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One year and a half with lg c8 65 and I have never noticed this dimming? Is it so noticeable or you have to try to see it?


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I've had mine since they first came out and haven't noticed it either. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist, but for me, if I don't see it, it's a non-issue. I'm not one to go looking for perfection so unless an issue is noticeable on various source material, I don't go looking for it.
 

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The hilarious thing is that if LG had put the firmware up on the website, with a changelog that contained other stuff, I would probably not have gone rooting around in the SM so much looking for what had changed. So wouldn't have posted the picture and asked, and perhaps jk82 wouldn't have found the answer so quickly. So it's LG's fault that "we found out". LOL.
 

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It wouldn't even have crossed my mind to look through the service menu for new options hadn't mrtickleuk pointed it out. :)

For the next update please add an option for old/new dithering algorithm to the service menu. :p
 

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It was added to the C9 in a firmware update some time ago apparently - but none of that lot noticed or worked it out :ROFLMAO:
 

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Do you guys know if disabling that setting also disables logo luminance adjustment? Thanks
I would assume not, but easy to test by doing it and then switching the LLA setting on and watching what happens. :)
 

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I've had mine since they first came out and haven't noticed it either. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist, but for me, if I don't see it, it's a non-issue. I'm not one to go looking for perfection so unless an issue is noticeable on various source material, I don't go looking for it.
I noticed it mostly watching local news or ESPN SportsCenter or a sporting event. Glad most people don't even notice it but it's like seeing some older relative naked, once you see it, it can't be unseen!
 

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I noticed it mostly watching local news or ESPN SportsCenter or a sporting event. Glad most people don't even notice it but it's like seeing some older relative naked, once you see it, it can't be unseen!
I don't see it on local news or sporting events but then again, that doesn't mean it's not there. Just not visible to us. I like your analogy. Disturbing but accurate.
 

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Yeah, I don't think logo luminance adjustment works when you turn GSR off. I got word from a reputable source that it turns off all forms of dimming. Which is too bad, because I would love it even more if it logo luminance still functioned. Maybe we need more testing. Can you guys see if it's working on your sets for me. Cheers.
 

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The logo luminance feature absolutely does still work with GSR disabled.

If you put a white square on top of a non-static movie scene and then enable the logo luminance feature it will immediately darken the white square. Measuring this, depending on how much movement there is around the static element (more movement = more logo dimming) the static white square would dim down from 130 to ~95 nits. That is with GSR off.

Where the logo luminance feature doesn't and never has worked is in pc-mode or with the game preset.
 

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I'm I the same boat here. I had to raise my brightness to 54 to see the two above black vertical bars, but that causes the black "background" on the pattern to be well above black.

Even at a brightness of 50 a completely black scene (like a fade to black) will be above black. If the movie has an aspect ratio wider than 16:9 the black bars will be completely black, but the stuff between the bars will be above black. So either I have raised blacks or I crush them according to the pluge pattern.

I need to throw up a HDR10 pattern but so far I haven't seen the raised blacks like I do with Dolby Vision.

Not sure if there is a solution, but I am very much a novice when it comes to self-calibrating. I'll play with the basic settings like brightness and contrast but that's it for now.

I did install 5.20.02 when prompted a few days ago.

I tested Dolby Vision with the black pulge test pattern. In a pitch black room I could barely see the two vertical bars on the right when I set the brightness to 52.
On default brightness (50) I only saw one bar on the right.

When brightness set at 52, there are raised blacks (which I think defeats the purpose of OLED and Dolby Vision in general) and even then it doesn't look like I think it should.

I guess my excitement regarding a black crush fix was based on placebo. Also, the room wasn't pitch black.
I know that Dolby Vision can be darker than HDR, but I can't imagine this superior HDR format should be hiding so much detail compared to HDR10. In basically every source I tested, HDR10 has way more detail in shadows, clothing etc. Therefore HDR10 looks way more natural.

Luckily I can watch Dolby Vision UHD discs in the HDR10 core with my UHD player.
 

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On the CX the GSR feature turns on every time I turn on my TV (unless I set QuickStart+ to on) . Which means it resets to ON on power cycle or full reboots. Does it happen on your C8 too?
 

