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Discussion Starter #1
I'm looking at the Kenwood mega changer or the Sony 875, and want to actually see them in action. Right now I have an old interlated Sony driving my Pioneer 643HD5. So I have three things I want to check out with these players:


1 - what does progressive vs. interlated gain me anyway

2 - How do these on screen search modes really work. My wife has to be able to find movies for the kiddies.

3 - Can I justify the price difference for Faroudja (which progressive is better)


I've read tons and tons of posts, but I really need to get my hands on these to see how they run.


So I go into my local Audio King, and ask about these players. They have the Kenwoods right up front, but the sales guy cannot get anything to play. When he does, he can't switch between progressive and interlaced. He's doing it on a 4x3 RPTV. He can't show me any kind of on-screen display. He has the Entre there as well and is completely baffled. A complete let down for me. He's completely lost and doesn't seem interested in finding out either.


So I think 'fine' the Sony should be easy to demo. It's sitting on a shelf, not plugged into anything. Sigh, I leave and come back another day.


Second visit: I skip the Kenwood completely, and ask to see the Sony setup. They do grab some cables and connect it up a Pioneer Elite 720. A small bonus point for at least hooking it up for me.


He doesn't have the remote, so cannot show me any on-screen display, the difference between interlaced and progressive is very very minimal (to my eyes). The sales guy doesn't seem to give a rip.


My question is, am I expecting too much going in there? This isn't Circuit City or Best Buy, I expected some kind of value for their selling at retail prices. I expect a sales person that knows their equipment or at least has some interest in it. These guys are always bored stiff.


As for progressive vs. interlaced, I didn't see much difference. Could it be because of the Elite de-interlacing is on-par with the Sony progressive?


Sorry for the long rant. At this point I'll just close my eyes, and pick the cheapest on the net.


Anyone else run into this kind of attitude?


signed, frustrated in Minneapolis :confused:
 

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If you don't like the service, don't go to the store. Find another store that gives you the service you want. It may cost more, but if the service is important to you then be prepared to pay the (usually only a little) extra cost.


The major chain stores have a volume-oriented business model that is at odds with good service. There are a lot of specialty stores and "mom-and-pop" stores who differentiate themselves by providing good service. Look in your yellow pages to see who's out there and drop by to see what they can offer. In my opinion it's worth spending a little time to find a store that you're happy with - it will pay off when you go back to them again and again.


Above all else, don't choose to go to a store because of the low prices and then complain about the ignorant sales staff or poor service. You're choosing the poor service model and supporting it with your purchases. That's fine if you don't need the service, but otherwise it's like buying a Lada and then complaining that it's not as good as a Toyota.


I found a mom and pop shop ("Main & Matrix") here in Vancouver and they very patiently put up with me as I visited again and again trying to decide what model of RPTV to buy. Then they gave me a very reasonable deal and came out and installed it and set it up for me. The next time I'm looking for something they're the first place I'm going to go.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I understand and agree. The point of my post was that I wasn't expecting great things from BB or CC or an on-line retailer. I perceived Audio King (Ultimate Electronics division) as a step above. Their prices are a step above, and I expected the service to be better as well. This is the point of my gripe. Higher prices, nicer show room, selling themselves as a superior and they haven't been.


I'll clearly take my business elsewhere if I can find other choices.


Oh BTW, I have done business with onecall.com and their reps know their products very well. Unfortunately I cannot touch or see the stuff.
 

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Quote:
I'll clearly take my business elsewhere if I can find other choices.
There lies the problem many of us face. We expect better service or knowledge from specialty stores, but can't always go somewhere else, because there isn't always an authorized dealer of a certain product somewhere else close.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Hence my frustration, even here in a larger market. I come from the 'sticks' of North Dakota, and know very well limited dealerships. I'm not sure where this rant was going, other than it bothers me to go into a store charging MSRP that doesn't know their product line and doesn't seem to give a rip about learning it.


I'm not looking to dump thousands of dollars on equipment, so the times I've been into higher end shops, I've felt out of place. I thought this was the 'sweet spot' for me. Maybe I'm high demand for smaller dollar. I don't know.
 

