I don't think its fair to say there is a consensus.Is .15 US version the same in Canada?
When I got my tv I updated immediately so I have no idea what was the PQ with the .15.
The consensus now is to rollback to .15?
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I've looked through a few times and can only bits and piece some settings. Do you have exact link to the Full SDR/HDR settings recommended?Just adding to the discussion. I have a 77C8 and upgraded to the .31 firmware earlier this week. I applied the 20-point white balance and color adjustments that were recommended earlier in this thread and I think the image quality looks pretty great. I don't see any downsides compared to the .15 firmware. I've viewed SDR, HDR, and Dolby Vision content, streaming and blu-ray. So just wanted to add that the .31 firmware doesn't seem to be as terrible as it has sounded sometimes in here and, in fact, I haven't seen any downsides to the .31 firmware so far unless you had a pro calibration done before and you don't want to update it (I didn't have one done previously).
How about we call this 'Automatic News Station Dimming' (ANSD) and be done with it .
So is ANSD new for the C8?
Did the strength/agressiveness of ANSD change wth the new FW?
To check whether the C9 also has ANSD, is the test just to watch Fox News for ~10 minutes? Is there any OLED Light setting that makes ANSD most evident?
I've used the cotton microfiber cloth as well as the thin eye glasses cloth and have had no issues for all the oleds I've owned
Thanks for the effort - this is a fantastic characterization of the ANSD (Automatic News Station Dimming) feature and behavior.I ran a small test to see how ANSD (Automatic News Station Dimming) behaves and how much it dims the picture.
The setup is simple and consists of just playing a movie and putting a small static white pattern in front of it while measuring the luminance over time.
ASBL and the logo luminance setting were disabled.
Picture of the setup:
I tested this with a 50%, 60% and 100% white. Oled-Light 36 and 100.
Here the results:
100% white, Oled-Light 36 (nits after xx seconds):
0 seconds 115
60 seconds 115
90 seconds 115
120 seconds 114
150 seconds 88
180 seconds 70
210 seconds 57
240 seconds 56
270 seconds 56
300 seconds 55
60% white, Oled-Light 36 (nits after xx seconds):
0 seconds 33
60 seconds 33
90 seconds 33
120 seconds 32
150 seconds 24
180 seconds 21
210 seconds 17
240 seconds 16
270 seconds 16
300 seconds 16
50% white, Oled-Light 36 (nits after xx seconds):
- No dimming at all after 5 minutes
60% white, Oled-Light 100 (nits after xx seconds):
0 seconds 73
60 seconds 73
90 seconds 73
120 seconds 72
150 seconds 55
180 seconds 45
210 seconds 37
240 seconds 35
270 seconds 35
300 seconds 35
50% white oled-light 100 (nits after xx seconds):
- No dimming at all after 5 minutes
There seems to be a threshold that determines if it will start dimming or not (50% white -> no dimming, 60%-100% white -> full dimming). The dimming starts after the static logo has been present for exactly 120 seconds and finishes dimming to ~48% of the original brightness after 240 seconds. Oled-Light doesn't seem to affect this, it's either full dimming or no dimming at all.
Removing the static logo will cause the brightness to gradually ramp up to the original value within like 30 seconds or so.
This is different from ASBL which almost instantly returns to the original brightness.
I also tested this last year but back then I didn't have a real meter and just used some smartphone lightmeter app but the result's were very similar so I don't think LG has changed anything regarding this recently.
It's all between pages 481 and 485 depending on how your browser loads the pages. You want three recommendations:I've looked through a few times and can only bits and piece some settings. Do you have exact link to the Full SDR/HDR settings recommended?
Ok, think I found them. For SDR it is just the 20 point that is avail correct? Nothing for 2 point or CMS right?It's all between pages 481 and 485 depending on how your browser loads the pages. You want three recommendations:
1 each from @chronitis and @jk82 for SDR
and 1 more from @chronitis for HDR
I found that for SDR on my 77" combining @chronitis settings with @jk82 settings creates the best PQ and @chronitis settings alone on my 65" work best.
