AVS Forum banner

1 - 20 of 225 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,843 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is there a master

List of the upcoming 2.0 amps? I am in the market (need to uograde my non hdmi sony from 20

Years ago with DTS optical
but wanted a 2.0 for when / if I go 4k (once nvidia has a single card solution for 4k 60hz)


Most OnkYo and Yamaha etc still seems like 1.4!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,834 Posts
I haven't heard anything about 2014 receivers. Normally by now we would have some press releases for the lower end models, but not this year. I wonder if the new receivers will be delayed because of not having enough time to get 2.0 ports working. Or the manufacturers could all be hurting financially and don't have the money to invest in new models.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,063 Posts
The new models usually come out in April or late March.


I was recently shopping for a new Sony 60" TV and the stores were mostly out of the model I wanted; ended up ordering it from Amazon.


On the other hand, there may be some good deals on the remaining current models.


The new Sony STR-DA2800ES is 4K and it has 10 HDMI inputs and 3 HDMI outputs. Amazon is selling it for around $1000.


That might be what you want.


4K content may be a long time coming, although Sony is committed to it. They have a couple of TVs out and a (very expensive) media player for it.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,395 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjchmura  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24441469


Is there a master

List of the upcoming 2.0 amps? I am in the market (need to uograde my non hdmi sony from 20 Years ago with DTS optical
but wanted a 2.0 for when / if I go 4k (once nvidia has a single card solution for 4k 60hz) Most OnkYo and Yamaha etc still seems like 1.4!!!
2014 Yamaha low-priced AVR already listed on the Yamaha USA website:
New Product Bulletins for some other 2014 Yamaha low|mid-priced AVRs seen on the net:

_
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
14,420 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24442278

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjchmura  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24441469


Is there a master

List of the upcoming 2.0 amps? I am in the market (need to uograde my non hdmi sony from 20 Years ago with DTS optical
but wanted a 2.0 for when / if I go 4k (once nvidia has a single card solution for 4k 60hz) Most OnkYo and Yamaha etc still seems like 1.4!!!
2014 Yamaha low-priced AVR already listed on the Yamaha USA website:
New Product Bulletins for some other 2014 Yamaha low|mid-priced AVRs seen on the net:

_

One of the ironies is that the low end AVR has been migrated from the chip-based power amplifiers in the RX-V371 and RX-V373 to an all discrete design in the RX-V377


The Sanken chip amp based RX-V371 measures like this:









While the RXV-475 with the discrete part amps that Yamaha uses further up the line measures like this:







I wouldn't expect an audible difference but even the measurable difference looks moot. However "Discrete Amp Configuration for High Sound Quality" sounds so cool and convincing in the sales blurb.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
72 Posts
I have been researching this today and can't find much. My understanding is that you need to have the new HDMI 2.0 chips to process the HDMI 2.0 signal. Many receivers already list 4k pass through. It seems like that should be enough pass the uncompressed video signal to your display, provided your source and display are HDMI 2.0 capable. But what about audio? Are the new chips going to be required to process audio or is the format backward compatible?


From what I read, all HDMI 2.0 capable devices are not created equal. Some of them will only have 10.2Gbps of bandwidth and won't be compatible with 4k 60Hz. Manufacturers are supposed to detail as much in their specification. To complicate matters further, the new HDBaseT 2.0 standard has the same issue. Here is a quick article about it. It looks like active cables are the only way to go for now.


I am looking at JVC 4k projectors that say they have 4k 60 Hz capable HDMI inputs, but make no mention of HDMI 2.0. Will they be compatible when HDMI 2.0 sources arrive? HDMI 1.4 is only good to 30Hz, so what sources are they getting 60Hz over HDMI?


This 4K transition is really confusing. I am doing a media room and have the plans ready to go, but waiting on electronics. So I am going to go through all this research and expense to get the first HDMI 2.0 products available that are bound to have issues and then have about five Sony produced movies and hopefully some TV content to watch in UHD the next couple years. At the same time I with the money I am spending, I don't want to need an upgrade in two years. Tough call.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,843 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
As much as I have read, to get for high end gaming 4k @60hz you NEED HDMI2 .... if not only only gets 24FPS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
681 Posts
We are still about a week away from announcing our new line-up, however I can say that not all HDMI 2.0 receivers will be the same.. There will be differences in throughput and color capabilities.


