarify on my previous reply, I run my Oppo on HDMI 3 port from the A1E. I do need to spend the time going back over my wiring plan / setup as I am sure I'm not using these devices in their ideal config state.



Rhetorical question: Why aren't all 4 HDMI ports on TV's the same capabilities?



eARC everywhere might be expensive I bet...

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post #10 of 32 Old 12-31-2018, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post
...but the only problem with connecting this way ^^^ is that you won’t get multichannel audio unless all components are eARC.
Right from the start, the if the TV doesn’t support eARC, you’re not going to get but two channels.
Perhaps I'm not getting the full context, but I am getting multi-channel via arc. I have a Sony 930e and Integra DHC 80.3 playing nicely via Arc. I run my external sources into the Integra then out to the tv, with the exception of my PS4 because it supports HDR10 and the Integra doesn't pass it. When using the internal apps on the 930e I get whatever the provider (Netflix/Vudu etc) spits out up to 5.1 DD Plus. When using the Playstation which is connected directly to the tv via hdmi, arc sends out whatever the PS4 is feeding the tv without issue.

The only time I had issues with it is when I was using a combination of arc via hdmi and toslink out from the tv. I was using a combo because all of my external sources max out at 1080p and I had a darbee between the Integra and the tv. The darbee was beneficial visually but not arc compatible. Sometimes the tv would get confused whether it should be using arc or toslink so now I leave it out of the loop unless I'm in a particularly finecky viewing mood and resort back to toslink for audio to get the darbee bump. That eliminates the ability for me to get DD Plus, but it handles DD 5.1 just fine. Sometimes however I just have to have the "+" and the darbee gets yanked. What can I say - I have issues
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post #11 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artzilla View Post
Perhaps I'm not getting the full context, but I am getting multi-channel via arc. I have a Sony 930e and Integra DHC 80.3 playing nicely via Arc. I run my external sources into the Integra then out to the tv, with the exception of my PS4 because it supports HDR10 and the Integra doesn't pass it. When using the internal apps on the 930e I get whatever the provider (Netflix/Vudu etc) spits out up to 5.1 DD Plus. When using the Playstation which is connected directly to the tv via hdmi, arc sends out whatever the PS4 is feeding the tv without issue.

The only time I had issues with it is when I was using a combination of arc via hdmi and toslink out from the tv. I was using a combo because all of my external sources max out at 1080p and I had a darbee between the Integra and the tv. The darbee was beneficial visually but not arc compatible. Sometimes the tv would get confused whether it should be using arc or toslink so now I leave it out of the loop unless I'm in a particularly finecky viewing mood and resort back to toslink for audio to get the darbee bump. That eliminates the ability for me to get DD Plus, but it handles DD 5.1 just fine. Sometimes however I just have to have the "+" and the darbee gets yanked. What can I say - I have issues
My understanding of ARC vs. eARC was wrong ...(sorry), as actually both will pass multi channel audio, but some TV’s dumb down the multi channel output to two channel before it is sent out of the TV.
I would love to clarify what your 900e does, because the owners manual seems to clearly state “ARC from HDMI #3 is in two channel linear PCM, Dolby Digital, and DTS.
If this is correct, you must be using one of your DSP modes, which would provide a simulated surround experience upmixed from two channel.
Anyone willing to clarify please?

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post #12 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post
My understanding of ARC vs. eARC was wrong ...(sorry), as actually both will pass multi channel audio, but some TV’s dumb down the multi channel output to two channel before it is sent out of the TV.
I would love to clarify what your 900e does, because the owners manual seems to clearly state “ARC from HDMI #3 is in two channel linear PCM, Dolby Digital, and DTS.
If this is correct, you must be using one of your DSP modes, which would provide a simulated surround experience upmixed from two channel.
Anyone willing to clarify please?
Indeed - some tvs are not capable but I got lucky because when I got it, I never intended to use streaming apps or feed signals direct to the tv then to the receiver but the changing landscape of 4k has pushed me to do both in lieu of upgrading my pre/pro.

I'm actually using the 930e, and it does indeed output up to Dolby Digital Plus via arc to the receiver. I use DSP for height and width channels but the output signal from the tv to the pre/pro is multichannel as long as the source or broadcast is. Optical/toslink and HDMI ARC both provide 5.1 channel output but only HDMI is DD+ capable.
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post #13 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 11:50 AM
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I’m curious as to why the 900e owners manual states two channel out of HDMI #3 ?