Also, for SDR is that Gamma at 2.2 or BT?
Thanks for the effort - this is a fantastic characterization of the ANSD (Automatic News Station Dimming) feature and behavior.
Just to recap and clarify:
1/ There is no way to disable ANSD, right?
2/ This ANSD feature was introduced since the beginning in C8 and did not change with new FW, correct?
3/ This ANSD feature did not exist on C7 and C6 WOLEDs (confirmed by Ken Ross)
4/ ANSD is intended to dim news station to ~half brightness but will impact any content with a 1% static area of over 50% IRE.
It is ridiculous that ANSD cannot be controlled or disabled (has anyone performed exhaustive search through the Service Menu?) but it is even more reficuloud that it dims to half brightness even if you are watching at low peak levels of ~120cd/m2 (OLED Light 36).
Somone needs to find some Bluray content that triggers ANSD so that it can be slipped into the 2019 VE Shootout or passed on to Vincent Teoh. Having this new ANSD feature impact LG's dhootout results on actual content is probably going to be the only way to get them to change it.
But to be fair, this is the first I believe we,ve heard about an entirely new automatic dimming feature being introduced on the C8 and I suspect that there probably is a way to disable it through the Service Menu. It's not something we know about yet, so any SM control will be hidden somewhere under some obscure name and rhe only way to find it will be through exhaustive search of all submenus...
My screen still has these streaks on it from the packing material that is directly in contact with the screen. I have been afraid to try and remove it and I can't see it unless the TV is off and I get real close. Musty be some kind of residue fro the foam sheet that is stuck the screen as a protector. I've thought about just using a microfiber cloth but I think it may need a liquid of some sort to really get it off. Too afraid to remove any coatings.For gentle, weekly dusting I just use a Swifter Sweeper Un-scented refill. Takes the dust off with very litttle pressure and leaves zero residue behind. I only use a good quality microfiber cloth when I need to clean my panel with warm, distilled water, which I rarely have to do. Just soak a good eye glass cleaner microfiber cloth in warm distilled water, rinse it out good and gently wipe your panel, and then carefully dry with another microfiber cloth.
I assume the 'dimming' setting can be turned back on after being turned off, right? Woukd you be willing to give it a quick try to see whether that setting does, in fact, disable ANSD? At least then we'd know what we're dealing with and don't have to search elsewhere (and it's pssible the locking of OLED Light to 100 is a bug).1) There is this setting called "dimming" in the service menu which might or might not disable ANSD but this will lock your oled-light to 100 so I have no interest in even trying.
Clear - thanks. Doesn't really matter if it was there from the beginning or not. The more relevant point is that it was not introduced with this later FW (nor did it apparently change).2) I'm not sure if it was there from the beginning, I'm mostly a movie watcher so I wouldn't have noticed but it was there for sure late last year when I also tested this.
Ken confirmed he has no similar ANSD on his C7. Could you both check your C/B6 and C7 Service Menus to check wherher they also contained a similar 'Dimming' setting?3) It didn't exist on my C6. Not sure about 2017s but I haven't read anything about a similar dimming algorithm on 2017s.
Yeah, that would be great but probably more work than is warranted before we know whether ANSD can impact any actual content or not...4) I don't really know. To really determine that would require addidional testing. Like is there a threshold of screen percentage that needs to be static for it to trigger or not? Also using colors instead of white could lead to different results.
I thought your 'test' was using an actual movie. You overlayed a static white rectangle onto a movie, right? The key is to find some content that has scenes including bright static areas exceeding 2 minutes. Perhaps the movie 'Network'? I have no idea how common scenes exceeding 2 minutes occur on cineme and series content. If pretty much never, I agree with you, it's not a big deal. But if 2+ minute scenes in actial content without panning happens frequently, this could be a bigger deal...I think this dimming algorithm is somewhat similar to the one on Sony A1E and A8F discussed here (not sure if the A9F also has it):
Personally I don't really care about it as long as it doesn't ever trigger during movies. (ASBL does trigger during movies but that fortunatlely can be disabled)