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I am about to buy 50PF9731D (50" Plasma). Please tell me why I should NOT.


Mind you, I'm in Canada and there's nothing else within this price range and features. LG/Toshiba/Panasonic and Samsungs retail at a much higher price. Not that it really matters (I'd pay a bit more for quality product), but this particular baby has it all. I just wonder if it's too good to be true.


Thanks in advance.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by crimsontwo /forum/post/0


I am about to buy 50PF9731D (50" Plasma). Please tell me why I should NOT.


. Mind you, I'm in Canada and there's nothing else within this price range and features. LG/Toshiba/Panasonic and Samsungs retail at a much higher price. Not that it really matters (I'd pay a bit more for quality product), but this particular baby has it all. I just wonder if it's too good to be true.


Thanks in advance.

I have owned the 50PF9631D since last July and am still delighted with it.
 

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No. I work in the consumer electronics industry and I can tell you that Philips/Magnavox has one of the highest repair rates. Our service department said that Philips is one of the more problematic brands. Couple this with the fact that a feature filled set with only a modest picture does not make for a smart purchase. Ambilight is more of a gimmick than a useful feature. In fact, when used as intended, it masks the poor black levels of Philips plasmas and LCDs.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic /forum/post/0


No. I work in the consumer electronics industry and I can tell you that Philips/Magnavox has one of the highest repair rates. Our service department said that Philips is one of the more problematic brands. Couple this with the fact that a feature filled set with only a modest picture does not make for a smart purchase. Ambilight is more of a gimmick than a useful feature. In fact, when used as intended, it masks the poor black levels of Philips plasmas and LCDs.

I agree, my father purchased a Philips plasma after I told him not to two years ago. He had nothing but problems within a month. Parts took forever to come in & he sold it a little over a year ago & owns a NEC plasma now. Philips is known for it's high failure rate, so I would pass. Look @ Panasonic or Hitachi is my favorite myself. Good Luck!


Alex
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic /forum/post/0


No. I work in the consumer electronics industry and I can tell you that Philips/Magnavox has one of the highest repair rates.

Not with the latest models, the 9631 and 9731.


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Couple this with the fact that a feature filled set with only a modest picture does not make for a smart purchase.

Picture quality is outstanding, check the 9630 and 9631 User Threads if you don't believe it.

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Ambilight is more of a gimmick than a useful feature. In fact, when used as intended, it masks the poor black levels of Philips plasmas and LCDs.

Black levels were rated very good by all the professinoal reviewers, if not up to Panny and Pioneer levels. Ambilight is a killer app -- folks love it. It's not a gimmick, sounds like whining from someone who's upset the sets he likes don't have it.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic /forum/post/0


No. I work in the consumer electronics industry and I can tell you that Philips/Magnavox has one of the highest repair rates. Our service department said that Philips is one of the more problematic brands. Couple this with the fact that a feature filled set with only a modest picture does not make for a smart purchase. Ambilight is more of a gimmick than a useful feature. In fact, when used as intended, it masks the poor black levels of Philips plasmas and LCDs.

What he said! Too many problems, poor customer service.
 

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If you want a biased review listen to PhilipsPhanatic. The very user name blatantly tells that he is a fanboy. When the 9630/9631s came out, we had 5 of the six Philips/Maganavox models on display get sent out for service within a months time. Maybe this is coincidence, but more than likely (logically) it can be attributed to poor quality control. Not only have repair departments noticed these reliability issues but Consumer Reports has as well. I don't think the reviews Consumer Reports puts together on electronics are very helpful, but their reliability statistics are usually pretty comprehensive. In a 5 year study, Philips/Magnavox was one of the top three least reliable brands.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic /forum/post/0


If you want a biased review listen to PhilipsPhanatic. The very user name blatantly tells that he is a fanboy.

At least I'm honest, WS. And by the way, 'bias' doesn't imply NOT being objective. If you'd studied for your SAT Verbal, you'd know the difference between the two.


Quote:
When the 9630/9631s came out, we had 5 of the six Philips/Maganavox models on display get sent out for service within a months time. Maybe this is coincidence, but more than likely (logically) it can be attributed to poor quality control. Not only have repair departments noticed these reliability issues but Consumer Reports has as well. I don't think the reviews Consumer Reports puts together on electronics are very helpful, but their reliability statistics are usually pretty comprehensive. In a 5 year study, Philips/Magnavox was one of the top three least reliable brands.

I invite anybody here to go over the threads on AVS -- don't take my word for it, and don't take WSfanatic's, either. Go by the posts/threads. You'll find TONS of threads from owners of Panasonic, Pioneer, LG, Samsung, NEC, etc , where the TV died right after delivery or a few weeks/months thereafter.


Does that mean those sets suck? Of course not. What it means is that ALL sets have problems and if you are able to discern what causes those problem rates -- objectively -- you can give an OBJECTIVE and ACCURATE observation about what might account for the problems. And chief among them as I have determined since Philips quality control has improved are (1) refurbs (2) outlet store sales and (3) lower-tier knockoffs sold by large chains.....all of which I have counseled AGAINST buying.


