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Any Outlaw 950 Reviews??? Inquirying minds want to know!

6276 Views 85 Replies 35 Participants Last post by  kuzia
I understand that many of the folks who got on the 950 reservation list early have just received their pre/pros so I was hoping that these individuals would post their initial impressions about the sound quality. Anyone out there have any reviews ready?
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mad Dog
Anyone out there have any reviews ready?
Try the Outlaw Forum:

http://ubb.outlawaudio.com/cgi-local...r=15&SUBMIT=Go
Thanks Sdurani, but I already went there and only saw 1 review. I was hoping to see more hence this post. In time, I guess. All the other owners are most likely playing with their new toy and won't have any time to write any reviews until they've gone through their complete DVD and CD collections! ;)
i guess not much to talk about.
For those interested, some 950 reviews can be found at the link below.

Outlaw 950 reviews
 Here's the official Outlaw Audio Forum for the 950. The 950 just started shipping.
Mad Dog,


This is not a review, just some initial impressions. I received my 950 on Wed, 5/1 at 9:30am but did not get to set it up until 10:00pm that night. I was particularly interested in its audio performance and so the only source that I connected on Wed night was my Sony 222ES SACD player. That is, directly to the analog 5.1 mc input with 80Hz switch set to on. I should also mention that I am using an Anthem PVA7 amp, PSB Image speakers and SVS PC2531 sub. I loaded up the 222ES with two Telarc and two Audioquest titles that I am very familiar with (the two Monty Alexander, Soul Survivor, Bluesquest) and hit play. Suffice it to say that I am very impressed. Other 950 users have used the terms "transparent", "neutral", and "low noise floor" to describe the 950's audio performance and I must agree. I pulled my Sony DB940 out of a second system to confirm that the improvement was real and was struck by the dramatic difference. Strangely enough, I have yet to connect any other sources to the 950 and will not do so until this weekend. Last night was spent enjoying music (SACD's). Tonight I may connect the 47A and RP91 and may even watch a movie (Star Wars TPM probably).


Hope this helps. The 950 seems to be a winner. These are just initial impressions. Will post more this weekend.
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J Albert Morgan,


Thanks for the initial impressions.


I probably should have been more specific in the initial post but I guess at first I just wanted to read about some first impressions. Now that the first impressions are slowing trickling in, I have started to wonder....so now the question has changed...


Has anyone out there used both the 950 and the Newcastle AVP-9080? I was impatient so I sprung for the Newcastle, but I really did want the 950 but just couldn't wait any longer. Anyways, I picked up the Newcastle for less than 1/2 of what the 950 is going for, so I am wondering if anyone who has had experience with both pre/pros feels that the Outlaw is twice as good as the Newcastle.
I'm sure you've probably seen it by now, but Robert Fowkes (a.k.a. RAF) has reviews of both new Outlaw pieces here .
FWIW, a quick update. I detect a hiss when I pause my SACD player and put my ear on the grill next to my tweeter (some 950 owners have also reported this elsewhere). I do not hear it at my listening position unless the volume is close to max (i.e. between 0dB and +10dB) and the rest of the room is quiet. I have noticed that if you switch modes it goes away (dead silence) until you adjust the volume. I do not yet know for certain that this is just the 950 or is also partly due to other system and/or environmental factors. I need to look into this some more.
Eric,


Thanks for pointing people to my HT web site. Just to make it clear - technically, my writing on the 950 is not really a review, per se, since it involves comments regarding the beta test of that unit. I'm leaving the reviews, etc. to others.


That said, my remarks should give a general idea of what I think of the unit as we went through the testing period. I now have the final unit (with all the post beta-test mods) and am extremely pleased with it.


The 755 remarks, while not a beta test, is also not an in-depth review but just some general information.


Finally, a few comments on both units that should help out.


First the 755: A very nice sounding unit with good construction. It runs very cool and quiet (fan-less design). I strongly suggest that you leave a couple of inches above the unit to allow its passive cooling design to work properly. It's almost 8 inches tall and my 8" Sanus Euroracks were not letting it cool properly so it was running hotter than normal. Nothing was wrong as far as performance was concerned but I didn't feel comfortable for the long haul. Now that I've extended the shelf by 4" with extension tubes from Sanus the 755 (and I suspect its brother, the 770) doesn't heat up at all.


