AVS Forum banner

21 - 40 of 64 Posts

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #21
Success...with an exception.

Try as mightily as I could, I could not complete the Set Up on the XBoxOne. "Mucro"Soft's Site was crashed, down, stinkin' lousy. :mad: So no DVD-BluRay Firmware would load.

But, I did manage to get WiFi up and could watch Movie Previews. Here is a collection of quick and dirty Galaxy 7 Cell Phone images of Suicide Squad.
















Way off Axis....








 

Attachments

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #23
Well...137" diagonal is all he's gonna get !

..........and to get him that much I had to do some innovative Projector mounting.

I cannot recall ever having seen anyone on the Forum ever having done a "through a slope w/Pipe only" mount before. Cramming my 247 pounds into the eave of the Attic framing (...and on my stomach...) to accomplish it was neither pleasant nor easy. :(

But as seen below....I got'ter dun.



The bottom two images show the 137" diagonal picture.

The one on the Left is in a darkened room...the one on the right is under Flash.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
881 Posts
Looks like your about knock this one out. Everything looks good.

My brother in law had to mount his panny on a sloped ceiling as well. His ceiling was not sloped at quite as steep of a pitch as your install's ceiling however. He did have to drop his panny down for clearance but I believe he was able to use a traditional mount with an extension.

Using only in-wall transducers instead of traditional speakers really opens up the possibilities for maximizing screen size in smaller rooms.
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #26 (Edited)
Here are the best excuses I can muster.....

Was the screen wall unfinished on the back side? I missed the installation of the transducers.
Unfinished? I only wish that was the case. :eek:

No, the entire rear of the Screen Wall is a Hallway and Entry into a 2 upstairs Bedrooms. A couple 5-6 things have conspired to have that part put off until tomorrow

1. The Owner had Family in over the Holiday, and both Bedrooms enter / exit through that Hall. It was deemed best to wait for that reason alone.

2. The Owner kept me hoppin' doing changes to the PJ positional layout, as well as installing a 110 Floor Outlet in front of the Bar (...for Chairs)

3. Dropping the Wiring down into the Hallway wall was more of a Challenge than expected. The Ceiling of the Theater Room is raised 16" higher than the adjoining Hallway, and the Attic above both is decked. Lots of Floor Cutting and Wire fishing turned what was supposed to be a "quick & easy"into a 2 day affair Monday & Tuesday

4.Yesterday, my Wifey had a 90 minute Outpatient Gall Bladder removal scheduled for 6 AM. And of course, they didn't take her into surgery until 5 PM, so my day was effectively shot to pieces.

5. And then there is Me. Today I had to undergo a Heart Stress Test and Nuclear Study...also very early, and afterwards I kinda fell out on my Couch...with the understanding and forbearance of the Owner, who it seems would prefer I live long enough to get'ter all dun.

6. And lastly, since Wednesday I have had to deal with both batteries in both my 2 Electronic Key Fobs for my work vehicle going bad, and they are not user replaceable. No Batteries...no Start-ee.:mad:

But...onward and forward. Tomorrow will see the Front 3 Channels installed, and hopefully at least the first Tape / Mud application over the holes.

To any extent, the construction & cosmetics inside the Room itself were by far the most important, and that part is nailed down. I am on track to have the room fully operational by tomorrow evening...along with a complete pictorial update.

..........no stress here. :cool:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,705 Posts
Just have the Dr. come tomorrow and monitor you through the transducer install, that should be stress test enough. Hope everything goes as expected for you and I hope your wife recovers fast. I had my gallbladder out a few years ago and I haven't looked back. I was fortunate to recover very quickly from surgery.

Looking forward to seeing more progress pictures.

Regards,

RTROSE
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
881 Posts
Your run of bad luck reminds me of the song they used to sing on Hee-Haw. "If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all...."

I hope your heart tests come back with good results.

Hang in there.

