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post #3871 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
I'm to old school to want voice anything. Maybe my accent is just rubbish, but each time I get new tech, or have to use a new auto phone service, I try it, and get livid... Even siri on the appleTV remote - I thought I might give it a go to use it to enter the password. Jeez, I nearly smashed the thing.

The thing I love most about the Harmony Elite is the remote with the physical buttons. I use it blind, in the dark in the HT and no issues. I have physical buttons mapped for all activites, and I've learnt them now. It is fast, efficient. Last thing I want to do is start talking...

I used to use an MX trackball (been a long long time track ball user, 20 years, home and work, and I'm in software dev), but ended moving to the Elecom ones. They are definitely nicer IMHO - sapphire bearing pins so the balls just move much smoother.
LOL...I'm with you there. We have friends that are into using voice control and whenever we are at their house and they start in with the "Alexa blah, blah, blah" I just want to grab the damn remote, push a button, and be done with it That said, their are occasions when I do use voice. For example, when I need to enter search terms like when searching for a specific movie title. But the Harmony has it covered there, I just grab my phone.

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post #3872 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
LOL...I'm with you there. We have friends that are into using voice control and whenever we are at their house and they start in with the "Alexa blah, blah, blah" I just want to grab the damn remote, push a button, and be done with it That said, their are occasions when I do use voice. For example, when I need to enter search terms like when searching for a specific movie title. But the Harmony has it covered there, I just grab my phone.
Please elaborate. How do you use the Harmony phone app to perform voice searches?
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post #3873 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 10:01 AM
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Please elaborate. How do you use the Harmony phone app to perform voice searches?
Anytime you need to enter text you can just open the Harmony app on your phone, click on the little keyboard icon in the lower right and once the phone keyboard comes up just click on the microphone and start talking, then hit send. I've used it on the iPhone but don't know about other phones. I don't often use the voice feature but anytime I need to enter text of more than a few characters I mostly use the phone keyboard using the Harmony app on my phone as it makes it so much easier to type. You can use the Harmony app on a tablet too. I'll use my iPad sometimes as well if that is what I have handy at the time...
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post #3874 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
LOL...I'm with you there. We have friends that are into using voice control and whenever we are at their house and they start in with the "Alexa blah, blah, blah" I just want to grab the damn remote, push a button, and be done with it That said, their are occasions when I do use voice. For example, when I need to enter search terms like when searching for a specific movie title. But the Harmony has it covered there, I just grab my phone.
Lol yeah. Ife3l like saying "shut the f up and hit the button". Or "just turn off the g d light when you leave the room"
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post #3875 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
Anytime you need to enter text you can just open the Harmony app on your phone, click on the little keyboard icon in the lower right and once the phone keyboard comes up just click on the microphone and start talking, then hit send. I've used it on the iPhone but don't know about other phones. I don't often use the voice feature but anytime I need to enter text of more than a few characters I mostly use the phone keyboard using the Harmony app on my phone as it makes it so much easier to type. You can use the Harmony app on a tablet too. I'll use my iPad sometimes as well if that is what I have handy at the time...


What keyboard icon are you talking about? This is what I see:

[Video]https://d.pr/v/0VdRfs[/video]
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post #3876 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 05:46 PM
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I was wondering about that as well as I don't see a keyboard icon either.
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post #3877 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 06:12 PM
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What keyboard icon are you talking about? This is what I see:

[Video]https://d.pr/v/0VdRfs[/video]
It’s been a couple of years since I switched to all streaming and haven’t had any DirecTV equipment since then. I’m guessing that the Harmony uses IR for the DirecTV gear? AFAIK, keyboard functionality is only available for equipment that Harmony uses BT or IP to control. I see the keyboard icon for all my FireTV devices, my Nvidia Shields, and my ATV 4k. See the little keyboard icon in the lower right of this screen capture as an example (this one is for one of my FireTV Stick 4k’s) -
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post #3878 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 06:37 PM
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Ah, BT or IP, that makes sense. Thanks.
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post #3879 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
It’s been a couple of years since I switched to all streaming and haven’t had any DirecTV equipment since then. I’m guessing that the Harmony uses IR for the DirecTV gear? AFAIK, keyboard functionality is only available for equipment that Harmony uses BT or IP to control. I see the keyboard icon for all my FireTV devices, my Nvidia Shields, and my ATV 4k. See the little keyboard icon in the lower right of this screen capture as an example (this one is for one of my FireTV Stick 4k’s) -
Oh sweet, that means for my AppleTV, I could actually use the harmony elite keyboard to enter my username / password on it. I didn't realize that.
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post #3880 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
Oh sweet, that means for my AppleTV, I could actually use the harmony elite keyboard to enter my username / password on it. I didn't realize that.
Be aware that for the ATV 4 or 4k in order to connect via BT you need to use the Harmony beta test Apple TV device. This is from the Harmony support site:

