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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My old 16:9 Proscan died this weekend. I'm looking into maybe picking up a plasma. But after much reading on this forum trying to get up to date, I have a couple of questions.


1. I've read that plasmas are succeptable to uneven phospher wear. How do they compare to a direct view crt in this regard? I owned the 16:9 Proscan for 8 years and it never showed any uneven wear or burn in even though probably 90% of viewing was in 4:3 mode. Also, I use an HTPC for a music server and have winamp running for hours at a time on this display while listening to music. I've read you should'nt leave a static image up for long periods. Will this cause problems?


2. I will be running a Radeon based HTPC for DVD playback as well as Dscaler for all DirecTv viewing and was wondering what resolution you use. I know the Radeon can do 848 X 480 and 856 X 480, but neither of these is exactly the same the 852 X 480 of most of the plasmas I've looked at. Is the 848 or 856 scaled to 852 or can you get 1:1 pixel mapping.
 

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Hey Greg,


It's sort of like the early CRTs that had burn-in. It doesn't matter too much if you keep the contrast at a rational level and don't watch too much non-moving images (e.g., static computer screen, black bars, etc.). If you keep these rules of thumb, you're ok. If not, plasma is not for you.


There's a british company making "Pixel perfect" boards (I forget their names now, but look for them) that supposedly matches the native rate exactly.


Alot of people do 856 and then 3 pixels get trimmed off or simply rescale it (there wouldn't be much artifacting going on with 3 pixels worth of difference). In cases where you have DVI, usually the DVI native rate forces you to go 848 (i.e., you lose 5 pixel lines).
 

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Screen burn is caused by the phosphors in certain parts of the screen burning more or less than other parts of the screen. The way I had it described to me was like uneven tread wear on tires.


IIRC, the shorter life of the blue phosphors is what causes the burn in (they have a different half-life than the other phosphors).


What all that means, however, is that screen burn can be caused by PC usage, television viewing or anything else that ignites the phosphors on the screen unevenly for a long period of time. One habit I'm going to have to break myself of is pausing the TiVo for long (3+ minutes) periods of time. I believe screen burn is seen more often on monitors primarily used for PCs simply because PCs display static images much more frequently than traditional television viewing does.


If I've butchered any of that, I'm sure someone else will correct me. :)


--kurt
 

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Businesses that use plasmas such as Hospitals and Airlines, usually run them 24/7 and it is a very simple, occasionally changing, but basically static image. (arrival and departure times etc...) SO burn in is defintley an issue. I know that NEC's have the white noise funciton (which most plasmas do, I believe) and also can do a "reverse burn". Doing both of these a few times a week will prolong the life for that type of usage. I knew someone who played x-box on their Fuji 4241 for about 3-4 hours straight, and noticed faint burn ins of the score, life bar and so on. He ran the white noise for awhile and it corrected itself. I don't think there should be a problem playing games on any of the new plasmas, just be careful with your time of play. And to quote Mark Norton from the thread posted by divvy


"Feed your plasma a varied diet of material and it will be fine"


I believe that is one of the wisest one-liners I have read on this board :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks for the answers everybody. I was trying to decide between the 42" Panny plasma and the RCA F38310. Yesterday I got to compare the 2 side by side with HDTV and DVD. I was quite impressed with the plasma and very unimpressed by the RCA and several other 16:9 CRT's. I guess at over 2X the price, it should look better but conventional wisdom was telling me otherwise. Everyone has been telling me that the CRT would kill the plasma and that 852 X 480 isn't enough resolution, just SD afterall. I knew the resolution wouldn't be a problem because I was running my Panny HDTV box at 480P my old Proscan and it looked great. Actually much better than the RCA, Toshiba, or Sampo running at 1080i. I just don't think the quality of the consumer 16:9 crt's out there are very good. Needless to say, I am picking up the Panny plasma.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
BTW, I bought the 42" Panny from 1800plasmas.com . I called with a couple of questions and the were quite friendly and helpfull. I'll post a follow up on how the rest of the transaction goes.
 

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I've also recently purchased the 42" panny from 1800plasmas.com. So far, 95% of the transaction has been error-free, though I may have hit one glitch today -- we'll see. At this point, I'm a happy 1800plasmas.com customer.


Still haven't taken delivery of the set -- that should be Saturday. I'll post a follow-up then if people are interested. (in the mean time, email or PM me if you'd like more information.)


--kurt
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Just a quick follow up on my purchase from 1800plasmas.com. I purchased the unit late Monday night and I received it today, Thur at 2:30 PM. Three days is pretty good in my book, especially since I didn't rush it. I would highly recommend 1800plasmas.com.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Mad Chemist
Also, I use an HTPC for a music server and have winamp running for hours at a time on this display while listening to music. I've read you should'nt leave a static image up for long periods. Will this cause problems?

Absolutely.


Xtrahot
no one to beat around the bush with this
 

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While it's true that having the static plain ole Winamp interface on the plasma for hours at a time would cause burn-in, there should be a way to get one or more of the popular visualizations (I like Geiss personally; you can do a search at winamp.com to find it and install) to output at the correct resolution for your plasma. Not only would this eliminate burn-in (as a good screensaver would) but, if in the right resolution, it should look really stellar on the plasma. :)


-Aaron
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I guess I will use a visualization. I really like KataFX. I already have my remote setup for it.


