Rear Center? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 09:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Question Rear Center?

I have recently upgraded my home theater from a 6.1 to a 5.1.4 (replace Yamaha RX-Z1 with RX-A3080). This has left me with an unused rear center speaker mounted to the ceiling. I guess this position is obsolete now? Seems a shame to abandon it - especially since I can't take it down.
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post #2 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSRagE View Post
I have recently upgraded my home theater from a 6.1 to a 5.1.4 (replace Yamaha RX-Z1 with RX-A3080). This has left me with an unused rear center speaker mounted to the ceiling. I guess this position is obsolete now? Seems a shame to abandon it - especially since I can't take it down.
I think the 6.1 formats like DTS:ES and Dolby Digital EX were more prevalent on DVD and never really caught on. Then Bluray came out and started supporting Dolby True HD (lossless)/Dolby Digital Plus (lossy) and DTS Master Audio (lossless)/DTS HD (lossy) 7.1 formats, which replaced the single mono rear center channel in favor of separate, discrete SBR and SBL channels. I don't know the exact dates, but I'm guessing the mono rear center channel has kind of been obsolete for a good 10-12 years.
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post #3 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 11:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by HarleyRider View Post
I think the 6.1 formats like DTS:ES and Dolby Digital EX were more prevalent on DVD and never really caught on. Then Bluray came out and started supporting Dolby True HD (lossless)/Dolby Digital Plus (lossy) and DTS Master Audio (lossless)/DTS HD (lossy) 7.1 formats, which replaced the single mono rear center channel in favor of separate, discrete SBR and SBL channels. I don't know the exact dates, but I'm guessing the mono rear center channel has kind of been obsolete for a good 10-12 years.
Huh, that is what I was afraid of. Sounds about right since I originally built the HT in 2004. Its too bad though since I recently renovated and included ceiling-mounted banana jacks at each speaker's location (I'm good at cutting holes, not so good at fixing them ). Good thing my wife is pretty patient with these shenanigans!

Cool avatar, BTW. My HT is made up of Mirage Omnis (now including a spare CC)
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post #4 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 11:30 AM
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Can you do 6.1.4? I have a rear center and would like to make use of it as well.
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post #5 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by PSRagE View Post
Huh, that is what I was afraid of. Sounds about right since I originally built the HT in 2004. Its too bad though since I recently renovated and included ceiling-mounted banana jacks at each speaker's location (I'm good at cutting holes, not so good at fixing them ). Good thing my wife is pretty patient with these shenanigans!

Cool avatar, BTW. My HT is made up of Mirage Omnis (now including a spare CC)
I know what you mean. It's good to have a patient wife. Mine's a saint for putting up with me always tweaking something, moving a speaker somewhere else, buying a new piece of gear.

Thanks, yeah, Mirage -- good stuff. Was really bummed when they folded. I picked up a pair of OMD-28 towers and an OMD-C2 about 12 years ago for a fraction of what they cost when they first came out. Always planned to go back and pick up some Omnis or OMD-R's to round out the rest of the surround channels for home theater but waited too long. So now the OMD-28's are in storage until I get around to redoing my living room and setting up a 2-channel music-only rig. They're just too cool to part with.

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post #6 of 12 Old 07-09-2019, 12:55 PM
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In my early car stereo days, I had the left + and right + hooked up to a center. AIUI, the center would play the DIFFERENCE between the other two speakers. Since you're already wired, you might want to try something like that.
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post #7 of 12 Old 07-12-2019, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSRagE View Post
I have recently upgraded my home theater from a 6.1 to a 5.1.4 (replace Yamaha RX-Z1 with RX-A3080). This has left me with an unused rear center speaker mounted to the ceiling. I guess this position is obsolete now? Seems a shame to abandon it - especially since I can't take it down.
5(7).1.6, with the two rear Atmos channels merged and fed to the one speaker?

It's a VIRTUAL channel unless stated otherwise.

Last edited by RayGuy; 07-15-2019 at 11:07 PM.
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post #8 of 12 Old 07-17-2019, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSRagE View Post
I have recently upgraded my home theater from a 6.1 to a 5.1.4 (replace Yamaha RX-Z1 with RX-A3080). This has left me with an unused rear center speaker mounted to the ceiling. I guess this position is obsolete now? Seems a shame to abandon it - especially since I can't take it down.
Now that is a name I have not seen in a great many years.

As for what to do with your rear center, I would say put it to use. I take it you are using the room correction software in the RX-A3080 so that rules out Dolbly PLII center extraction using an old AVR. What you will need is a line level mixer and then a suitable amplification for the speaker.

You want each signal sent to the rear centre reduced by about 3dB.

It is a lot of talk about centre extraction in this thread where it is used to expand 4 hights to 6 and add front wide speakers as well.
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post #9 of 12 Old 07-17-2019, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
Now that is a name I have not seen in a great many years.

As for what to do with your rear center, I would say put it to use. I take it you are using the room correction software in the RX-A3080 so that rules out Dolbly PLII center extraction using an old AVR. What you will need is a line level mixer and then a suitable amplification for the speaker.

You want each signal sent to the rear centre reduced by about 3dB.

It is a lot of talk about centre extraction in this thread where it is used to expand 4 hights to 6 and add front wide speakers as well.
A great many years is right, good to "see" you again!

This sounds like a solid plan. I'll give that thread a read.

Thanks!
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post #10 of 12 Old 07-18-2019, 11:25 AM
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DIY Rear Center

I have been running a synthesized rear center since 2002!

Basically all you do is mix the rear left and rear right in an L-R to get a difference signal. That's your rear center. I initially used an old junked Lexicon CP1 processor which could do that.

Today MiniDSP makes a board and has specific software for a rear center channel.

How does it sound? Hard to tell, The effect is very subtle, probably not worth the effort unless you already have the speaker mounted in place.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/plu...channel-detail
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Last edited by Glimmie; 07-18-2019 at 11:29 AM.
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post #11 of 12 Old 07-18-2019, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Glimmie View Post
I have been running a synthesized rear center since 2002!

Basically all you do is mix the rear left and rear right in an L-R to get a difference signal. That's your rear center. I initially used an old junked Lexicon CP1 processor which could do that.

Today MiniDSP makes a board and has specific software for a rear center channel.

How does it sound? Hard to tell, The effect is very subtle, probably not worth the effort unless you already have the speaker mounted in place.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/plu...channel-detail
Yeah, that is the thing. It is mounted and is pretty permanent - it may as well do something:



I figure I'll use Mashie's mixer connected to the Surround Back pre-outs and the output from that will go to an old Yamaha AVC-30U amplifier I have in storage.


Huh, [IMG] tags not working? Pic here: http://www.houseofrage.com/images/Room1.jpg

Last edited by PSRagE; 07-18-2019 at 03:00 PM.
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post #12 of 12 Old 07-18-2019, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSRagE View Post
Huh, [IMG] tags not working? Pic here: http://www.houseofrage.com/images/Room1.jpg
The [IMG] tags should work, however they seem to be broken right now.

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