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post #14 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post
I’m curious as to why the 900e owners manual states two channel out of HDMI #3 ?
I'm not looking at the manual, but I should point out that you are quoting from the "900"e manual and I am using the "930"e. Regardless, according to your past post, you stated: “ARC from HDMI #3 is in two channel linear PCM, Dolby Digital, and DTS.

Dolby Digital is 5.1 and dts can be up to 6.1 or 7.1 - my memory fails me at the moment and I'm not saying the TV would output 6/7.1. According to your quote however only PCM should limit output to 2.0.

FWIW my confirmation of the input signal is not assumption. It is coming from my pre/pro which tells me the the signal it receives as well as the output I am hearing via whatever DSP I'm using and I can say with certainty that the "930"e definitely outputs 5.1 over arc HDMI 3.

I'm not sure if it's just a point of interest to you or if you have one of these sets but if you do, check your audio output settings on the tv. I'm still working and don't have access to mine right now bur IIRC I believe ther is a PCM setting and 2 other options. Based on what you indicated the manual said, you would only get 2.0 output if you select PCM regardless of whether you are using HDMI or Toslink.
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post #15 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post
I’m curious as to why the 900e owners manual states two channel out of HDMI #3 ?
I'm not looking at the manual, but I should point out that you are quoting from the "900"e manual and I am using the "930"e. Regardless, according to your past post, you stated: “ARC from HDMI #3 is in two channel linear PCM, Dolby Digital, and DTS.

Dolby Digital is 5.1 and dts can be up to 6.1 or 7.1 - my memory fails me at the moment and I'm not saying the TV would output 6/7.1. According to your quote however only PCM should limit output to 2.0.

FWIW my confirmation of the input signal is not assumption. It is coming from my pre/pro which tells me the the signal it receives as well as the output I am hearing via whatever DSP I'm using and I can say with certainty that the "930"e definitely outputs 5.1 over arc HDMI 3.

I'm not sure if it's just a point of interest to you or if you have one of these sets but if you do, check your audio output settings on the tv. I'm still working and don't have access to mine right now but IIRC I believe there is a PCM setting and 2 other options. Based on what you indicated the manual said, you would only get 2.0 output if you select PCM regardless of whether you are using HDMI or Toslink.
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post #16 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skytrooper View Post
^^
Do you guys have ARC mixed up with CEC ? CEC is the real problem.
Every device I've used that supports ARC requires CEC to be enabled in order to use it.
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post #17 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 02:10 PM
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Every device I've used that supports ARC requires CEC to be enabled in order to use it.
FWIW I do use CEC. Perhaps this is the missing link. I have always had it enabled so I can't comment on what the audio output is without it. Fortunately I have had far fewer problems with CEC than others have reported. Just a random and rare brief power up of the pre/pro. Ironically, it does seem to be occurring more frequently over the last couple of weeks and I have not updated to Oreo so it seems a little odd.
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post #18 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artzilla View Post
I'm not looking at the manual, but I should point out that you are quoting from the "900"e manual and I am using the "930"e. Regardless, according to your past post, you stated: “ARC from HDMI #3 is in two channel linear PCM, Dolby Digital, and DTS.

Dolby Digital is 5.1 and dts can be up to 6.1 or 7.1 - my memory fails me at the moment and I'm not saying the TV would output 6/7.1. According to your quote however only PCM should limit output to 2.0.

FWIW my confirmation of the input signal is not assumption. It is coming from my pre/pro which tells me the the signal it receives as well as the output I am hearing via whatever DSP I'm using and I can say with certainty that the "930"e definitely outputs 5.1 over arc HDMI 3.

I'm not sure if it's just a point of interest to you or if you have one of these sets but if you do, check your audio output settings on the tv. I'm still working and don't have access to mine right now but IIRC I believe there is a PCM setting and 2 other options. Based on what you indicated the manual said, you would only get 2.0 output if you select PCM regardless of whether you are using HDMI or Toslink.
...sorry I typed 900 when I meant 930. The info I was referring to is for the 930 model on page 21 and 22 of the owners manual, where it states “two channel signal LPCM, and Dolby (something or another)...
BTW I’ve looked at other Sony owners manuals and they don’t make it easy to find, and or understand this particular spec..

Believe me, I want this to work for you, and I’m glad you say that it is.