-Ken
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #30 (Edited)
Well..............................I got quite a bit done yesterday, despite a late start, and leaving for 1.5 hours to take my Wife some Lunch. (...don't ever go to Chic-Filet if your in a hurry... :rolleyes:)

After having managed to interconnect my 6 Trunk Lines ( 3- 4 Cond / 1- 2 Cond Center / 2- 2 Cond Center Rears) with their respective Quick Connect Wiring Harnesses, I installed the 2 Atmos Channels (1- 8 Ohm Transducers ea.) and both Rear Surrounds ( 2 - 8 Ohm Transducers ea. ) and both Center Rear Surrounds (1- 8 Ohm Transducers ea. ) 8 Total

.........all of which are / were Ceiling Mounted, except the Center Rear Surrounds, which are mounted on the Attic accessible Rear Wall.

Then after returning from that looong lunch, I started cutting out my access holes for the Front Channels. Although I managed to knock out the installation of all 14 Front Transducers, ( 4 ea. R & L Channels - 6 @ Center) I only managed to take pictures of the Left Front Channel, as my Phone's battery went dead after a full day of use and picture taking.

I will take those today (I have not closed up the Holes yet) and add in the remaining images to this Post after my return today.

Meantime, I am posting some Composite images with Titular explanations, covering installation, and Series / Parallel Wiring. As well as the Finished Projector Re-Mount.





Wood Boards were used in all Attic locations to effect a more Bass oriented response.






The use of smaller Square Wood Boards lends itself to increasing Bass Reproduction by utilizing more of the unrestricted Drywall area between the Framing much like a more unrestricted diaphragm.









 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
Ready...set....:eek:

OK...an early morning start.

Here are the particular Plans, Goals, and forthcoming efforts.

  • Theater Room Area is 17' x 22' - w/Partition Wall
  • 4 Theater Seats / 4 Stool Bar
  • 143" 16:9 to 2.39:1 "Frame-less" Image on Painted Screen Wall
  • Very Dark Gray Carpet w/Light Gray threads
  • Dark Gray Ceiling and Trim
  • Light Gray Walls
Equipment:

  • Panasonic PT-AE8000u
  • Onkyo TX-NR1030 Dolby Atmos Receiver
  • 2 x Klispch K100sw Powered Sub Woofers
  • 22 Audio Transducer / 9 Channel Atmos system 7:2:2
  • Panasonic DMP-BTD360 Blu Ray Player
Some before images...I just removed the existing carpet and pad.





The Screen Wall



The Equipment Closet (left rear corner)




....and of course, I have 4 of these nasty little Cretins to remove and their unsightly holes to cover / patch.




The Bar gets built today, along with the Partition Wall.
(Someone else is building the Bar....)
Screen Painting happens on Monday, and the Ceiling / Walls / Trim gets painted out on Tuesday, Carpet on Wednesday....Theater Chairs deliver on Thursday.

1st Movie shows in Friday (23rd)

Folks..that is a complete room change-over into a Home Theater in 1 weeks time. Ambitious? You bet. Potentially fraught with "Murphy'itus" Maybe sew.....

But I've done it before, and Christmas Time is the time for miracles, so.....here we go!

(...oh yeah, almost forgot. That Ceiling Fan...she gotta go! )

Come back later for updates....and feel free to ask any questions.
Looking good and you're making quick progress! Looking forward to the finished results.
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #35
i totally goofed, how far from the screen wall?
Not really...it could have been read either way.

The final distance "Lens Face to Screen Wall" is 13'-5"

Zoom is / must be fully opened to achieve a 137" diagonal 16:9 image
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #36
There and back again....a Hobblers tale.

I have updated Post 30 with image collection of the Right & Center Transducer installation.

Chairs go in tomorrow, Granite Bar Top on Thursday...at which time the Theater will be complete.

Of coursed, over the next 2 days I have to rather large'ish holes to finish out...highly technical work for a A/V Design Installer, I know. :rolleyes:

But ya gotta know...if that'sa what it takes to make it all happen, it's a mud slingin' I will go!:cool:

Any questions about the installation...I'm ready to field them.
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #37
Turning Large Holes into No Holes.......