OAT, I am blown away at how good 852 X 480 can look. This plasma looks so damn good, I'm going to have a hard time firing up my PJ to watch movies. The black level, contrast and color saturation are just plain incredible. I'm kinda glad my old tv died...at least until I get the CC bill :(
 

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klieber,


I didn't know the blue phosphors were more susceptable to burn-in. AFAIK all the phosphors are basically very similar, except that they REFLECT different shaded lights, so blue shouldn't be much different than the other colors.


Actually, there's a nastier side to burn-in (I'm a bit hesitant whether to mention it, since it could be misunderstood). My old Fujitsu (high usage, varied content) developed a problem before I sold it, that *could* be viewed as burn-in. I'm not quite sure if it is burn in. Basically, in the center of the screen, certain shades would be slightly off. A shaded sky covering the screen would be a slightly different shade towards the center (where most screen activity took place, I suppose).


It really didn't bother many people (myself excluded). I guess it's like the more usage the plasma got, the less shades of blue (It happened particularly in the blue area) it could produce towards the center region. It could be a form of burn-in, but I can't be quite sure.


It certainly never bothered my wife, nor the person I sold it to (a friend).


BTW, just got an offer for a Panny that's even lower than the price (in $) I paid for my NEC... I'm starting to be sorry I got the NEC... I guess there's always next year.
 

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Ofer,


I am experiencing something that sounds similar to what you have described.


Aside from the letter-box-shaped burn in on my new Panny 42" (which still won't budge by the way, despite many hours of screen saving scroll bars/white screens/16:9 material), I also notice a discoloration taking up the center of my screen. I'd describe it as a very large yellowish blotch. It also seems resistant to any sort of screen-cleaning (scroll bars).


I can't say I've spotted it when playing DVD material on the Panny, but it is definitely there when I put on the white (negative) screen saver.


Does this sound at all like what you are talking about?


Rich H.
 

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It has been previously discussed here before (including you Ofer) that the blues are more suscepible. But what Rich is now saying - blows me away.


When the blue wears you are left with a yellowish tint. But the whole design behind the Panny was to use different widths of red, green, and blue. The blue is much wider, this is suppose to allow for the human eyes weakness to this color to be brought out without having to overdrive it. PDP's with equal sized RGB, have to push the blue harder. (Thereby wearing them out earlier).


It keeps sounding like there are more hours on yours (Rich), than you know. If anyone knows how to access the internal clock, I would look at that.


PS. I've never found it?
 

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Brucer,


I've been in contact with service guy at my local Panasonic service division.

He'd recommended the scroll bars for about half a day for the original burn-in problem. When I mentioned the yellowish discoloration he said to bring the screen into them so they can get to the bottom of what's going on.

He said he was going to check how many hours the screen had on it.


We'll see what happens.


Rich.
 

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BTW,


When I was talking to an ISF guy who sold and calibrated plasmas he said

in his experience there was a significant variation in the quality/production

of plasmas. I.e. a variation in the quality and calibration needs within any particular model of plasma.


Maybe I just got a "manufactured-on-a-monday" quality plasma (?).


Rich.
 

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Rich,


I really don't think you did. It sounds to me like someone burnt a hole on that plasma by using it too much with a specific shape.


What you're saying is similar to what I was experiencing (mine was definitely a brand new plasma!). I didn't see that blotch at the beginning, but it developed over time. The "blotch" didn't effect most things at first, but around the time I sold it, I could basically spot it on most DVDs and TV material.


I think you might have gotten a returned unit, or even a demo unit.


I don't remember specifically discussing the blue issue (could be my memory slipping, though...).
 

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Judging from my recent experience, I would have to agree with oferlaor.


Other clues to look for are the build date on the back (our was April 2002, we received it just before Memorial Day weekend) and, this may sound stupid, but did the unit have that "new car smell'? Ours literally and unmistakenly reaked of a newly-built electronic component.


I say this because our 4UY plasma is flawless, no burn-in nor a dead pixel in sight. And from the condition in which we got it (bag tucked under, etc. as mentioned in other posts), it matches other people's positive experiences with theirs.


The only difference is that our box had to be opened so that they could accomodate the mount inside. That way only one box needed shipping. This was disclosed to us by the dealer (WildWestElectronics.com BTW) well in advance, however, so really a non-issue.


Good luck. Let us know how it turns out.
 

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phern,


Out of curiosity, have you taken a good look at your Panny with an entirely white screen? I did this by using going to the screen saver function on the Panny and choosing the "negative" screen function.


The burned-in letterbox shape I see on my screen is distinct. However, the blob of yellowish coloration in the center of the screen is quite subtle (although there for sure). If some of the plasma owners on this board took a look at a completely white screen on their panels, what they might find. Would they look perfectly evenly illuminated? Or might there be some slightly uneven illumination/color balance visible, like on mine?


phern, would it be too much trouble to ask you to look at yours, using the white screen "negative" function on the Panny?


Much obliged,


Rich H.
 
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