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Unfortunately, I've noticed that even the higher-end stores have declined of late. It seems to be a combination of more untrained sales staff, and a barrage of new technology that many stores just can't keep up with.


Nothing is more annoying than looking for high end gear that is only available from selected dealers only to find:


1. They carry the item but they don't have stock

2. They have a demo unit, but they don't have it hooked up (and aren't really interested in doing so)

3. If you want to purchase the item, they only have a demo unit. They'll sell you the demo unit, but they can't locate original the box, or the packing, or some accessory etc.


The manufacturers carry some blame as well. In certain cases, the manufacturers only allow/appoint selected dealers to carry certain high-end gear. The idea is that these dealers are considered to have the best ability to "showcase" the product. However, many manufacturer sales reps never follow up with these selected dealers to check and see if the demo unit is even plugged in or connected for demonstration purposes. So much for "showcasing".
 

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Mike,have you tried soundvideo?I've only dealt with them by mail and phone,but was very impressed,and they are in minneapolis.Of course,it was the owner but he was very helpful and gererous with his time,and to top it off gave me a great deal on a sherbourn.He left me wihing he had a store out here in the 'sticks"!
 

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Mike,

When I went to my local high end shop to see what the Denon 3800 was like, they didn't have one hooked up so the salesman had me take it home and try it out on a 2 day trial basis. I asked if they had more in the stock room in case I liked it. He said they had 3 in stock, so I took it home and tried it out. I could also do a comparison test with my old Sony 7000 once I had it home. I watched a dvd with the Sony 1st and then played the same with the Denon. I noticed a big improvement in picture and sound. I have a Pioneer Elite 710 (calibrated). The progressive with the Denon is probably 10% better than the Elite's image. Anyway I bought the Denon.


Just something to consider for comparison tests or if you want to see what it looks like with your own equipment. They take your credit card info for security, but that's understandable.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for the feedback. I think Jeffwld hit it correct, I initially had intentions of checking out the Sovereign line, and in doing so, narrowed my available shops. If I go down to the Sony, my market should open up some.


lonwolf615, I'll look them up. I've only been in the area a while, so don't know much of anything off the beaten path, but will certainly take a look.


Kensmith48, I would love to demo at home, but didn't get any kind of offer from the salesman. Maybe I should have suggested it. I believe I would need to purchase them and then go through a return if I didn't like it. For whatever reason, that doesn't feel like a demo to me. I don't feel comfortable 'buying' knowing that I'll be returning it.
 

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A good reputation may be enough to get you into the store, but then reality engages and you find out in fact whether they live up to that reputation. Maybe you happen to hit a bad salesman one day, but if you give them 2 or 3 chances and they don't redeem themselves then it's time to adjust your expectations. And if it's not adequate, what choice do you have but to look somewhere else?


Pilots have a saying - the weather is what you see outside the window, not what's written on the weather forecast. I think the same applies here...
 

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Mike, you might try StereoLand in Eden Prairie as well (ask for Randy). I had an excellent experience buying speakers there. They are definitely a notch above Audio King for service, though they don't have the same breadth of product on display.


One other tip- although Audio King prices everything at MSRP, my experience with them is that if you show you're well-informed and bring along some Internet or competitor pricing, they will negotiate to get the sale. (They won't pricematch of course, but they'll knock the price down considerably... I saved about $400 on a $1500 item this way.)


Pricing at StereoLand is pretty negotiable too.


These stores probably get a lot of people who are loaded... the type of impulse buyers who just whip out the credit card and pay list price. They're just wisely taking advantage of the fact that their typical customer has a different mindset than the average Best Buy / Circuit City shopper.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks everyone. I think I've written off my local Audio King as I've been frustrated over and over during the last year with them.


I'll check out StereoLand, Mark, and see if I can find the other store mentioned earlier. I might even try other AudioKing locations to see if the problem is just my local one.


Unfortunately I'm not one for price negotiating, but maybe I'll need to start questioning things more. That's a whole other thread though...


Thanks for letting me vent.
 
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