A/V Design / Installers seldom indulge themselves in the menial labor involved in refinishing Drywall. However most everything I have done over the last 38 years has been intrinsically linked to and dependent upon Drywall.

With Retrofitting in Transducers, for many years (25) I depended upon either hiring the "Best of the Best" to make my mayhem disappear, or hoped whomever got the task wouldn't' render my best efforts anything less than...well, invisible.

About 2003-2005, when I started using Drywall as Screen Substrate, I found that few Drywall Finishers were up to the task of creating blemish free surfaces.
Now over those 25 years, I watched my best Finishers whenever I could, and by doing so, picked up all the good tips and methods.

The 10 primary ones....


  1. DO NOT Rush !
  2. DO NOT use Quick Coat. Lightweight Compound is the best
  3. NEVER confuse Spackle with Drywall Compound
  4. Always apply a very light initial Mud coat over the Tape as a binder...not a cover.
  5. Consider 2 Prep Coats and 1 Finish Coat the minimum needed
  6. Use Nylon / Fiberglas Mesh Tape
  7. Always cut Drywall with a sharp Drywall Knife, never a Saw.
  8. Use GOOD Tools. Quality work demands using good tools
  9. Always give Drywall Compound the time it takes to dry completely before sanding.
  10. Use Drywall Sanding Sponges for precise sanding.
So far, those 10 Golden Rules have allowed me to confidently make promises I know I can keep.

So onward now to the specific job at hand.






I did both the two Coats shown between 5:30 pm (1st Coat) and 9:30 pm (2nd Coat)

Installing the Deadwood Strips and the Drywall Inserts took me longest...between 12:30 pm and 5:00 pm

Why? The size of the Holes involved, and with some areas cut open so as to be lacking wood framing along the edges demanded the correct installation of good supportive Deadwood. Solidly "Glued and Screwed".
Whatever / However long it takes, doing it right assures one that the finishing will go.....smoothly.

I should be sleeping, but as always, I deem giving prompt, time oriented updates just as important as my Apnea encumbered down time. I will be back at the location at 9:30 am to sand the 2nd Coat and apply my Finish Coat.

.......and with that, save being back to oversee the installation of the Granite Bar Top, I'm done. :cool:

Oh yeah...while I was doing all the hard work today, the Owner and his Wife decided to bug off to the Hospital where she proceeded to give birth to a handsome, if not somewhat serious looking little Dude.



I think somebody ran off with his Bag of Doritos. :p
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
881 Posts
Thanks for all the VERY informative tips and for letting us follow along with your project.

I'm an "audio guy" so I keep coming back to the transducers...when installed in a hollow cavity like that, will there be a lot of sound transmitted into the hallway and rest of the house?

I see lots of Disney and Pixar movies in that theater's future. ;)
 

·
DIY Granddad (w/help)
Joined
·
23,471 Posts
Discussion Starter #39
Thanks for all the VERY informative tips and for letting us follow along with your project.

I'm an "audio guy" so I keep coming back to the transducers...when installed in a hollow cavity like that, will there be a lot of sound transmitted into the hallway and rest of the house?
Good point. I hate you....but good point. :D

As in any audio system where non-baffled "In-Wall" speakers are used, some due consideration must be given to sound transfer within a enclosed wall / ceiling cavity. The very nature of "Retro-Fitting" in a speaker means that more oft than not, the desired location will not / does not have neither insulation nor sound isolating materials.

In the case at hand, two nasty circumstances were apparent.

  • The Theater Room is built up 12" higher than the Flooring of the Second Story Hallway. During construction, the Framers did not bother to place a Bottom Wall Plate at the base of the common Wall (ie: Screen Wall) where the main Sound Stage would later be Installed. They only placed the 2x12s directly on top of the 1st Floor ceiling Framing. This left the non-insulated wall plenums open into the Ceiling cavities of the downstairs Family room.

