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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Don't know if this is anything new, but it was in the news today:

http://mdn.mainichi-msn.co.jp/nation...na012000c.html

Japanese electronics firms abandon unifying standards for next-generation DVDs


Two groups of Japanese major electronics companies have abandoned unifying their standards for next-generation DVDs, industry sources said Tuesday.


A group led by Toshiba Corp. and the other comprising of Sony Corp. and Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., among other firms, have failed to reach agreement on the standards for their larger-capacity, next-generation DVDs.


As a result, DVD systems with two incompatible standards will coexist, like VHS and Beta systems for videotape recorders, which will inconvenience consumers.


In late February, Toshiba, which prefers the HD-DVD standard, and Sony and Matsushita, which are in favor of the Blue-Ray Disc standard, began negotiations on a single standard for their next-generation DVDs.


At one point, they agreed in principle to work out a third DVD standard by combining the advantages of both systems. However, the talks came to a standstill in mid-May after they failed to narrow their differences over expenses and the gap between Hollywood film production companies over the standards.


The group backing the HD-DVD standard that includes Sanyo Electric Co. and NEC Corp. is set to hand over devices used to transform movie films into DVDs to film producers in Hollywood in September.


Companies backing the Blue-Ray Disc standard, including Sharp Corp., have stepped up production of next-generation DVDs such as trial operations of their production lines.


Film production firms in Hollywood are also split over standards for next-generation DVDs. Warner, Paramount and Universal back the HD-DVD standard while Disney, MGM, Sony Pictures and 20th Century Fox have sided with the Blue-Ray Disc system. (Mainichi)


August 23, 2005
 

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Of course.


But I still think we'll see something in time for the holidays or maybe in the 1st quarter at the latest.
 

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Two formats can't help anything. But even if there were one format, it's not like it was going to be a real money making endever for the first few years (at least). If the two sides thought that there was more money to be made by unifying, and enough to justify the change, you can bet they would have done it. So now it's just a matter who cries "uncle" first.


larry
 

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If they stick with two formats, and if half the good movies come out in one and the other half in the other, i will just stick with my regular dvds!


Its like years ago, HBO used to get every good movie. Then, all the pay movie channels started signing exclusives, and then HBO only got some good movies, Showtime got a bunch of them, Cinemax got a bunch of them, and i got upset and decided it was not worth it to subscribe to all of them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU
Are dual-format players a possibility?
Of course. But probably a remote possibility, I suspect, unless one uses a PC as one's DVD player and puts a HD-DVD drive in one slot, and a Blu-Ray drive in another slot - unless/until an enterprising PC parts manufacturer creates a dual drive. Just my guess. Maybe the technology allows both kinds of lasers in a single drive. Will they use same-size/shape disc/cartridge, however?
 

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Two-format playback machines are possible and will probably exist. However a DVD recorder/player is another matter - I for one would like to see such, and it will be surpassingly harder to make a dual-format recorder/player.


I can get HD over-the-air, off cable, off satellite, and off the Net. I would like to archive some of it to high capacity DVDs. The tiebreaker for me will be which version offers writeable disks first, and how compatible they are with HTPCs.


Gary
 

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Quote:
Two-format playback machines are possible and will probably exist.
in the strictest sense of the word possible I think the answer is yes. But the three questions are


1) will there be a cost benefit

2) will it come soon

3) will we better off with one


my guess to all 3 is no. I think if it goes on long enough sooner or later they will show up, but I am hoping for a short battle
 

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In a format battle, the winner is bound to be the format with the greatest number of popular pre-recorded movies, the one format that sells the most disks. This in turn depends on the movie studios supporting the format, and how well they are doing with the everyday business of making good marketable films. Which is why I have pretty much steered free of the message threads comparing the technical aspects of the two formats. The technical details matter a whole lot less than the films being distributed.


Gary
 

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well the studios are Sony, Disney, Fox, LG against TW, Paramount, Universal.