I personally want to clarify this so that when I’m ready for a new TV, I’ll be on the look out.
Can anyone interpret this for clarification? It’s on pg. 21 and 22.

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post #19 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 04:24 PM
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I hook all the peripherals to the receiver and just one HDMI to the TV. It is convenient as I can just switch inputs on the receiver and do not have cable clutter to the TV. As to the other way of hooking it, your receiver should tell you what it is decoding. The only advantage of hooking everything to the TV that comes to mind is that you could calibrate the TV to each input device instead of just one setting. I tried that and did not have an appreciable difference in settings and opted for convenience.
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post #20 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 04:54 PM
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[QUOTE=Artzilla;57365148]

Dolby Digital is 5.1 and dts can be up to 6.1 or 7.1 - my memory fails me at the moment and I'm not saying the TV would output 6/7.1.
What I am saying is that all of the different formats above and beyond are being mixed down to two channel, unless otherwise noted in the owners manual. I’m seeing this in the manual on pg. 22.

FWIW my confirmation of the input signal is not assumption.

I'm not sure if it's just a point of interest to you or if you have one of these sets but if you do, check your audio output settings on the tv.
Yes I understand where you’re going, but I’m referring to the Sony manual pg. 21 an 22.

Based on what you indicated the manual said, you would only get 2.0 output if you select PCM regardless of whether you are using HDMI or Toslink.
Yes, but I didn’t say “if you select PCM”, I was saying “I see reference to two channel output”. I’m not talking about settings. I’m talking about the Sony TV spec..

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post #21 of 32 Old 01-02-2019, 05:06 PM
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[quote=Espo77;57366136]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artzilla View Post

Dolby Digital is 5.1 and dts can be up to 6.1 or 7.1 - my memory fails me at the moment and I'm not saying the TV would output 6/7.1.
What I am saying is that all of the different formats above and beyond are being mixed down to two channel, unless otherwise noted in the owners manual. I’m seeing this in the manual on pg. 22.

FWIW my confirmation of the input signal is not assumption.

I'm not sure if it's just a point of interest to you or if you have one of these sets but if you do, check your audio output settings on the tv.
Yes I understand where you’re going, but I’m referring to the Sony manual pg. 21 an 22.

Based on what you indicated the manual said, you would only get 2.0 output if you select PCM regardless of whether you are using HDMI or Toslink.
Yes, but I didn’t say “if you select PCM”, I was saying “I see reference to two channel output”. I’m not talking about settings. I’m talking about the Sony TV spec..

To clarify: Settings matter

The settings dictate what the tv outputs. If you select PCM it will be a 2 channel output. Dolby Digital is 5.1 as long as the source is 5.1.

It seems you may have thought I was referring to settings in the pre/pro or receiver - I was not. I am referring to settings to get 5.1 audio out of the tv. Whatever DSP is applied on top of that is secondary and not part of what we're talking about.

In the TV sound settings you must choose from 3 audio output settings. In the Sony it's under: Settings - Sound - Digital audio output. (Don't hold me to exact verbiage - I'm doing this on the fly without access to the tv.)

Straight out of the box, a default setting is already active as there is no "none" option. It is probably PCM as that is the one most likely to work universally and for the folks who have older gear or a basic sound bar etc.

The exact terms escape me at the moment but I believe the first 2 are "Auto Digital" 1 & 2. The first one outputs the uncompressed bitstream from the tv so your receiver decompresses the signal and outputs whatever format it is fed. The second IIRC is a hybrid that sends some material as bitstream and some as PCM depending on the source. The third option is PCM, which apparently outputs only 2 channel. Never tried it myself.

To sum up:

Either HDMI or optical should provide 5.1 audio as long as you do not have PCM selected, and the source (internal apps, BD players, Game Consoles - anything fed directly into the tv) is outputting 5.1. I believe (but am not certain because I have not tested it) that the source device should be set to bitstream as well. YMMV. I just know that my PS4 fed directly to the TV results in 5.1 output to my pre/pro but don't recall the audio output setting on the PS4. I also get 5.1 from internal apps like Netflix, Prime, Vudu etc.

The bottom line answer to your question is yes, you can get 5.1 output from the tv via arc. This will likely vary from one manufacturer to another and also between different models by the same manufacturer but I would venture to guess that most current tvs, whether Arc or eArc would have 5.1 output or pass through capability.

