[TomHuffman]

I just had a chance to spend several hours with a Samsung PN58B650 2009 plasma and I was very impressed. It is significantly improved over last year's model in terms of black level, which was my only real complaint about the 2008 panels.


For the full review with charts, numbers, and comparisons, see

http://www.displaycalibrationonline....lasma_2009.asp

 

[rahzel]

Thanks for the review.


Seems like a lot of pro calibrators are loving the B650 (or 2009 Samsung PDP's in general) but Panasonic seems to get the most love around here. I was leaning towards the G10 but now I'm still undecided.


Can you comment on TIR? My brother just bought a 50B450 and I noticed some TIR, although it hasn't been broken in yet. I plan on going back and tweaking his set after it's been broken in.


Also, do you think this set could comfortably reach ~50-60ftL in Movie mode? I prefer a brighter picture than most.

 

[Warrior668]

Thank you!

 

[mcjasonb]

this reviewer seems to like the new Samsungs.

 

[rodeoclown]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman /forum/post/16904037


I just had a chance to spend several hours with a Samsung PN58B650 2009 plasma and I was very impressed. It is significantly improved over last year's model in terms of black level, which was my only real complaint about the 2008 panels.


For the full review with charts, numbers, and comparisons, see

http://www.displaycalibrationonline....lasma_2009.asp

I assume you didn't get a buzzer?

 

[TomHuffman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel /forum/post/16904119


Can you comment on TIR? My brother just bought a 50B450 and I noticed some TIR, although it hasn't been broken in yet. I plan on going back and tweaking his set after it's been broken in.


Also, do you think this set could comfortably reach ~50-60ftL in Movie mode? I prefer a brighter picture than most.

Image retention seemed about the same as the Panasonics, more than the Pioneers. No, 35-40fL is the most you'll get from Movie mode, at least with the 58". I assume that the 50" would be a little brighter.

 

[TomHuffman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by rodeoclown /forum/post/16905635


I assume you didn't get a buzzer?

For those over 40 (like me) this buzzing you guys talk about, even if present, is completely inaudible. The owner was older than me so he didn't hear anything either.

 

[rahzel]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman /forum/post/16911473


Image retention seemed about the same as the Panasonics, more than the Pioneers. No, 35-40fL is the most you'll get from Movie mode, at least with the 58". I assume that the 50" would be a little brighter.

Thanks.


I noticed in your review that you had the Cell light at 8, if you raised it to 10, wouldn't that raise it a good 15-20ftL? I know that with LCDs, the backlight is safe to adjust as it doesn't affect with calibration that much. Or is 35-40ftL with the cell light at 10?

 

[omeletpants]

The reviewer echos what I have said about the Panasonic G series being a step backwards. Of course, when i say that everyone whines.


This review is a good indication that Samsung plasmas have surpassed panasonic and rival the Kuro.

 

[Aleman]

Can you post your custom CMS settings? Your results look good but you never mentioned what settings you used.


Also, what's the difference between tweaking colors in the CMS menu and tweaking colors in the white balance menu? Both seem to have RGB adjustments, and I read one review where they only made changes in the white balance menu.


I'm also confused about HDMI black level, especially when paired with my Xbox 360. The Xbox can be set to Normal and Expanded. If I set the Xbox to expanded, should the TV's HDMI black level be at Low or Normal?


I have a PN50B650 and am loving it.

 

[rahzel]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleman /forum/post/16911577


Can you post your custom CMS settings? Your results look good but you never mentioned what settings you used.


Also, what's the difference between tweaking colors in the CMS menu and tweaking colors in the white balance menu? Both seem to have RGB adjustments, and I read one review where they only made changes in the white balance menu.


I'm also confused about HDMI black level, especially when paired with my Xbox 360. The Xbox can be set to Normal and Expanded. If I set the Xbox to expanded, should the TV's HDMI black level be at Low or Normal?


I have a PN50B650 and am loving it.

Even though plugging in settings is not the best idea, he IS a pro calibrator after all... they never reveal their numbers.


As for CMS vs white balance, CMS is strictly for color (primary and secodaries) and white balance is for grayscale.


