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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've only been lurking here for a short time, so I am probably going to ask some questions that have already been covered. Links to other threads are appreciated!


I am starting to plan for a remodel where I will run HD video and various audio to 5 rooms plus a dedicated theater. The basic goal is to keep all equipment in a closet, and have only displays and speakers in the rooms. I've come up with a starting plan, and it'd be great if some of the experts can poke holes in it:


Sources: ~6 sources, all component, probably mostly 1080p, some audio only: 2 HD tivos, 1-2 HD dvd players (or blue ray), cheap HTPC, radio tuner, perhaps another DVD changer that I have sitting around.


Switcher: I plan to feed the sources into a neothings borrego 8x8 component and digital audio switcher -- this presents a problem with audio for the bedrooms


Bedrooms:

3 of the outputs will feed component and 2 channel audio (and return IR) to cat5 baluns (using cat6), and head to 3 extra bedrooms -- probably ce labs cat5rx/tx for this. I will also send 2 other cat6's to each bedroom for ethernet and phone. PROBLEM: I need the borrega to switch digital audio, since 3 of the rooms are theaters, but I need 2 channel audio here. I'm not sure that I can find sources that will drive both 2 channel analog AND digital audio out at the same time. And I can't find a small converter to change what is probably AC-3 audio to 2 channel analog, without adding a whole receiver to the closet for each of the bedrooms. Any ideas?


Master Bedroom:

I will have a receiver in the closet for audio, and I will directly wire 5.1 sound, to in-wall/in-ceiling spkrs and a small plasma. I guess this will have to be a real component video run to the screen, plus 6 speaker cables (one for the line level sub), a dedicated IR return cable, and 2 cat6's for phone and ethernet


Family Room:

Similar to master bed except for 7.1


Theater:

Higher quality components in the closet, HDMI run to a ceiling mounted projector, and higher quality speaker wire to 7.2 or 7.3 locations


Caveats:

- The borrego only switches component video, so I will need another DVI/HDMI switcher to switch the input to the projector.

- I will have to make sure that all sources can output both component AND hdmi at the same time (ugly).

- I will also have to make sure that all TV's can display 1080p, since that's what I will be running on the projector, and I doubt I can get a set of all sources that can do different resolutions on HDMI and component outputs (also ugly).

- And of course there's the digital audio problem in the bedrooms


Anyone see any major holes in this? Should I run more wires, like perhaps inputs from the family room for a camcorder or an xbox or something (are the cat5 rx/tx uni-directional?) Is there anything cheaper than the borrega which will provide matrix component video switching? AVATrix doesn't work, since the audio for 3 rooms is in the closet. Anything else I am missing? Is it going to hurt not having a DVD player in each room?


Or course, I will also need some kind of programmable remote in each room, and some form of IR switching, but I haven't looked into that yet.


Sorry about the long post, and thanks for any help!

--Carey
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
no one has any comments?


btw, I think I found a solution to cheap AC-3 to stereo conversion. The creative labs "extigy" seems to work stand along to decode AC-3, and I'm hoping it then downmixes out of the headphone jack. And it's maybe $25 on ebay. So at least I can run AC-3 to everywhere without worrying about converting between AC-3 and 2 channel.


Of course, no DTS allowed, and HD-DVD Audio and HD-Audio are going to be useless.


Probably the HD-DVD will have to be one-per room, instead of one to serve the whole house. Whole house will be HD-tivo's and regular DVD's and maybe HTPC.


--Carey
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckloss /forum/post/0


no one has any comments?


btw, I think I found a solution to cheap AC-3 to stereo conversion. The creative labs "extigy" seems to work stand along to decode AC-3, and I'm hoping it then downmixes out of the headphone jack. And it's maybe $25 on ebay. So at least I can run AC-3 to everywhere without worrying about converting between AC-3 and 2 channel.


Of course, no DTS allowed, and HD-DVD Audio and HD-Audio are going to be useless.


Probably the HD-DVD will have to be one-per room, instead of one to serve the whole house. Whole house will be HD-tivo's and regular DVD's and maybe HTPC.


--Carey


First problem i see is that analog component (RGB) connections will not support 1080p.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckloss /forum/post/0


I've only been lurking here for a short time, so I am probably going to ask some questions that have already been covered. Links to other threads are appreciated!


I am starting to plan for a remodel where I will run HD video and various audio to 5 rooms plus a dedicated theater. The basic goal is to keep all equipment in a closet, and have only displays and speakers in the rooms. I've come up with a starting plan, and it'd be great if some of the experts can poke holes in it:


Sources: ~6 sources, all component, probably mostly 1080p, some audio only: 2 HD tivos, 1-2 HD dvd players (or blue ray), cheap HTPC, radio tuner, perhaps another DVD changer that I have sitting around.


Switcher: I plan to feed the sources into a neothings borrego 8x8 component and digital audio switcher -- this presents a problem with audio for the bedrooms


Bedrooms:

3 of the outputs will feed component and 2 channel audio (and return IR) to cat5 baluns (using cat6), and head to 3 extra bedrooms -- probably ce labs cat5rx/tx for this. I will also send 2 other cat6's to each bedroom for ethernet and phone. PROBLEM: I need the borrega to switch digital audio, since 3 of the rooms are theaters, but I need 2 channel audio here. I'm not sure that I can find sources that will drive both 2 channel analog AND digital audio out at the same time. And I can't find a small converter to change what is probably AC-3 audio to 2 channel analog, without adding a whole receiver to the closet for each of the bedrooms. Any ideas?