If you are not using a keyboard and would like to control your Apple TV with your Harmony Remote via Bluetooth you can add your Apple TV as a device using manufacturer Harmony Beta and model number Test Apple TV. This will allow additional features such as the TV/Home button and sleep mode.

TV/Home button:
The Home button provides additional functionality by allowing you to directly return to the home screen and launch the App Switcher when pressing twice.

Sleep mode:
The Harmony will automatically put the Apple TV to sleep when hitting the of button or switching activities. This default behaviour can be changed by modifying the default power settings.
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post #3881 of 4389 Old 07-02-2019, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
Be aware that for the ATV 4 or 4k in order to connect via BT you need to use the Harmony beta test Apple TV device. This is from the Harmony support site:

If you are not using a keyboard and would like to control your Apple TV with your Harmony Remote via Bluetooth you can add your Apple TV as a device using manufacturer Harmony Beta and model number Test Apple TV. This will allow additional features such as the TV/Home button and sleep mode.

TV/Home button:
The Home button provides additional functionality by allowing you to directly return to the home screen and launch the App Switcher when pressing twice.

Sleep mode:
The Harmony will automatically put the Apple TV to sleep when hitting the of button or switching activities. This default behaviour can be changed by modifying the default power settings.
Ugh... That means setting up activities again.... Geez I hate how hard it is to setup the activities. They should allow copy, replace device, etc.

How do you actually add it as beta? What do you type in the Model number?

OK I figured it with your instructions. I guess I can use the normal one on the activity, and just have the device for keyboard... Thanks!

Last edited by MOberhardt; 07-03-2019 at 01:48 AM.
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post #3882 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
Ugh... That means setting up activities again.... Geez I hate how hard it is to setup the activities. They should allow copy, replace device, etc.

How do you actually add it as beta? What do you type in the Model number?

OK I figured it with your instructions. I guess I can use the normal one on the activity, and just have the device for keyboard... Thanks!
It's been some time since I set mine up but IIRC I don't think you have to completely redo your activities that include the ATV, you just have to go into the activities that include it and swap out the ATV device for the beta ATV device with the keyboard. Their are other benefits like the home button functionality and sleep mode as described in the text from Harmony that I included so it may be worth it to do. I only had one "watch Apple TV 4k" activity so it was easy for me to do.
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Last edited by mjwagner; 07-03-2019 at 06:40 AM.
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post #3883 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
It's been some time since I set mine up but IIRC I don't think you have to completely redo your activities that include the ATV, you just have to go into the activities that include it and swap out the ATV device for the beta ATV device with the keyboard. Their are other benefits like the home button functionality and sleep mode as described in the text from Harmony that I included so it may be worth it to do. I only had one "watch Apple TV 4k" activity so it was easy for me to do.

