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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I plan on having the low voltage installer (working on my new 2 story house) install some special wire I plan on buying.

The wire is Belden #7878A - Home Automation Wire

Desrciption: "Multi-Conductor, Composite, 2 x 2 x2 Home Automation Composite cable comprised of (2) 7915A Series 6 Coax and (2) 1700A Cat 5e DataTwist 350 data cables, and (1) PTD6002 bearing (2) 62.5/125/900 micron tight buffered fiber optic members. "

I am concerned about the outcome however, because of all of the other crappy work that I have seen so far. I just have little choice because they won't allow me to work on the house.:(

So my question is what should I be looking for when it comes to properly installing this wire? There is obvious things I would guess, like not kinking the wire, and not smashing it with rolmex staples but is there anything else I should know before they close up the walls? Is there an inexpensive way to test the fiber? I know how to ring out the other wires.


Thanks in advance!

Paul
 

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Hi Paul,


Sorry cannot offer you any help :) But I just curious, what are you going to do with fiber network in your house? I assume this fiber optic? What will the application be?


I'm doing research for my upcoming home for structural wiring, automation etc, hence my question above.


Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi adzan,


I have no current plans for using the fiber optics yet, it is being installed for possible future applications like for my network. The house I currently live in has fiber optics as the main feed for my telephones and broadband connection.


I spoke with the installer (that installed the fiber in my current house) who told me that his company (Winfirst) was planning to eventually have dedicated fiber optic runs to PC's. They are however going through bankruptcy at the moment and will likely be sold to another big telecom company which may or may not continue with those plans in the future.:confused:


I feel that it is a good idea to put it in now during new construction instead of retrofitting it later down the road at a higher expense. It will also be a good selling point when I eventually sell this house. The cost for '500 of this wire is only $450.00 so it is good investment IMHO.


I am defintely going to be fully utilizing the RG-6 & Cat5e runs for my network, phones, and video, so the fiber will be just be an added bonus for the future.:)


Paul
 

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Hi Paul !


You may want to read 'My Experience'.

I'm also build a new house and installing Belden cable.

I went with Belden 7876A (2 rg6 and 2 cat5e), 7877A

and 1702A.


My builder also did not want me working on the house,

but I insisted !! You should also !! I watched how an

installer I would have hired installed the same wire next

door, and I was not impressed at all ! If you want it done

right, do it yourself !!! It could not have been easier !!

Its not hard at all ! All you would be doing is drilling

some holes, pulling cable and mounting a few boxes.


If you have no choice but to go with an installer....


Hire him just to drill the holes, pull the wire and

mount the gang boxes. The rest can be done by

you after the house closes.


Watch him during the whole process !! You may

even get away with helping. Insist that it be done

the way you want it done. Not sure of the size of

your house... but mine is 4000sf and I have aprox

14 drops in all, and mine took 2 full days to drill the

holes and run the cable. The rest... like tie wrapping

and securing the cable is easy... you can do that.


If you know what your doing, don't hire him to finish

the job... you can do that after the house is finished.


Home run everything.... and leave enough on each end.

I actually looped the cable over the gang boxes and

came back down... so this way I can pull it out after

everything is finished, attach the connectors and push

the slack back up.


Read 'my experience' in this forum... if you have any

questions let me know !


Matthew
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hi Matthew,


Just to give you a little bit of info on my background, I worked in the field of construction in my previous life, first as a carpenter for about 10 years then I migrated into electrical for about 5 years. I am currently working as a Web Developer –consultant, but as an electrician I have run thousands of feet of not only electrical wire but low voltage stuff as well and I am very familiar with how hard or easy it is to do.


I definitely can do the work if I were given the choice. In fact it is mainly because it is a two story house with no crawl space that I had to have them do anything. It was the same story with the electrical also. I am so ticked off with them now that I may just tell them not to do any of the prewire whatsoever and instead sneak over there on the weekend and do it all myself.


My plan was to buy the all in one cable myself (on top of the money I already spent in options for the wire) and then ask them to install it. The guy told me last night, "Yeah, we can do it but it will cost you $250.00 per run." I also asked them if they would use some of the cat5 (that I paid for and would not be using) and use it for the volume control runs. His response was, “Sure we can do that for $50.00 per a run!†He then gave me a lame excuse that the all in one cable was more difficult to pull and tends coil easily which causes it to bind and that they have to drill a larger hole. Yeah right! I suppose having to pull four separate runs and stapling off and labeling all those separate cables is a whole lot easier! What’s the big deal about drilling a larger hole anyway? It wouldn’t need to be much bigger than the hole they drill for the other four wires run together. They are definitely trying to make some quick easy money off me.