Master Bedroom:

I will have a receiver in the closet for audio, and I will directly wire 5.1 sound, to in-wall/in-ceiling spkrs and a small plasma. I guess this will have to be a real component video run to the screen, plus 6 speaker cables (one for the line level sub), a dedicated IR return cable, and 2 cat6's for phone and ethernet


Family Room:

Similar to master bed except for 7.1


Theater:

Higher quality components in the closet, HDMI run to a ceiling mounted projector, and higher quality speaker wire to 7.2 or 7.3 locations


Caveats:

- The borrego only switches component video, so I will need another DVI/HDMI switcher to switch the input to the projector.

- I will have to make sure that all sources can output both component AND hdmi at the same time (ugly).

- I will also have to make sure that all TV's can display 1080p, since that's what I will be running on the projector, and I doubt I can get a set of all sources that can do different resolutions on HDMI and component outputs (also ugly).

- And of course there's the digital audio problem in the bedrooms


Anyone see any major holes in this? Should I run more wires, like perhaps inputs from the family room for a camcorder or an xbox or something (are the cat5 rx/tx uni-directional?) Is there anything cheaper than the borrega which will provide matrix component video switching? AVATrix doesn't work, since the audio for 3 rooms is in the closet. Anything else I am missing? Is it going to hurt not having a DVD player in each room?


Or course, I will also need some kind of programmable remote in each room, and some form of IR switching, but I haven't looked into that yet.


Sorry about the long post, and thanks for any help!

--Carey


Instead of spending all the money on the cat5 repeaters, why not just run 3 coax cables for your component connections?


For your line level sub you should also use coax.


Digital audio = coax cable


Standard RCA line level analog audio = coax


IR repeater from Russound works nice. I am using that.


I like commscope 2227v. It is a plenum rated quad shield rg-6. I use plenum because it is slightly smaller in diameter that a riser rated cable. I terminate all my coax with Canare RCAP-C53 connetors. (Their idiot proof, the crimper and stripper are about the cost of 1 of your CE labs devices)
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the advice.


I didn't realize no 1080p over component. The sources are becoming a real issue, I think it will be impossible to find an HD source other than an HTPC where I can have both component and HDMI out at the same time, especially if the hdmi is set to 1080p and the component needs to be 1080i.


I suppose I could go with HDMI and repeaters throughout the house, and an HDMI matrix switcher (if such a thing exists), but man, that's gonna be expensive.


I suppose I can also go with an HTPC instead of HDTivos, and output onto HDMI and component at different resolutions at the same time, and then have a dedicated HD-DVD for the theater, and use component out into a line doubler for normal DVD. Or I could use the DVD drive in the HTPC. I guess I need to look and see how many video outputs I can drive at once from an htpc.


On the cabling, for the subwoofer line level, isn't line level supposed to be low resistance, and rg6 is 75 ohm? or, is the 75ohm inherent only to the termination?


Also, running 3 runs of RG6 for component, you might have slightly different lengths for eachc olor, which I assumed could cause video quality issues? Is there a reasonably priced high quality triple-rg6 cable?


Thanks,

--Carey
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckloss /forum/post/0


Thanks for the advice.


I didn't realize no 1080p over component. The sources are becoming a real issue, I think it will be impossible to find an HD source other than an HTPC where I can have both component and HDMI out at the same time, especially if the hdmi is set to 1080p and the component needs to be 1080i.


I suppose I could go with HDMI and repeaters throughout the house, and an HDMI matrix switcher (if such a thing exists), but man, that's gonna be expensive.


I suppose I can also go with an HTPC instead of HDTivos, and output onto HDMI and component at different resolutions at the same time, and then have a dedicated HD-DVD for the theater, and use component out into a line doubler for normal DVD. Or I could use the DVD drive in the HTPC. I guess I need to look and see how many video outputs I can drive at once from an htpc.


On the cabling, for the subwoofer line level, isn't line level supposed to be low resistance, and rg6 is 75 ohm? or, is the 75ohm inherent only to the termination?


Also, running 3 runs of RG6 for component, you might have slightly different lengths for eachc olor, which I assumed could cause video quality issues? Is there a reasonably priced high quality triple-rg6 cable?


Thanks,

--Carey

When you speak about all the HTPC stuff, you got me. Im not really into that.


As for the component lenght issues, no, its not an issue. what are we talking about in difference, a few inches?


As for multiconductor cable, i have a roll of 5-conductor bundled coax you can have it you come get it. Im in Maryland. Its just taking up space in my garage. and it was not cheap cable. its made by Liberty. you can then take the cable part number and buy the connectors from liberty. i think there is about 400 feet on the roll and its in the neighborhood of 3-4 bucks a foot. I dont like this kind of cable because the center conductor is so small. this cable is good for a projector run or something.


I use standard rg6 myself.


Line level audio is line level audio. whether it be a sub of just left/right audio signal its 75 ohms.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the cable offer, but I'm in california, and I'm not remodelling until the summer anyway :)


I guess if I'm running the cable myself, it doesn't matter to add a real run of component cable (3xrg6) + audio + IR and save myself the cost of the baluns. I was just thinking the cat5/6 would be easier to manhandle in the crawlspace, and the baluns are only $220 per location roughly including the cost of the cat5. Of course, rg6 works out to less than $40 per location, so there's a clear cost advantage that might offset the extra time in the crawlspace.


--Carey
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckloss /forum/post/0


Thanks for the cable offer, but I'm in california, and I'm not remodelling until the summer anyway :)


I guess if I'm running the cable myself, it doesn't matter to add a real run of component cable (3xrg6) + audio + IR and save myself the cost of the baluns. I was just thinking the cat5/6 would be easier to manhandle in the crawlspace, and the baluns are only $220 per location roughly including the cost of the cat5. Of course, rg6 works out to less than $40 per location, so there's a clear cost advantage that might offset the extra time in the crawlspace.


--Carey

rg6 is a little less flexible that cat5e but about the same diameter.
 
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