Yeah, that's pretty much how it should work, at least in the My Harmony software. First add/configure the new device. Then hit the affected activity setup(s) and deselect the old device and select the new device on the "Select which device will play a movie" page of the setup wizard (at least for me... all of my streaming devices are set up as "Watch a Movie" activities). As I recall, any commands that have the EXACT same command name will remain intact across the device swap, but anything that has a new or different command name (even if they perform the same function) will need to be re-added in the customize buttons section.
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post #3884 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 08:07 AM
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Yeah, that's pretty much how it should work, at least in the My Harmony software. First add/configure the new device. Then hit the affected activity setup(s) and deselect the old device and select the new device on the "Select which device will play a movie" page of the setup wizard (at least for me... all of my streaming devices are set up as "Watch a Movie" activities). As I recall, any commands that have the EXACT same command name will remain intact across the device swap, but anything that has a new or different command name (even if they perform the same function) will need to be re-added in the customize buttons section.
Yes. The key is to use the MyHarmony desktop app rather than the mobile app. Makes everything so much simpler. I only use the mobile app for changes or additions when it's the only way to do it. Like for BT pairing and home automation. There maybe a few other items as well. Harmony support has a chart that shows what you need to use the mobile app to do vs the MyHarmony software.
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post #3885 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 10:19 AM
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That's very helpful, thanks.

Is the original device deleted after being replaced?


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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
It's been some time since I set mine up but IIRC I don't think you have to completely redo your activities that include the ATV, you just have to go into the activities that include it and swap out the ATV device for the beta ATV device with the keyboard. Their are other benefits like the home button functionality and sleep mode as described in the text from Harmony that I included so it may be worth it to do. I only had one "watch Apple TV 4k" activity so it was easy for me to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcalabria View Post
Yeah, that's pretty much how it should work, at least in the My Harmony software. First add/configure the new device. Then hit the affected activity setup(s) and deselect the old device and select the new device on the "Select which device will play a movie" page of the setup wizard (at least for me... all of my streaming devices are set up as "Watch a Movie" activities). As I recall, any commands that have the EXACT same command name will remain intact across the device swap, but anything that has a new or different command name (even if they perform the same function) will need to be re-added in the customize buttons section.

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post #3886 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 10:53 AM
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That's very helpful, thanks.

Is the original device deleted after being replaced?
Don't know if it matters but I did not delete mine...
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post #3887 of 4389 Old 07-03-2019, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by noah katz View Post
That's very helpful, thanks.

Is the original device deleted after being replaced?

I certainly would not remove it until you were certain that the new one works satisfactorily. Beyond that trial period, I tend to delete unused devices just to keep things tidy, but there is no absolute need to delete the old device unless you're up against a device count limitation.
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post #3888 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 05:56 AM
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I have been using a URC remote (MX-890 first and now MX-990) for quite some time. However, as I am watching via my Apple TV 4k more and more it means I now have to use my iphone a lot more. I would like to consolidate things into one remote.

I have devices that require IR, RF and BT (mainly Bryston SP-3 processor, Directv Genie, Apple TV and Oppo Blu-ray).

Does the Elite check all the boxes (including macro programming available in the URC)?

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post #3889 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 06:58 AM
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I have been using a URC remote (MX-890 first and now MX-990) for quite some time. However, as I am watching via my Apple TV 4k more and more it means I now have to use my iphone a lot more. I would like to consolidate things into one remote.

I have devices that require IR, RF and BT (mainly Bryston SP-3 processor, Directv Genie, Apple TV and Oppo Blu-ray).

Does the Elite check all the boxes (including macro programming available in the URC)?
The Elite can control devices using IR, BT, and IP. AFAIK it cannot use RF to control devices. Check the Harmony support site for questions about it's capability to control specific devices. It can do "sequences" which is similar to macros but depending on what you are doing with macros the Elite may not be able to do it.
The real answer to your question is that it is going to depend on the exact equipment you are trying to control and the exact scenarios you need to duplicate from the URC. It may or may not be able to do it. You should be fine with the DirecTV box, ATV, and Oppo. Not too sure about the Bryston.
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post #3890 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by dminches View Post
I have devices that require IR, RF and BT (mainly Bryston SP-3 processor, Directv Genie, Apple TV and Oppo Blu-ray).
The Harmony database does contain an entry for the Bryston SP-3 with a reasonable set of command for power, input selection, direction control, etc. This implies that it can be controlled via IR, and it may also be able to do IP control. Seems that you should be good to go.
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Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
Yes. The key is to use the MyHarmony desktop app rather than the mobile app. Makes everything so much simpler. I only use the mobile app for changes or additions when it's the only way to do it. Like for BT pairing and home automation. There maybe a few other items as well. Harmony support has a chart that shows what you need to use the mobile app to do vs the MyHarmony software.
Yeah the desktop app is better and even some simple thnigs I can only do on the PC. Button Activities on the mobile app don't show inputs for some reason, but they do on the PC app. So on my activities, I always setup a "toggle AVR inputs" and "toggle projector inputs" to trigger handshaking again if I get HDCP type garbage. I can only set those up on the PC. The inputs just don't show on the mobile.