Simply stating that Philips and Magnavox are lousy is a poor generalization (even though I agree that Magnavox is Philips 2nd-tier line and subject to more problems). Would we say that about Maxent and Vizio, two brands that most of us NEVER heard of before coming to AVS and which have given hundreds of AVS members great viewing hours ??????


I'll never say that Philips black levels are as good as Panasonic's or their overall PQ is as good as Pioneer or NEC's, because I don't believe it is so. But neither will I allow poor generalizations to masquerade as fact when in fact it's based on shoddy knowledge, poor sample bias, and lack of knowledge about product line quality control issues. As someone who follows this on a daily basis for a living, I have a pretty good idea what I am talking about.

To Sum Up: Philips Ambilight-equipped lines are very reliable, especially if bought from a retailer who doesn't recycle problem sets. Stay away from knock-offs made for Costco, etc. Unless you want to take a chance and save big $$$, avoid the outlet store and/or refurbs. For best blacks, goto Panasonic. For best overall PQ, goto Pioneer. For a great combination of PQ, features (PixelPlus, Ambilight, AUTOMATIC stretch, etc), and price....check out Philips.


And no, don't take my word for it (only). Read others opinions...check out the sets in someone's home....and talk to other owners.


That's a biased way of getting information, of course -- but it's also an ACCURATE way of getting information. And that's all that should matter.....right ????
 

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Interseting comments here ? - I don't know who is right or wrong but have a look at the J.D. Power Consumer electronics ratings for televisions in the $1000.00 to $2499.00 range and Philips is rated as better than average - in fact, better than Panasonic, JVC, Samsung, Sharp and Mitsubishi - This was from a 2004 survey and based on this there is some conficting results - this directly conflicts with "the 5 year study". ?

I really don't think that Philips got to be the 3rd largest electronics company in the world and the largest in Europe by selling poor quality products - Every manufacturer has some issues with some of their products - they all produce so many different models now and while some might be excelent others just don't make the grade - You always hear of the bad stuff never the good! Yes, you can review the AVS forum to try and get a feel for what others have experienced with their particular tv's but these are only extremely small sample opinions.




Wazy
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wazymk /forum/post/0


Interseting comments here ? - I don't know who is right or wrong but have a look at the J.D. Power Consumer electronics ratings for televisions in the $1000.00 to $2499.00 range and Philips is rated as better than average - in fact, better than Panasonic, JVC, Samsung, Sharp and Mitsubishi - This was from a 2004 survey and based on this there is some conficting results - this directly conflicts with "the 5 year study". ? I really don't think that Philips got to be the 3rd largest electronics company in the world and the largest in Europe by selling poor quality products - Every manufacturer has some issues with some of their products - they all produce so many different models now and while some might be excelent others just don't make the grade - You always hear of the bad stuff never the good! Yes, you can review the AVS forum to try and get a feel for what others have experienced with their particular tv's but these are only extremely small sample opinions. Wazy

Wazy, I don't care WHAT you buy -- just buy it for the RIGHT reasons.


Panasonic was my runner-up choice -- I have nothing bad to say about them, but I wanted Ambilight (I love it) and the AUTOMATIC feature is something my Panny friends always ***** that they wish they had. Do I wish my blacks were darker ? Yeah, but if that's my only gripe for the next 5 years with my set, I'll break out the champagne.


Pioneer? Same feelings, but even more expensive than Panny or Philips, so $$$ were a factor.


The best source of information here is the users of the sets. And if you read between the lines, you can discern that those who have problems often got them from the means of purchase I suggested one avoid. And yes, there are going to be problems with EVERY MANUFACTURER, Philips included, so you can't read 99 glowing reviews and then 1 pissed off person who got a lemon and say "well, I can't tell if it's a good set or not."


Occasional problems do not equal HABITUAL problems. Philips sets, as all plasmas, have had occasional problems. The error rate came down a ton with the 9630 and 9631 models. It seems to have continued and stabilized with the 9731 (from what I can tell).


I will continue to call it as I see it and speak glowingly of Philips sets that I feel good about, while also praising -- and NOT KNOCKING -- competitors like Panny and Pioneer, LG and Samsung.


Fair & Balanced, that's what I am.....
 

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To be precise, two Philips plasmas and a 23" LCD (23PF5320) had issues after being put up on display. The 42" was the 42PF9631D and 50" was a 50PF9630A. The 42" had a processing problem and the panel on the 50" mysteriously quit working. The rest of the TV worked, you could hear the sound from different channels and on different inputs but no picture. If I am correct, you claim:
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilipsPhanatic /forum/post/0


The error rate came down a ton with the 9630 and 9631 models. It seems to have continued and stabilized with the 9731 (from what I can tell).

In my experience, this is not the case. Another two tube televisions also had to be sent out for service, a 32" Magnavox and a 27" Philips. Both had terrible problems with the tubes, almost as if they were displaying a negative of the image.