Bear in mind I am only dictating what the 930e can do. They are out of production and you'll probably be hard pressed to find one new so unless you're shopping refurb or pre-owned this info is little more than a pointer of things to look for if you are considering a Sony product.

I hope this clears things up and helps you in your shopping.

To further ease your mind check out page 20 - bottom right of this link. It mentions 2 channel - but that is only in reference to PCM. Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital Plus and DTS are multi-channel formats.


https://www.sony-latin.com/electroni.../4690458EM.pdf

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post #22 of 32 Old 01-03-2019, 08:41 AM
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[quote=Artzilla;57366200]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post


To clarify: Settings matter

The settings dictate what the tv outputs. If you select PCM it will be a 2 channel output. Dolby Digital is 5.1 as long as the source is 5.1.

It seems you may have thought I was referring to settings in the pre/pro or receiver - I was not. I am referring to settings to get 5.1 audio out of the tv. Whatever DSP is applied on top of that is secondary and not part of what we're talking about.

In the TV sound settings you must choose from 3 audio output settings. In the Sony it's under: Settings - Sound - Digital audio output. (Don't hold me to exact verbiage - I'm doing this on the fly without access to the tv.)

Straight out of the box, a default setting is already active as there is no "none" option. It is probably PCM as that is the one most likely to work universally and for the folks who have older gear or a basic sound bar etc.

The exact terms escape me at the moment but I believe the first 2 are "Auto Digital" 1 & 2. The first one outputs the uncompressed bitstream from the tv so your receiver decompresses the signal and outputs whatever format it is fed. The second IIRC is a hybrid that sends some material as bitstream and some as PCM depending on the source. The third option is PCM, which apparently outputs only 2 channel. Never tried it myself.

To sum up:

Either HDMI or optical should provide 5.1 audio as long as you do not have PCM selected, and the source (internal apps, BD players, Game Consoles - anything fed directly into the tv) is outputting 5.1. I believe (but am not certain because I have not tested it) that the source device should be set to bitstream as well. YMMV. I just know that my PS4 fed directly to the TV results in 5.1 output to my pre/pro but don't recall the audio output setting on the PS4. I also get 5.1 from internal apps like Netflix, Prime, Vudu etc.

The bottom line answer to your question is yes, you can get 5.1 output from the tv via arc. This will likely vary from one manufacturer to another and also between different models by the same manufacturer but I would venture to guess that most current tvs, whether Arc or eArc would have 5.1 output or pass through capability.

Bear in mind I am only dictating what the 930e can do. They are out of production and you'll probably be hard pressed to find one new so unless you're shopping refurb or pre-owned this info is little more than a pointer of things to look for if you are considering a Sony product.

I hope this clears things up and helps you in your shopping.

To further ease your mind check out page 20 - bottom right of this link. It mentions 2 channel - but that is only in reference to PCM. Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital Plus and DTS are multi-channel formats.


https://www.sony-latin.com/electroni.../4690458EM.pdf
Okay, I was referring to pg. 21 and 22 of the USA manual, you must be referring to the Latin manual/ pg. 20.
That’s fine as the wording is the same.
You are confused about Dolby Digital, and some of the other formats.
Dolby Digital refers to the encoding process and NOT how many channels.
Dolby Digital can be Mono, Two Channel, Four Channel, 5.1.
You can’t just see the words Dolby Digital and assume multi channel.
You my friend are not reading and understanding the Sony 930e specs..
It clearly states that on HDMI 3 ARC, you will get LPCM, Dolby Digital, DTS....in Two Channel. There is no multi channel audio leaving the TV.

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post #23 of 32 Old 01-03-2019, 12:13 PM
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[quote=Espo77;57369442]
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Originally Posted by Artzilla View Post

Okay, I was referring to pg. 21 and 22 of the USA manual, you must be referring to the Latin manual/ pg. 20.
That’s fine as the wording is the same.
You are confused about Dolby Digital, and some of the other formats.
Dolby Digital refers to the encoding process and NOT how many channels.
Dolby Digital can be Mono, Two Channel, Four Channel, 5.1.
You can’t just see the words Dolby Digital and assume multi channel.
You my friend are not reading and understanding the Sony 930e specs..
It clearly states that on HDMI 3 ARC, you will get LPCM, Dolby Digital, DTS....in Two Channel. There is no multi channel audio leaving the TV.
I give up. I have the set - and have been using it and getting the results I have described previously. I have tried to help but you feel you glean more from a manual about a device you don't have access to than I do about a set that I have used in actual practice for over a year. I don't see how any more input from me will be of use.