I agree content counts, but it is a cycle. content goes to players on the market, people go to content on the market.


right now it is around 50% VS 45% in BR's favour on content. I think when the PS3 comes out it will give BR at least a 10:1 advantage in players and that should b enough to get some of the HD-DVD studios to at least run some pilot runs in BR with popular titles


PS as for recorders, BR is speced at 25 SL and 50 DL for r and re, while HD-DVD is 15 r and 20 re.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by eweiss
Of course. But probably a remote possibility, I suspect, unless one uses a PC as one's DVD player and puts a HD-DVD drive in one slot, and a Blu-Ray drive in another slot - unless/until an enterprising PC parts manufacturer creates a dual drive. Just my guess. Maybe the technology allows both kinds of lasers in a single drive. Will they use same-size/shape disc/cartridge, however?
Thanks for the replies, and sorry for ditching my earlier question re dual-format players. But it occured to me that perhaps that was the whole point of trying to reach a compromise... because the two formats might be technologically incompatible. Sounds like it would be difficult/impractical though IAC.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary McCoy
The technical details matter a whole lot less than the films being distributed.
This is not necessarily the case. Consider the DVD vs. DIVX war. I was the form factor that decided the winner, not the content.


Similarly, the hd/br war could be decided on the yet undefined manner in which the two sides implement the copy protection schemes.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by crussader
This is not necessarily the case. Consider the DVD vs. DIVX war. I was the form factor that decided the winner, not the content.
Not necessarily. Virtually all DIVX DVDs were 4x3 formatted, very few widescreen versions to be found. While this wasn't the nail in DIVX's coffin, it didn't help matters either.


DIVX: Good riddance!
 

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Quote:
This is not necessarily the case. Consider the DVD vs. DIVX war. I was the form factor that decided the winner, not the content.
Form factor? That's a new one on me. Could it be that it had something to do with having to buy it and then have 2 days (or something stupid like that) to watch it once you started and also do something and pay more to get a permanent, watch it anytime, "upgrade" . Not to mention the logistic/management nightmare of all that plus the eco-impact of yet more plastic waste (if you didn't buy the "upgrade") on top of what is already there. I didn't dream up this abomination, did I? :)


Yep, form factor killed it.


larry
 

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The end times are upon us! Repent now.


It's going to be kind of a wierd format war, because only bleeding edge geeks are likely to buy for the first generation in any numbers, with a smattering of the next wavers maybe getting in after a while. I just don't see any big consumer movement happening that would force either hand in the short term, do you guys?
 

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I hope they both take a bath early on. Both sides need to concede and possibly work on some 'third' format which will benefit everyone, industry and consumer alike. DVD has had a few challengers in the past several years that didn't even make a blip on the radar, such as DIVX and disposable DVDs. As things stand they're encouraging both formats to appeal only to high end users, which in the end isn't nearly the kind of profit making venture they're looking for. All most people want from their discs is to watch movies and be entertained for a reasonable price. Two formats, high priced players and media isn't a means to that end.


The longer this goes on the harder it's going to be to displace standard DVD.......unless their line of thinking is to quietly wait and watch HDTV prices to continue dropping which makes their product more viable and reasonable to the average consumer.
 

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We are planning on finishing out a dedicated HT in a new house that we are building. Even though we will have a wonderful place to show off a HiDef version of DVDs, I seriously doubt that we will be purchasing either format. To me, it is ridiculous to spend thousands of dollars on one format or the other (or both), only to find out in a year or two that it was wasted money as one format goes the way of the Betamax. I just refuse to do that. I agree with Nightmaster on this point ... one of the formats needs to bow out, or both need to work on a third format. However, it looks like that isn't going to happen. That is so unfortunate for the consumer.


Once things start to settle out, then we'll jump in, but not before.
 

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Quote:
It's going to be kind of a wierd format war, because only bleeding edge geeks are likely to buy for the first generation in any numbers, with a smattering of the next wavers maybe getting in after a while. I just don't see any big consumer movement happening that would force either hand in the short term, do you guys?
isn't that always the case? DVD took over a year for 1M players who do you think was buying it at the time?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PooperScooper
Form factor? That's a new one on me. Could it be that it had something to do with having to buy it and then have 2 days (or something stupid like that) to watch it once you started and also do something and pay more to get a permanent, watch it anytime, "upgrade" .
Just to clarify, that's what I meant by "form factor". The new copy protection schemes could be just as big of a pain or worse.
 
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