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Good news that there's finally a new regular firmware in the 5.20.xx range. My C8 is still stuck on the 5.20.03 engineering release, but I gather that when there's another new firmware, I can finally upgrade to a normal release.
That GSR option is very interesting though. I've just disabled it on my C9 and there's no more dimming in SDR and using PC mode. I always thought TPC disabled would fix it, but it was still dimming regularly. It did so not only on the desktop, but also playing games (especially racing games where a part of the screen is mostly static).
 

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I'm I the same boat here. I had to raise my brightness to 54 to see the two above black vertical bars, but that causes the black "background" on the pattern to be well above black.
Dolby Vision tends to be different and 50 is the only correct value to use. If you are calibrating you can change the near-black handling, but otherwise you cannot. Either way, Brightness=50 is essential for correct tonemapping near black.

Even at a brightness of 50 a completely black scene (like a fade to black) will be above black. If the movie has an aspect ratio wider than 16:9 the black bars will be completely black, but the stuff between the bars will be above black. So either I have raised blacks or I crush them according to the pluge pattern.
Aha. Good! From what you say here, the black bars being black proves that the black level is correct. There is no technical fault happening here when you have Brightness=50 (the correct value).

What you are seeing in the middle of the screen is very simple, and constantly overlooked. it is the Creator's Intent: just like the colour of space in Star Wars is grey not black, the creator has chosen to create it with lifted blacks. You are free to reject that and try to force everything that you wanted to look black to be darker, but that's the Wild West and you will spend your life chasing your tail adjusting your TV for every different thing you watch.

I need to throw up a HDR10 pattern but so far I haven't seen the raised blacks like I do with Dolby Vision.
But you've said above that you are not seeing raised blacks :).

The only practical solution to the problem of "can't see all the near-black detail unless I raised Brightness > 50" (crushed blacks) is a calibration. But, brightness really does need to be 50 and no other value for Dolby Vision's PQ tracking to be correct. You can't fix crushed blacks by eye by raising Brightness, nor can you fix "raised blacks" by eye by lowering Brightness for that matter, without wrecking the correct PQ tracking all thought the luminance range.
 

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Got the Update Yesterday, went into SM today and disabled GSR and watched a soccer Match on Television and i can confirm:
The autodimming Problem when watching Sports is gone.
Never tought the difference would be so huge.
It was really the only Thing that bothered me on my C8.
That is awesome that they fixed your problem......

@Cleveland Plasma yep I really like The Orville. There will be a huuuuuuuge vacuum of missing programmes next year (and beyond), when all the series that would have been made this year just won't exist to be shown.
Ya, this covid is messing thing up.......
 

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Maybe someone can help with this. I have two questions. I can be a little OCD when it comes to a correct picture and being able to see the details like intended.

I recently watched Harry Potter 6 on bluray, so in SDR. This movie is a little crushed out of the box, due to the visual style. But I really had the idea my tv/setting were crushing detail also.
I confirmed this with the black clipping pattern (pattern 1) from AVSHD 709. I had my brightness set on 51, because above this true black is lost on my panel.

Now then, while "calibrating" with the black clipping pattern I ended with brightness setting 56. But when I used the APL clipping pattern (pattern 2) I ended with brightness 60. I checked some content (including Harry Potter 6) and it looked more natural. This movie was indeed still somewhat crushed, but not by the tv. True black is lost of course, at this setting. But with some mild ambient light behind the tv, the "not true blackness" of the letterbox bars are not that anoyying.

I strictly followed the pattern manual from AVSHD. It says this:

"For some circumstances the black-level setting from Black Clipping agrees with the APL Clipping test, and in other situations the first twopatterns return different settings. Any agreement typically depends on items like display performance, room lighting, and viewing location. Ifyou find the first and second patterns clearly require different black-level settings with your room and digital display, an acceptable compromise can be to use the setting you receive from this APL clipping pattern. You can disregard the setting from the black clipping pattern if it does not agree with the APL Clipping test."

My first question: Is this still valid? The manual is from 2011. Because when I watch the black clipping pattern with brightness 60, some bars below 16 are also flashing.
@mrtickleuk I read some posts from you regarding the black clipping pattern. Maybe you can help me?

