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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone,


Sorry if this topic has been posted on before. I did a few searches with nothing answering my question so hopefully I didn't miss any info already posted.


But here it is:


What A/V receivers are out on the market capable of individually calibrating a video feed for each input you add? PopSci mentioned the Onkyo TX-NR906 (with ISF video calibration) in their best of 2008 Home Theater section which sparked my interest in the topic. Are there any others out there that do the same? I plan on running a PC, Xbox 360, PS3, and cable box through the receiver into a 1080p projector that only has 2 hdmi inputs.


Thank you for you help AVS community!
 

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The Denon 5308 is the only other receiver that I know of by any of the mass market companies (denon, onkyo, marantz, pioneer, etc) that has a Reon chip in it - I believe it's a Realta HQV which is a little higher end than the Reon chip in the Onkyos.


Someone else can chime in if I'm mistaken
 

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Pioneer has the four typical adjustments (color, tint, contrast and brightness). Separate memories for each input. I don't know about the entire line, but the 1018 and SC05 have them.
 

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RX-Z7 has per input adjustments for some aspects like brightness and color I believe.
 

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Gwags,


No receiver that I know of has "real" calibration capability. It is even tough to find in the expensive pre-pros. The ones mentioned have either basic or rudimentry calibration controls. I do think it would be a great feature now that HDMI audio prevents going direct to the display with each input.


I'd either get a display with multiple presets/ memories that you could calibrate and just choose the correct preset for the source you are viewing, or get a video processor! HDMI has really messed things up for displays that only allow calibration per input



Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobL /forum/post/15429831


I'd either get a display with multiple presets/ memories that you could calibrate and just choose the correct preset for the source you are viewing, or get a video processor! HDMI has really messed things up for displays that only allow calibration per input



Bob

This is my first jump into AV receivers since HDMI came out so excuse the newb question but what would a video processor get me that the ISF feature on the onkyo can't do and secondly how much does a "decent" VP cost?
 

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Better calibration controls for grayscale, gamma, color correction, processing, aspect ratio, etc. Costs for VPs range from $800 and UP! But, not all VP have a good range of controls, some provide only basic controls, switching and processing. I'd say> $2000 for a decent one with some controls.


Anyway, what display are you using? You might have presets or memories to do this already and then the receiver's VP isn't as important unless you think the display's internal VP is lacking. Also, anything more than basic controls and presets is useless if you do not have calibration equipment or have someone who does that can calibrate it.


Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobL /forum/post/15434805


Anyway, what display are you using? You might have presets or memories to do this already and then the receiver's VP isn't as important unless you think the display's internal VP is lacking. Also, anything more than basic controls and presets is useless if you do not have calibration equipment or have someone who does that can calibrate it.


Bob

I'm using a sanyo 1080p projector with plenty of modes (brilliant, cinema, game, etc.) but it only has 2 HDMI inputs and I'd like to connect 4 different sources. My PC, Xbox 360, and PS3/Blu ray all do the 1080p and then I'd upscale the HDTV comcast cable as well. Hence the need for something with at least 4 inputs that I could send into one HDMI connection on my projector & individually tinker with before it gets to the projector. I'm thinking cost vs capability wise, the onkyo at $1400 is a solid bet to get what I need while still making tremendous upgrades to my existing AV receiver. Thoughts or comments?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwags80 /forum/post/15439258


I'm using a sanyo 1080p projector with plenty of modes (brilliant, cinema, game, etc.) but it only has 2 HDMI inputs and I'd like to connect 4 different sources. My PC, Xbox 360, and PS3/Blu ray all do the 1080p and then I'd upscale the HDTV comcast cable as well. Hence the need for something with at least 4 inputs that I could send into one HDMI connection on my projector & individually tinker with before it gets to the projector. I'm thinking cost vs capability wise, the onkyo at $1400 is a solid bet to get what I need while still making tremendous upgrades to my existing AV receiver. Thoughts or comments?