FWIW - I suppose you are correct about the DD encoding potentially being mono or stereo. I was merely referring to what this set can output applicable to our conversation. Seriously - it outputs multichannel audio. I use it every day. There's a 930e thread where others can verify this.

Best of Luck.

Last edited by Artzilla; 01-03-2019 at 12:24 PM.
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post #24 of 32 Old 01-03-2019, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osirus23 View Post
Every device I've used that supports ARC requires CEC to be enabled in order to use it.

I think that's because HDMI is normally an input only port. ARC and CEC are both output signals making the HDMI connection an Input/Output port. When you 'enable' CEC, you're not enabling CEC specifically, but you're enabling all HDMI output functions which include ARC and CEC.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfster View Post
I hook all the peripherals to the receiver and just one HDMI to the TV. It is convenient as I can just switch inputs on the receiver and do not have cable clutter to the TV. As to the other way of hooking it, your receiver should tell you what it is decoding. The only advantage of hooking everything to the TV that comes to mind is that you could calibrate the TV to each input device instead of just one setting. I tried that and did not have an appreciable difference in settings and opted for convenience.

I think it's cleaner and easier to connect everything to the TV first and use ARC to the AVR (I have a soundbar). I don't use lossless 5.1 audio formats and my TV (Sony 900e) supports DD+ over ARC, so it's not an issue for me. It's easier to use because with only one input to the AVR, I only have to change inputs on the TV to change AV sources.
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^
I turned off Simplink (CEC) on my LG OLED for a test. The Audio Return Channel still works. ARC is enabled on my Yamaha Receiver. All my components go to the Yamaha and one HDMI Cable goes goes from the Yamaha to the LG ARC Port.

TV - LG 65B7P OLED / Receiver - Yamaha RX-A1040 7.2 / Blu Ray - Oppo BDP-83 / Turntable - Technics SL-3300 / Cable Box - Comcast X1 V4 4K /L & R Paradigm Studio 20 V3
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[quote=Artzilla;57370736]
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Originally Posted by Espo77 View Post
I give up. I have the set - and have been using it and getting the results I have described previously. I have tried to help but you feel you glean more from a manual about a device you don't have access to than I do about a set that I have used in actual practice for over a year. I don't see how any more input from me will be of use.

FWIW - I suppose you are correct about the DD encoding potentially being mono or stereo. I was merely referring to what this set can output applicable to our conversation. Seriously - it outputs multichannel audio. I use it every day. There's a 930e thread where others can verify this.

Best of Luck.
I’m not trying to be difficult, and I will look for that thread that you mentioned. I am mearly trying to have dialogue about the HDMI Output on the 930e using the ARC..more specifically, the wording in the Sony manual that states Two Channel output on the HDMI#3 ARC.
I appreciate your thoughts.

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post #28 of 32 Old 01-03-2019, 01:25 PM
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No problem. Like I said, trying to help. I too am extremely anal (no offense - like I said - me too - it's actually a compliment in this context) about the gear I buy and research, and also skeptical of info I receive and I verify it from numerous sources before I make decisions.


If you are seriously considering this set, or another Sony which will likely have similar functionality, post the question of whether or not it outputs multi-channel audio here:


https://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...l#post57365706




One thing to beware - In this set and "I believe" current models Sony uses Dolby vision profile 5 (which some term as "low latency") which limits your options for Dolby Vision capable Blu Ray players to certain Sony, Oppo, and Panasonic models. If there are others compatible with Sony's implementation of Dolby Vision I am not aware of them.


Happy hunting.
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[QUOTE=Artzilla;57371206]No problem. Like I said, trying to help. I too am extremely anal (no offense - like I said - me too - it's actually a compliment in this context)

Yes it’s the journey for me. The research.



If you are seriously considering this set, or another Sony

Funny thing...I’m not actually shopping for a TV at this time. LOL

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post #30 of 32 Old 01-03-2019, 03:39 PM
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Yes, that's hilarious. I suspected I was wasting my time midway into this but I try to err on the side of best intentions. I hope it was entertaining for you.

Last edited by Artzilla; 01-03-2019 at 03:44 PM.
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