I have tried replacing a device on an activity, but the button mappings left. So I've now setup a new one for the Apple TV Beta.
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post #3892 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by dminches View Post
Does the Elite check all the boxes (including macro programming available in the URC)?
Harmony does not have macro programming like you're accustomed to with URC. Macros (Harmony calls them Activities) are created for you automatically by answering a series of questions. You don't have much control over the steps in the macro. But you can adjust the timing and order a little. You can also add a few additional commands as long as those steps don't change inputs or power states. I personally can't accept having my hands tied like this, so I don't use Harmony myself. But for folks who want something super simple to program and use (most people), Harmony fits the bill. There's a reason why it's far and away the most popular universal remote brand.

Harmony also has a second type of fully user defined macro called a Sequence. It's not allowed to do power or input changes either. It's limited to 20 steps. Enough for most, but a far cry from the 256 step limit on URC.

The ability to add pronto hex codes like you can with URC is also different. While you can't do this yourself, you CAN email codes to support and they will add them to your account quickly and for free.

The ability to change graphics is limited to custom favorite channel logos.

As for RF, you do realize that your 990 can't directly control RF or BT devices either, right? It's converting RF to IR and controlling your devices that way. Your 990 can't do BT at all. So you won't be losing those particular capabilities since they never existed in the first place. You will be gaining limited IP and BT capabilities as well as Zigbee and a few other home automation protocols.

Another big difference is the number of possible devices. The max number of devices on the Elite is 15. The max on your 990 is 255. Doesn't come into play in your current setup, but something to think about in the future.

Last edited by mdavej; 07-04-2019 at 06:23 PM.
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post #3893 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
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Harmony does not have macro programming like you're accustomed to with URC. Macros (Harmony calls them Activities) are created for you automatically by answering a series of questions. You don't have much control over the steps in the macro. But you can adjust the timing and order a little. You can also add a few additional commands as long as those steps don't change inputs or power states. I personally can't accept having my hands tied like this, so I don't use Harmony myself. But for folks who want something super simple to program and use (most people), Harmony fits the bill. There's a reason why it's far and away the most popular universal remote brand.

Harmony also has a second type of fully user defined macro called a Sequence. It's not allowed to do power or input changes either. It's limited to 20 steps. Enough for most, but a far cry from the 256 step limit on URC.

The ability to add pronto hex codes like you can with URC is also different. While you can't do this yourself, you CAN email codes to support and they will add them to your account quickly and for free.

The ability to change graphics is limited to custom favorite channel logos.

As for RF, you do realize that your 990 can't directly control RF or BT devices either, right? It's converting RF to IR and controlling your devices that way. Your 990 can't do BT at all. So you won't be losing those particular capabilities since they never existed in the first place. You will be gaining limited IP and BT capabilities as well as Zigbee and a few other home automation protocols.

Another big difference is the number of possible devices. The max number of devices on the Elite is 15. The max on your 990 is 255. Doesn't come into play in your current setup, but something to think about in the future.
I realize my URC doesn't do BT and RF. That's why I am asking since I am not going to buy another remote which only has the same capabilities as mine.

The Harmony isn't for me. I want to be able to fully program all the steps.

David M.
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I'd never even heard of the URC. Looks good - love how more button centric too (which is all I use)
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post #3895 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 08:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdavej View Post
Harmony does not have macro programming like you're accustomed to with URC. Macros (Harmony calls them Activities) are created for you automatically by answering a series of questions. .
Quote:
Originally Posted by dminches View Post
I realize my URC doesn't do BT and RF. That's why I am asking since I am not going to buy another remote which only has the same capabilities as mine.