  • As mentioned above, the desired room to use for a Home Theater was / is located directly above the Kitchen / Family Room...a worst case scenario is ever there can be one.
Under such circumstance as point 2, even with such a room being "under New Construction", very extreme measures would have to be taken to isolate the expected noise levels that would come from having a high volume / LFE room above the main part of the Home. Floor / Ceiling Decoupling...2-Layer Flooring...5/8" Drywall on the Ceiling below...Dual layered, decoupled Drywall on the adjoining Hallway, and of course, densely packed Cellulose Fiber Insulation in all the surrounding walls.

But of course, not a single one of the aforementioned items was either done ahead of time nor possible at this point in time, as the costs would be exorbitant, and practicality (...with a Baby due at any moment...) completely inappropriate.

So what to do? Well first off, letting the Owner know "BEFORE" accepting a deposit...,exactly what he should expect was of paramount importance. And I did...in no uncertain terms. But here's the thing;

He didn't give a sh _ t. :p You see, as has always been the case for many, many years, when someone actually gets a chance to hear an effective demonstration of (but not see) such "invisible" Theater systems, and they get so excited their eyes roll back in wonderment, many issues and concerns that could -86- such "conventional" plans flat out disappear. (ie: become invisible :D)

Such was the case here, especially since this individual came to me on Referral from another Owner, and he simply "Had to get him one o-dose!". And it had to be a
"better one"...of course! So......:eek:
(...the referring Owner had just a 10 Transducer - 5 Channel system w/Epson 8350 and a picayune 110" painted Wall screen...all Retrofitted, but it was located over his Garage...:))

Now one thing I did manage to do was to scavenge some R-19 Insulation Batts out of some Attic Walls and stuff the Wall Plenums directly under the Transducer arrays, just above the adjoining Ceiling cavities. That certainly helped somewhat. The Hallway area directly behind the Front Screen Wall leads into Guest Bedrooms, and the Stairway Tunnel is at least located back by the Garage Entry, far removed from the Family Room. I did suggest installing a Solid Wood Door at the Hallway Entrance. The Owner said; "Lets see how it goes first"

Now the Wife....when late in the evening 2 Days ago I first tested the system using the Mini-Gun & Helicopter Crash scene from the Matrix....and at a maxed out volume level...she called us up on his iPhone and said we were scaring the hell out of her! :eek: The next morning at 5 AM, the Baby decided it was time to get on out and join the party. I joked about that, and all the Owner said was if that was what made her deliver..."Good Job!":cool:

So in this case, yes...there is a lot of sound transfer happening, but predominantly due to it being a worst case situation.

However, to get back to the really pertinent answer to the question, when compared to any normal, suspended diaphragm, non-enclosed In-wall speaker, there is no overt increase in sound transmission...and actually a bit less considering that so much of the resonant energy is directed into and through the opposite wall.

All the aforementioned efforts to contain sound would be just a necessary if external or In-wall "directional" speakers of "Home Theater" ilk were used. But....none of them would be "invisible", and all require considerable in-room acoustic treatments to effectively deaden a room to prevent standing wave reverberation and / or cancellation. A HUGE advantage with using Audio Transducers is that very little if any such "deadening" effort is needed, because since the Room surfaces are producing the sound, they also effectively mask any standing waves. This is really a big thing, because it also helps to contain standing Bass waves much like a Bass Trap does.
(...these particular Audio Transducers are used extensively by both Industry and Military for sound deadening and security-oriented masking purposes...)

I see lots of Disney and Pixar movies in that theater's future. ;)
In the distant future.

BTW, a important thing to make mention of.

When I said I tested the system at maxed out level...I meant it. I had the Onkyo 3030 set at 86...4 points above THX Reference. That is when the Wifey called us. I then asked the Owner to set the Volume at a level he would listen to the same movie clip at, and when he went downstairs, he said it was not bad at all, nor was his Wife sweating nearly as much.
 
21 - 40 of 64 Posts
Top