But, brightness really does need to be 50 and no other value for Dolby Vision's PQ tracking to be correct.
My second question: I was checking the HDR10 black clipping pattern from Mehanik. At default brightness value 50 I could not see the last bar, from the couch. With brightness on 51 I did. Is brightness at 50 the only correct value for HDR10, just as for Dolby Vision?

Thanks in advance! :)
 

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Quite a lot there @mhulsie :) The short answer, for SDR brightness, if you can see anything at all below 17, brightness is too high. 17 is very very very dark indeed, and should be almost entirely invisible, except if it's the only thing on the screen (ie not on that pattern). On those patterns the brighter bars flashing at the same time make your pupils dilate too much to properly see the 17 bar at its correct luminance, so you end up overcooking it.

So my advice would be to concentrate on seeing only 18+ from that pattern. Other people may disagree of course :) . That manual was written before OLEDs existed so it's not always going to be correct for us.

For your HDR10 question I don't think it's quite as critical as for DV (different if you do a calibration) but you're doing well to see anything below code 80 on those patterns because many panels have slight "black crush". Near-black is very difficult on OLEDs, a pixel can be fully black (easy) or brighter, "but only just turned on" is where OLEDs struggle.
Just checked and I do have B=51 on my TV in "HDR Cinema Home" mode (the brighter one for Daytime) but B=50 in "HDR Cinema" which I'm more likely too watch in a dark room for planned viewing. B=50 for all DV modes though.

You hit the nail on the head with
I had my brightness set on 51, because above this true black is lost on my panel.
Very often you have to compromise between
1. Correct black level.
2. Seeing all shadow detail which you are supposed to see
3. Not seeing shadow detail which you are not supposed to see (ie <16 content).

Imagine someone tells you to pick ONE! ;)

You probably can't hit both (1) and (2) without a calibration. Sometimes not even with a calibration. But almost certainly not without calibrating, because they are both controlled by the same single adjustment - Brightness. So you have to compromise between (1) and (2), like you already did :) . HTH
 

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Quite a lot there @mhulsie :) The short answer, for SDR brightness, if you can see anything at all below 17, brightness is too high. 17 is very very very dark indeed, and should be almost entirely invisible, except if it's the only thing on the screen (ie not on that pattern). On those patterns the brighter bars flashing at the same time make your pupils dilate too much to properly see the 17 bar at its correct luminance, so you end up overcooking it.

So my advice would be to concentrate on seeing only 18+ from that pattern. Other people may disagree of course :) . That manual was written before OLEDs existed so it's not always going to be correct for us.

For your HDR10 question I don't think it's quite as critical as for DV (different if you do a calibration) but you're doing well to see anything below code 80 on those patterns because many panels have slight "black crush". Near-black is very difficult on OLEDs, a pixel can be fully black (easy) or brighter, "but only just turned on" is where OLEDs struggle.
Just checked and I do have B=51 on my TV in "HDR Cinema Home" mode (the brighter one for Daytime) but B=50 in "HDR Cinema" which I'm more likely too watch in a dark room for planned viewing. B=50 for all DV modes though.

You hit the nail on the head with


Very often you have to compromise between
1. Correct black level.
2. Seeing all shadow detail which you are supposed to see
3. Not seeing shadow detail which you are not supposed to see (ie <16 content).

Imagine someone tells you to pick ONE! ;)

You probably can't hit both (1) and (2) without a calibration. Sometimes not even with a calibration. But almost certainly not without calibrating, because they are both controlled by the same single adjustment - Brightness. So you have to compromise between (1) and (2), like you already did :) . HTH
Thank you very, very much! I will check my SDR pattern again later this night. Just out of curiosity, do you experience the black crush problem in DV?
 

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Thank you very, very much! I will check my SDR pattern again later this night. Just out of curiosity, do you experience the black crush problem in DV?
You're welcome! There are several different problems with Dolby Vision all being mashed into the same thing when people ask about them. My panel has slight black crush in all modes but I've recently done a full factory reset and haven't calibrated it again yet.
 
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