I am going over to meet with them today to go over the layout of the speaker prewire locations and will decide after talking with him face to face whether I will have them do any of the options. He has rubbed me the wrong way and I am leaning towards making it (his decision to gouge me) cost him now!!! These extra costs would be on top of the money I have already spent for the prewire. This is only a 2800 sq ft house we are talking about! Not only that but this would also be under the table and none of this would be covered by the builder. I was willing to accept that to get what I wanted but not at those prices! I am still hopeful that I can reason with them today. If not I guess I’ll be dusting off the tool bags and power tools. :)


The other problem with letting them do the prewire is that they run low grade unshielded RG-6 & only a 4 wire for the volume controls. The speaker wire is only a 16 gauge 4 wire also but since I am not going be pumping out too many amps to them it should be adequate.


Anyway sorry for venting but I am a little bit frazzled at the moment. I appreciate your response and I will definitely read about your experiences tonight.


Thanks,

--Paul
 

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Hi Paul !


I completely understand your frustration !

I ran into the same problem. The main reason the builder did not want

me installing anything is because I was not insured. I can understand that,

but I just could not have anyone else do the work. I don't trust them.


Don't forget, YOU are paying the bills here. You may want to insist on doing

the work. Maybe you should just start working on it.... what are they going

to do, call the cops !? They really can't say or do much if you are paying the

bills.


Your right, that is a lame excuse. I ran a huge amount of cable in my place,

and the bigger cable actually pulls easier !! The smaller cable is harder to

work with.


WOW, $250 per run !?!?!?

That sounds VERY expensive to me.... In my place there were a few runs

less then 20 feet.... there is no way in the world you should pay $250 per run.... even with the connections included !


One thing I do know... if I ever build a house again, I'm going to have that

in the contract that I can do work on the house while its being built.


I don't know your situation, but usually the person paying the bills, makes

the decisions.


Good Luck !


Matthew
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hi tebbens,


I am sorry it has been a while since my last post. I have been working on my house every night after work until it gets dark. I tell you I am tired and out of shape but I am getting the wire I want installed one way or another.


Just to update you with what has happened since my last post I went over to meet with the low voltage installers last Friday. They told me the night before that they would be there a few days and would be working on my central vacum system for the first day so I would have time to speak with them about the layout of the speakers and volume controls.


Well I got to the site at like 10 after 3pm and they showed up with four guys and nearly finished the whole house. Of course they didn't wire the speakers and volume controls correctly. (Duh!) I told them it wasn't acceptible and would have to be re-done. So, I spoke with the builder who then told them to correct the wiring which they have since done.


I also had decided that I was going to buy my own (Bundled) wiring and install it myself. I had a pre-drywall walk through with builder on Tuesday and was told earlier in the week that insulation would be going in on Friday so I had ordered the wire Monday. I had it shipped 2nd day air and started installing it on Wednesday. I got a great price on the wire at a web site called ( http://www.futurehomesystems.com ). The price for the wire was around $419. MUCH cheaper than the Belden would have cost me. I am very happy with it.


The only problem I can see is that I will have to get a larger panel to hold all the wiring. The current panel is a 28" tall Channel Plus. I ran the wire to six rooms and one run to the main telephone and cable box down near the meter. There is also a bunch of cable and cat5 that they ran to the same locations. I think it may be a little to cramped.


I have to leave their panel until after escrow closes then of course I can replace it. What size and model of panel do you have? How much did it cost you and where can I buy it?


By they way thanks for your comments about your experiences.


--Paul
 

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Hi Paul,


I havn't researched panels yet, but when I do I have to get something

very large ! Maybe 6'x3' or larger..... I want to make sure I have enough

room for the equipment I need now and for future upgrades. I'm going to

mount a 3/4" 8x4 floor board on the basement wall, then mount the panel

on that.


Matthew
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by KEI-Telecom
Check this out: http://www.kei-telecom.com/strategie...strategies.htm


Hope this helps!
KEI-Telecom,


That is great info on fiber optics! I appreciate the link. I have already learned that because of the size of my cable that I have "62.5/125mm for multimode". I guess you really can learn something new everyday. :)


I am still not sure how will need to terminate the fiber so I will probablly leave it in the wall until I learn more about it.


Thanks,

Paul
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by tebbens
Hi Paul,


I havn't researched panels yet, but when I do I have to get something

very large ! Maybe 6'x3' or larger..... I want to make sure I have enough

room for the equipment I need now and for future upgrades. I'm going to

mount a 3/4" 8x4 floor board on the basement wall, then mount the panel

on that.


Matthew
Hi Matthew,


Wow! That would be the size of the entire closet. I don't think that my wife will allow me to take up the entire master closet with a panel that size. After all where would she put all her shoes and sweaters and stuff?:D


That is awesome that you have all that space to work with! I have to deal with a small area in the closet so I am thinking I will try and get a tall panel that is a standard (16" between studs) width. The other factor is the good ole WAF. If I had my way I would have no problem with surface mounting everything on a sheet of plywood.


I am going to search the net and see if I can find one that is about 60" tall if I can. I'll let you know if I come up with anything.


Thanks,

--Paul
 
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