If that's the case, you already have the controls you need with your Sanyo. Your sources already output 1080p, so you don't need any video processing for those. If Comcast is outputting HD video, you don't need any video processing other than what you've already got.


Why not get an AVR that does HDMI video passthrough, with no proccessng done in the AVR?
 

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For completeness, I thought I should fill in what type of adjustments that are available in the Onkyo TX-SR876/NR906.

For each individual Input Source:

Game Mode: On, Off

Zoom Mode: Normal, Full, Zoom, WideZoom (aspect ratio control)

ISF Mode: Night, Day or Custom which enables the below settings:

Resolution: Through, Auto, 480p/576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p

Brightness: -50 to +50

Contrast: -50 to +50

Hue: -20 to +20

Saturation: -50 to +50

Picture Mode: Auto, Video, Film

Edge Enhancement: Off, Low, Medium, High

Mosquito NR: Off, Low, Medium, High

Block NR: Off, On

Gamma: -3 to +3

Red Brightness: -50 to +50

Red Contrast: -50 to +50

Green Brightness: -50 to +50

Green Contrast: -50 to +50

Blue Brightness: -50 to +50

Blue Contrast: -50 to +50
(the above greyscale settings are sometimes called Bias/Cuts and Gain)


In addition to the above per input source settings, you can have additional settings for each output display and they are both in effect at the same time:

For each individual Output:

Resolution: Source, Through, Auto, 480p/576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p

Brightness: -50 to +50

Contrast: -50 to +50

Hue: -20 to +20

Saturation: -50 to +50

Red Brightness: -50 to +50

Red Contrast: -50 to +50

Green Brightness: -50 to +50

Green Contrast: -50 to +50

Blue Brightness: -50 to +50

Blue Contrast: -50 to +50


Normally you would probably calibrate each of your sources in individual inputs of your TV or projector

but since the receiver is now in the middle with just one HDMI (or two HDMI) going to your display,

you need to calibrate each input source individually in the receiver.

It does not have all functionality that you could want but the trick is to calibrate your display first,

hopefully it has better controls!, after your primary video source and then use the receiver to adjust the

other video sources.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by graphicguy /forum/post/15439341


If that's the case, you already have the controls you need with your Sanyo. Your sources already output 1080p, so you don't need any video processing for those. If Comcast is outputting HD video, you don't need any video processing other than what you've already got.


Why not get an AVR that does HDMI video passthrough, with no proccessng done in the AVR?

Well, I've heard not all HDMI outputs are created equal. Especially when it comes to xbox and PS3. Seeing how I also have a video card from my PC that is switching DVI->HDMI I figured a receiver that could make minimal adjustments would be a blessing to equalize the video sources into one HDMI input on the projector. Just trying to cover my bases and get the best video I can in the very real possibility that one source doesn't look as good as another source sharing the same input.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickardl /forum/post/15439450


For completeness, I thought I should fill in what type of adjustments that are available in the Onkyo TX-SR876/NR906.

For each individual Input Source:

Game Mode: On, Off

Zoom Mode: Normal, Full, Zoom, WideZoom (aspect ratio control)

ISF Mode: Night, Day or Custom which enables the below settings:

Resolution: Through, Auto, 480p/576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p

Brightness: -50 to +50

Contrast: -50 to +50

Hue: -20 to +20

Saturation: -50 to +50

Picture Mode: Auto, Video, Film

Edge Enhancement: Off, Low, Medium, High

Mosquito NR: Off, Low, Medium, High

Block NR: Off, On

Gamma: -3 to +3

Red Brightness: -50 to +50

Red Contrast: -50 to +50

Green Brightness: -50 to +50

Green Contrast: -50 to +50

Blue Brightness: -50 to +50

Blue Contrast: -50 to +50
(the above greyscale settings are sometimes called Bias/Cuts and Gain)


In addition to the above per input source settings, you can have additional settings for each output display and they are both in effect at the same time:

For each individual Output:

Resolution: Source, Through, Auto, 480p/576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p

Brightness: -50 to +50

Contrast: -50 to +50

Hue: -20 to +20

Saturation: -50 to +50

Red Brightness: -50 to +50

Red Contrast: -50 to +50

Green Brightness: -50 to +50

Green Contrast: -50 to +50

Blue Brightness: -50 to +50

Blue Contrast: -50 to +50


Normally you would probably calibrate each of your sources in individual inputs of your TV or projector

but since the receiver is now in the middle with just one HDMI (or two HDMI) going to your display,

you need to calibrate each input source individually in the receiver.