As for your 360, I don't own one, but it seems like Normal is 16-235 and expanded is 0-255 -- so if you set it to Normal, set your TV to Low (16-235) to match or Normal if you set your 360 to Expanded (0-255) to match.

 

[mjrgamer]

Samsung sure does have some nice color that just bursts out of the screen. If they get there black level to Kuro standards they would be tough to beat.

 

[TomHuffman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel /forum/post/16911528


I noticed in your review that you had the Cell light at 8, if you raised it to 10, wouldn't that raise it a good 15-20ftL?

No. With Cell Light at 10 and Contrast at 100, the peak output is only a little higher. You are never going to get more than 40fL out this 58" inch panel in Movie mode. To get higher light output (don't really know why you'd want it, but that's another story), you have to sacrifice color accuracy.

 

[kanpol]

Mr. Huffman I have a question for you, I currently have the 42b450 and my question is in all samsungs 2008 A series plasma the cell light was supposed to be left at 10(according to D- Nice I believe because of gamma curve.). Since in your settings you have it at 8, I take it that in this years B series models that it changed, if so is there a certain number it is supposed to be set at to mantain a proper gamma curve?

 

[TomHuffman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by kanpol /forum/post/16912231


Mr. Huffman I have a question for you, I currently have the 42b450 and my question is in all samsungs 2008 A series plasma the cell light was supposed to be left at 10(according to D- Nice I believe because of gamma curve.). Since in your settings you have it at 8, I take it that in this years B series models that it changed, if so is there a certain number it is supposed to be set at to mantain a proper gamma curve?

I looked at that. I experimented with several contrast/cell light combinations. Cell light is set to 7 by default. I didn't see any difference in the gamma curve, at least with cell light between 7 and 10.

 

[TomHuffman]

FYI: In its maximum output mode (Contrast 100, Cell Light 10) the 58B650 puts outs out 47fL in Movie mode. At the preferred setting (Contrast 95, Cell Light 8), it puts out 36fL.

 

[mcjasonb]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman /forum/post/16916896


FYI: In its maximum output mode (Contrast 100, Cell Light 10) the 58B650 puts outs out 47fL in Movie mode. At the preferred setting (Contrast 95, Cell Light 8), it puts out 36fL.

whats it do in movie mode with cell light at 8 and contrast at 78?


95 is to high for me. to me that's too bright. i have the 58B560, not the 650, so i suppose it could be a bit different.

 

[kanpol]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman /forum/post/16912866


I looked at that. I experimented with several contrast/cell light combinations. Cell light is set to 7 by default. I didn't see any difference in the gamma curve, at least with cell light between 7 and 10.

thanks for the response Tom

. I was wondering if you have had the chance to calibrate or look at the B450 model and if so does the cell light behave the same as the b650. Once again thanks for all the help

 

[DocuMaker]

Interesting that Mr. Huffman measured a 0.012 ftL for the B650, and in the HDTV shootout D-Nice measured a 0.0229 (if I recall correctly) on the B860. Chad B. measured around right in-between at 0.0169 on a B550 (once again if I recall correctly). That is quite a disparity in range from 0.012 to almost double that at 0.023.


It's too bad that Mr. Huffman in his review made disparaging remarks about the new Panasonics before even having had hands-on experience with one. He comes across as negatively biased toward Panasonic, one would assume, because of the lack of picture controls.


Calibrators seem favorably disposed toward Samsung because they offer a plethora of picture controls (including CMS) in the user menu.

 

[omeletpants]



Quote:
Originally Posted by DocuMaker /forum/post/16917080


Interesting that Mr. Huffman measured a 0.012 ftL for the B650, and in the HDTV shootout D-Nice measured a 0.0229 (if I recall correctly) on the B860. Chad B. measured around right in-between at 0.0169 on a B550 (once again if I recall correctly). That is quite a disparity in range from 0.012 to almost double that at 0.023.


It's too bad that Mr. Huffman in his review made disparaging remarks about the new Panasonics before even having had hands-on experience with one. He comes across as negatively biased toward Panasonic, one would assume, because of the lack of picture controls.


Calibrators seem favorably disposed toward Samsung because they offer a plethora of picture controls (including CMS) in the user menu.

They may also be predisposed to Samsung because they yield better color and less artifacts?