I am aware that every brand has issues. My Samsung HL-N507W had to get a new color wheel. All I am saying is that in the 9, closing in on 10 this August, years that I have been in consumer electronics, there have been noticeably more problems with Philips/Magnavox sets than with any of the other big name manufacturers. It could be dumb luck that this has been my experience but I can tell you with absolute confidence that it was not because we were selling more Philips products. In fact, Sony, Panasonic, JVC, and more recently Samsung have been the better selling products.


Please do not consider this a bashing of Philips, this is just my experience with their televisions. I actually own other Philips products (a couple of Norelcos and a Sonicare, etc.). They have some interesting products coming soon to the market and my view of their reliability may very well change. Personally, I'm interested to see how well their wireless HDMI works.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsfanatic /forum/post/0


I am aware that every brand has issues. My Samsung HL-N507W had to get a new color wheel. All I am saying is that in the 9, closing in on 10 this August, years that I have been in consumer electronics, there have been noticeably more problems with Philips/Magnavox sets than with any of the other big name manufacturers. It could be dumb luck that this has been my experience but I can tell you with absolute confidence that it was not because we were selling more Philips products. In fact, Sony, Panasonic, JVC, and more recently Samsung have been the better selling products.

Philips is #3 globally and they do supply alot of lower-end models. Combine the two and you will have a higher fail rate.


Again...when they upscaled their plasma line beginning with the 9630, the problems dropped dramatically. I know because I had hesitated for years on the 7000 series. Outside of BSOD, the 9630 was nearly flawless when dealing with the buyers as a whole.

Quote:
Please do not consider this a bashing of Philips, this is just my experience with their televisions. I actually own other Philips products (a couple of Norelcos and a Sonicare, etc.). They have some interesting products coming soon to the market and my view of their reliability may very well change. Personally, I'm interested to see how well their wireless HDMI works.

I'm not saying you're bashing Philips, I just said you overgeneralized. I've had 1 Philips plasma and it has worked flawlessley for 9 months -- should I then tell people that in my experience Philips plasmas work 100% of the time perfectly? I think that would be as biased and flawed as someone criticizing or bashing Philips based on a small sample size.



And by the way, I could write the same glowing Philips reviews without identifiying that I own a Philips plasma...without a name like "PhilipsPhanatic".....I could write the same posts with the name "PanasonicOwner" or "PioneerFan." According to your logic, that would then make my Philips plugs 'very objective' since my name indicates a 'bias' for another manufacturer and therefore my plugging Philips must mean they are a good set.


I think you'd agree that is ridiculous.



What matters is the CONTENT and SUBSTANCE of the posts I give. I have always been 100% honest, 100% objective, and 100% fair-minded. I do have a bias towards Philips, but that bias does not preclude objectivity towards Philips (I wrote a 4-page critical letter to their Dutch corporate office) or other manufacturers. I'm interested in helping others get good plasma and HDTV sets, Philips or non-Philips. Others plug Panny, Pioneer, Samsung, LG, NEC, etc. Fine -- by default I seem to be the Philips Plugger.


I'll give my toot for Philips, others can give their toots for other brands, and we can let the inquiring mind at AVS decide what they want.



What could be more fair than that ???
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilipsPhanatic /forum/post/0


Philips is #3 globally and they do supply alot of lower-end models. Combine the two and you will have a higher fail rate.


Again...when they upscaled their plasma line beginning with the 9630, the problems dropped dramatically. I know because I had hesitated for years on the 7000 series. Outside of BSOD, the 9630 was nearly flawless when dealing with the buyers as a whole.




I'm not saying you're bashing Philips, I just said you overgeneralized. I've had 1 Philips plasma and it has worked flawlessley for 9 months -- should I then tell people that in my experience Philips plasmas work 100% of the time perfectly? I think that would be as biased and flawed as someone criticizing or bashing Philips based on a small sample size.



And by the way, I could write the same glowing Philips reviews without identifiying that I own a Philips plasma...without a name like "PhilipsPhanatic".....I could write the same posts with the name "PanasonicOwner" or "PioneerFan." According to your logic, that would then make my Philips plugs 'very objective' since my name indicates a 'bias' for another manufacturer and therefore my plugging Philips must mean they are a good set.


I think you'd agree that is ridiculous.



What matters is the CONTENT and SUBSTANCE of the posts I give. I have always been 100% honest, 100% objective, and 100% fair-minded. I do have a bias towards Philips, but that bias does not preclude objectivity towards Philips (I wrote a 4-page critical letter to their Dutch corporate office) or other manufacturers. I'm interested in helping others get good plasma and HDTV sets, Philips or non-Philips. Others plug Panny, Pioneer, Samsung, LG, NEC, etc. Fine -- by default I seem to be the Philips Plugger.


I'll give my toot for Philips, others can give their toots for other brands, and we can let the inquiring mind at AVS decide what they want.



What could be more fair than that ???

Is there a barf smilie?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma /forum/post/0


Philips makes a good product and very reliable. They are priced to move for sure.

Let's just hope that now that they have found some winning models, they don't decide to dump them or go exclusively on LCD. The decision to release a 63" without Ambilight still baffles me. I put in an e-mail to my corporate contacts overseas -- no response so far.
 
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