It does not have all functionality that you could want but the trick is to calibrate your display first,

hopefully it has better controls!, after your primary video source and then use the receiver to adjust the

other video sources.

Thank you for the great info! I think this is exactly what I needed to know. My main goal is to keep my sanyo calibrated perfectly and then be able to make small adjustments as neccessary on individual sources should the need arise. Since they will all be on one HDMI input on the projector I'm 99% sure the onkyo is what I need to be looking at. Thanks AVS community. As always you guys rock
 

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I believe your Sanyo has different user memories. You can calibrate to each source and store each source in a user memory. The Sanyo has a lot more adjustability then the Onkyo and it would make sense to use the Sanyo's controls. I'd look at a good universal remote that can switch to the appropriate user memory when a source is selected as wel as simplify your system.


I'm not sure what video processor the Sanyo uses but the only reason I can see for the Onkyo is if you are not happy with the scaling or deinterlacing of the Sanyo As the Onkyo's is pretty decent. I'm not against the Onkyo but I wouldn't use its rudimentry controls for calibrating if I had better options in my display. Some displays do not offer what Sanyo has and then the Onkyo would be a great choice!


In your situation I'd pick a receiver based on its audio feaures and sound quality as long as it has the necessary HDMI switching you require.


Bob
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwags80 /forum/post/15442836


Thank you for the great info! I think this is exactly what I needed to know. My main goal is to keep my sanyo calibrated perfectly and then be able to make small adjustments as neccessary on individual sources should the need arise. Since they will all be on one HDMI input on the projector I'm 99% sure the onkyo is what I need to be looking at. Thanks AVS community. As always you guys rock

Yes, that was the idea: to have your Sanyo's calibration as "reference",

possible using some Monitor Out adjustments in the receiver also,

and then hopefully only small adjustments from it will be needed

for other inputs which can be made in the Onkyo's per input adjustments.

Should be possible, just make sure your input sources are set to use the same

HDMI colourspace (HDMI Full RGB, Limited RGB or Component), otherwise you

will need to make bigger adjustments.


Please note that there is a bug in the Gamma setting. At the moment, it does

not keep the effect when switching inputs back and forth. The same problem

does exist in the 906 and the Integras, hopefully a firmware upgrade will fix it.
 

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I understand your idea of using the Onkyo but the Sanyo has a much more extensive gamma control where you can actually adjust the gamma curves (a very nice feature)and a basic color management system which The Onkyo doesn't. It makes sense to me as a calibrator to calibrate using the more extensive controls for each source.


The OP has sources that could be quite different especially with the HTPC as they can change by which mode you are using (Media Center Vs. regular PC functions not to mention video card issues). Dfferent color colorspace, gamma, grayscale, etc. make having the ability to hit a different memory on the remote very handy.


The only advantage I see to the Onkyo is the settings would be changed automatically when you select the input that's why I recommended a decent universal remote to help automate this function as well as the system.


I do think Onkyo has made a BIG step forward with these features compared to other manufacturers. I wish other companies would start incorporating similar features. I just don't think the OP should focus his receiver search on video capabilites, if he had a different display my recommendation might be different.


Bob
 

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Bob, I am not contradicting that in any way. I am only explaining what can

be done with the Onkyo and I wholeheartedly agree that if you have the need for more than

one input source that need more advanced calibration than is present in

Onkyo, you should bypass it.
 
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