The Harmony isn't for me. I want to be able to fully program all the steps.
MyHarmony allows you to create as many and complex macros as you wish within any activity. Similarly you can customize an activity by adding commands in any order you wish.. You are only limited by your creativity and imagination.
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post #3896 of 4389 Old 07-04-2019, 09:16 PM
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It is amazing now how much I use it. I got it at an utter bargain, and set it up in my lounge room and had so many issues with it and the playstations, I gave up and put it in the cupboard for nearly two years. I built my HT downstairs and pulled it out of mothballs, and had much more success (after putting in the work setting up), and use it all the time now. I don't have a Playstation in the HT though - although I might get a PSpro some time. But upstairs I had too many issues with ps3, ps4.
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post #3897 of 4389 Old 07-05-2019, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by dminches View Post
The Harmony isn't for me. I want to be able to fully program all the steps.
How about posting the most complex step that you need performed and we can common on the possibility of the Harmony being able to do that.
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post #3898 of 4389 Old 07-05-2019, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BPlayer View Post
How about posting the most complex step that you need performed and we can common on the possibility of the Harmony being able to do that.
It is not just about complexity since what I have now may not be what I want in the future. Plus, some of my current programming is limited by the fact that the URC doesn't support BT or RF.

I need to do more research about the Elite to understand the programming. It doesn't seem as though I am able to get the programming modules without actually having a remote and hub.

David M.
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post #3899 of 4389 Old 07-05-2019, 06:09 AM
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Harmony Elite

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjwagner View Post
Be aware that for the ATV 4 or 4k in order to connect via BT you need to use the Harmony beta test Apple TV device. This is from the Harmony support site:



If you are not using a keyboard and would like to control your Apple TV with your Harmony Remote via Bluetooth you can add your Apple TV as a device using manufacturer Harmony Beta and model number Test Apple TV. This will allow additional features such as the TV/Home button and sleep mode.



TV/Home button:

The Home button provides additional functionality by allowing you to directly return to the home screen and launch the App Switcher when pressing twice.



Sleep mode:

The Harmony will automatically put the Apple TV to sleep when hitting the of button or switching activities. This default behaviour can be changed by modifying the default power settings.


BTW, the newest Apple TV Beta (13.0 17J5515e) works again with the Harmony Beta (Bluetooth). From what I can tell, Sleep and Home buttons work as it did before with 12.x. This should be available soon on the Public Beta.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Sony XBR-65X930E | ATV4K-64GB & 2-32GB 5th Gens | Nvidia Shield TV Pro 2017 | Nvidia Shield TV Pro 2019 | Logitech Harmony Elite
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post #3900 of 4389 Old 07-05-2019, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dminches View Post
It is not just about complexity since what I have now may not be what I want in the future. Plus, some of my current programming is limited by the fact that the URC doesn't support BT or RF.

I need to do more research about the Elite to understand the programming. It doesn't seem as though I am able to get the programming modules without actually having a remote and hub.
Example - Watch Apple TV:

Answering questions about viewing device, playback device, inputs, etc. leave you with an un-editable macro something like this:
- Power on AVR
- Power on TV
- Power on Apple (?)
- Select Apple TV input on AVR
- Select AVR input on TV
- Set volume punch thru to AVR
- Set transport/menu keys to Apple TV

This is typical of most activities.

You can then add as many steps as you want to the end of the above sequence including variable length delays. For example, a sequence of arrows and ok's to launch a specific app on the ATV.

What you can't do is add any additional power or input changing steps. (Technically, if you have another remote to learn these commands from, you can use the learns of those commands if you really need to). You can't add steps that change screens on the remote. You can't do conditional branching (IF THEN ELSE) type of programming. You can't use variables for tracking states or storing/retrieving values.

So I don't agree with other posters that you can program "ANYTHING", but you can program most things within the boundaries outlined above.

It's not wide open like URC, but it is workable for the vast majority. I'm sure I could make Harmony work in my setup if I tried hard enough. It's just easier for me to write my own macros from scratch.

For those unfamiliar with URC. They are meant for professional installers to program, not end users, although many end users do program them. They have far more sophisticated programming capabilities than Harmony and have been around longer than Harmony. Users with access to that level of control can find Harmony's model hard to adjust to. The only way to know for sure if it will work for you is to try it for yourself.
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