Chris Walker

Pioneer Electronics
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,352 Posts
I would like to see Marantz bring back their SR8xxx series. THX Ultra2, 11 channel capability, and a Massive Amp section that would top the Denon 4520.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,560 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by fulminis  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24443666


I have been researching this today and can't find much. My understanding is that you need to have the new HDMI 2.0 chips to process the HDMI 2.0 signal. Many receivers already list 4k pass through. It seems like that should be enough pass the uncompressed video signal to your display, provided your source and display are HDMI 2.0 capable. But what about audio? Are the new chips going to be required to process audio or is the format backward compatible?


From what I read, all HDMI 2.0 capable devices are not created equal. Some of them will only have 10.2Gbps of bandwidth and won't be compatible with 4k 60Hz. Manufacturers are supposed to detail as much in their specification. To complicate matters further, the new HDBaseT 2.0 standard has the same issue. Here is a quick article about it. It looks like active cables are the only way to go for now.


I am looking at JVC 4k projectors that say they have 4k 60 Hz capable HDMI inputs, but make no mention of HDMI 2.0. Will they be compatible when HDMI 2.0 sources arrive? HDMI 1.4 is only good to 30Hz, so what sources are they getting 60Hz over HDMI?


This 4K transition is really confusing. I am doing a media room and have the plans ready to go, but waiting on electronics. So I am going to go through all this research and expense to get the first HDMI 2.0 products available that are bound to have issues and then have about five Sony produced movies and hopefully some TV content to watch in UHD the next couple years. At the same time I with the money I am spending, I don't want to need an upgrade in two years. Tough call.

The current JVC projectors are not real 4K projectors - just so you know. They just take two 1080p frames putting them together - kind of like an upscale. Sony is the only FP manufacturer of true 4K, but not sure of the HDMI limitations it may have either.


The bottom line is, no one at this time knows how any of this is going to play out especially with HDCP.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,166 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjchmura  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24443830


As much as I have read, to get for high end gaming 4k @60hz you NEED HDMI2 .... if not only only gets 24FPS

Well, without HDMI 2.0, you are limited to 4k @ 30 fps actually. HDMI 2.0 gets you the 60 fps you need.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
72 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24444892


We are still about a week away from announcing our new line-up, however I can say that not all HDMI 2.0 receivers will be the same.. There will be differences in throughput and color capabilities.


Chris Walker

Pioneer Electronics

Chris, good to know that something will be announced soon. It gives me some confidence that something will be available by the time I finish construction. It makes sense that the lesser models would have a bandwidth restriction. Do you know if the higher end models will be able to independently auto calibrate dual subwoofers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24445332


The current JVC projectors are not real 4K projectors - just so you know. They just take two 1080p frames putting them together - kind of like an upscale. Sony is the only FP manufacturer of true 4K, but not sure of the HDMI limitations it may have either.


The bottom line is, no one at this time knows how any of this is going to play out especially with HDCP.

So the JVC's are 1080p native and 'wobble' the image at 120Hz to create 3840x2160 at 60Hz. I didn't realize that. I wonder if DLP will be able to use the same approach? 3D resolution is limited to 1080p since it requires 120Hz. Still, it is better than not having 4k ability at all and the Sony's look like they are well above my budget. It seems like a bandaid that will get me four years instead of two before upgrading.


And thanks for bringing up HDCP 2.2 that is included in the HDMI 2.0 standard. I think that answers the question about the JVC's and other products that have 4k HDMI inputs and their compatibility with HDMI 2.0. It won't work since they won't have the ability to handshake with the new copy protection. Awesome.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,395 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by KidHorn  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24446921

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24442278

2014 Yamaha low-priced AVR already listed on the Yamaha USA website:
New Product Bulletins for some other 2014 Yamaha low|mid-priced AVRs seen on the net:

Unless I'm missing something. I don't see any mention of HDMI 2.0 ports.

From the HDMI.org FAQs (link) :
Quote:
Q. What are the HDMI-related questions consumers should ask when shopping for a new CE or PC device?


Several questions are key to evaluating HDMI on a CE component.


Think features rather than HDMI version number.


HDMI is constantly evolving to meet the needs of the marketplace. The standard is constantly adding more and more features that manufacturers can implement if they desire. But HDMI does not require manufacturers to implement everything that HDMI can do. HDMI provides a menu of capabilities and allows the manufacturer to choose which of those features make sense for its product line.


As a result, HDMI strongly recommends that consumers look for products with the features they want, rather than the version number of the HDMI components. Version numbers reflect capabilities, but do not correspond to product features. For example, if you want the new video features called Deep Color, look for Deep Color in the feature set rather than HDMI 1.3, the version of the specification that enabled Deep Color. Why? Because the version of the specification that enables Deep Color (1.3) does not mandate that Deep Color functionality be implemented.

I had thought CEMs and stores were not even allowed to describe an AVR as "HDMI 2.0 compliant" . . . ?!


_
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,781 Posts

Quote:
Well, without HDMI 2.0, you are limited to 4k @ 30 fps actually. HDMI 2.0 gets you the 60 fps you need.

Most likely ( since they don't exist yet - nobody knows ) any 4K Blu Ray player will have 2 HDMI outs anyway - one to your 4K display, one to your receiver. So it won't necessarily matter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,560 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by fulminis  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24446425


Chris, good to know that something will be announced soon. It gives me some confidence that something will be available by the time I finish construction. It makes sense that the lesser models would have a bandwidth restriction. Do you know if the higher end models will be able to independently auto calibrate dual subwoofers?

So the JVC's are 1080p native and 'wobble' the image at 120Hz to create 3840x2160 at 60Hz. I didn't realize that. I wonder if DLP will be able to use the same approach? 3D resolution is limited to 1080p since it requires 120Hz. Still, it is better than not having 4k ability at all and the Sony's look like they are well above my budget. It seems like a bandaid that will get me four years instead of two before upgrading.


And thanks for bringing up HDCP 2.2 that is included in the HDMI 2.0 standard. I think that answers the question about the JVC's and other products that have 4k HDMI inputs and their compatibility with HDMI 2.0. It won't work since they won't have the ability to handshake with the new copy protection. Awesome.

JVC uses something called eshift to accomplish that. Some people don't care for it as it does create artifacts and they just use 1080p although eshift does give a tighter pixel structure which can benefit those who sit very close to the screen. I have the JVC RS4810, but haven't got my room set-up yet to experiment with the feature. JVC will likely announce a 'real' 4K projector at Cedia.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,834 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24447058

Quote:
Q. What are the HDMI-related questions consumers should ask when shopping for a new CE or PC device?


Several questions are key to evaluating HDMI on a CE component.


Think features rather than HDMI version number.


HDMI is constantly evolving to meet the needs of the marketplace. The standard is constantly adding more and more features that manufacturers can implement if they desire. But HDMI does not require manufacturers to implement everything that HDMI can do. HDMI provides a menu of capabilities and allows the manufacturer to choose which of those features make sense for its product line.


As a result, HDMI strongly recommends that consumers look for products with the features they want, rather than the version number of the HDMI components. Version numbers reflect capabilities, but do not correspond to product features. For example, if you want the new video features called Deep Color, look for Deep Color in the feature set rather than HDMI 1.3, the version of the specification that enabled Deep Color. Why? Because the version of the specification that enables Deep Color (1.3) does not mandate that Deep Color functionality be implemented.

I had thought CEMs and stores were not even allowed to describe an AVR as "HDMI 2.0 compliant" . . . ?!

That won't be confusing to consumers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
681 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by fulminis  /t/1521079/2014-hdmi-2-0-receiver-list#post_24446425


Chris, good to know that something will be announced soon. It gives me some confidence that something will be available by the time I finish construction. It makes sense that the lesser models would have a bandwidth restriction. Do you know if the higher end models will be able to independently auto calibrate dual subwoofers?

So the JVC's are 1080p native and 'wobble' the image at 120Hz to create 3840x2160 at 60Hz. I didn't realize that. I wonder if DLP will be able to use the same approach? 3D resolution is limited to 1080p since it requires 120Hz. Still, it is better than not having 4k ability at all and the Sony's look like they are well above my budget. It seems like a bandaid that will get me four years instead of two before upgrading.


And thanks for bringing up HDCP 2.2 that is included in the HDMI 2.0 standard. I think that answers the question about the JVC's and other products that have 4k HDMI inputs and their compatibility with HDMI 2.0. It won't work since they won't have the ability to handshake with the new copy protection. Awesome.

Unfortunately I cannot comment on higher end models at this point, however I can say that after years of pushing Japan for some much needed features they have agreed for this years upcoming line-up.....


You will see some of it next week.


Thanks,


Chris Walker

Pioneer Electronics
 
1 - 20 of 225 Posts
Top