Then the 950: I'm enjoying reading all the reviews (more to come, I'm sure) as people begin to see what the 950 does. I'm particularly intrigued about what one person said about turning the 950 up to maximum (+10dB volume) and hearing some hiss. This is true of every component that I've ever hear and not real world listening conditions. You only hear the hiss, sometimes (from analog more than digital) when your ear is literally touching the speaker grill) at maximum volume. The second you turn down the volume to even 0dB (which is much louder than normal) or if you move an inch away from the speakers, the "hiss" disappears. I have to think that if the only thing that people can find wrong about the 950 (other than the color of its power button) is something like a hiss "problem?" under extremely unrealistic conditions that it has to be a good product.


Will some people have problems with their 950s? I would be surprised if they didn't because no product run is 100% flawless. And will some of these problems be attributable to other issues than the 950 itself (sources, wiring, other components, electrical power issues, etc.)? Most likely.
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Raf-Its nice to see someone else up early,working on a Sunday...


i thought i was the only one:)


m.
RAF,


Nice to see that you were able to add your thoughts to this thread.


To add some more to the hiss issue. As indicated in my earlier post (RAF also mentions this), for my 950, this is only a faint hiss. Furthermore, it is only detectable under the somewhat extreme conditions that I mentioned. To put things in perspective, I replaced the 950 with a Sony DB940 from another system and, not surprisingly, more hiss from the Sony. So, for my 950, I do not think this is a problem. Also, RAF added a point that I should have mentioned in my earlier post. That is, the hiss (curiously) seems more apparent from analog than digital.


To move on to other impressions. How is it as an HT processor? Well, I hooked up my RP91 and finally watched SWTPM and Toy Story2, plus bits and pieces of several other DVD's. Very, very, very good. No problems at all. No audio dropouts, no acquisition time concerns. Excellent soundstage, excellent surround panning (SWTPM light saber duel). I have not had a chance to check out all the available modes but so far, a flawless performance as an HT processor. By the way, I have mains at 60Hz and center and surrounds at 80Hz.


Hope these impressions help. Again, the 950 seems to be a winner.
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Quote:
Originally posted by j albert morgan
Mad Dog,


This is not a review, just some initial impressions. I received my 950 on Wed, 5/1 at 9:30am but did not get to set it up until 10:00pm that night. I was particularly interested in its audio performance and so the only source that I connected on Wed night was my Sony 222ES SACD player. That is, directly to the analog 5.1 mc input with 80Hz switch set to on. I should also mention that I am using an Anthem PVA7 amp, PSB Image speakers and SVS PC2531 sub. I loaded up the 222ES with two Telarc and two Audioquest titles that I am very familiar with (the two Monty Alexander, Soul Survivor, Bluesquest) and hit play. Suffice it to say that I am very impressed. Other 950 users have used the terms "transparent", "neutral", and "low noise floor" to describe the 950's audio performance and I must agree. I pulled my Sony DB940 out of a second system to confirm that the improvement was real and was struck by the dramatic difference. Strangely enough, I have yet to connect any other sources to the 950 and will not do so until this weekend. Last night was spent enjoying music (SACD's). Tonight I may connect the 47A and RP91 and may even watch a movie (Star Wars TPM probably).


Hope this helps. The 950 seems to be a winner. These are just initial impressions. Will post more this weekend.
When you say transparent, transparent to what? Also, comparing any two audio components in any sighted way, the results are not reliable. If you don't have controls like level matched, so that you are not pointing out the unit that's playing the loudest and attributing those dramatic differences to loudness instead of real sound quality. Also, any listening comparison should be at least blind, you could even have someone else switch between them and let you trying to listen to see if you can detect any real audible differences.
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Auditor55: Well, if you are gonna require a blinded testing for true outcome reliability, then I can't think of a single review which you could consider valid. I don't know of any preamp/processor or component review which used a double blind, crossover protocol which tested to a significant p value. Even if you simply try to use an ABX switch box of some sort to insure true double blinded testing, you would first have to test the switch box in a number of different systems using a myriad of differing components, cables etc, in order to first determine that the ABX box itself does not color the sound or favor certain components over others.


Most people test, demo and compare components to determine what unit THEY like best. Each person should only finally consider what they think, and what they want to do with their money. In reality, nothing else matters.
RAF,


Just to clarify, I assume that the person you are referring to regarding the 950 hiss issue is SteveR. I've just finished reading through the threads on both other forums and I have to point out that Steve is not complaining about a hiss that he can only hear when the volume is turned to +10db. Quite the contrary, the hiss level does NOT track the volume control, but does appear to be introduced by the 950. Steve may have a defective unit, but it appears that at least one other user has reproduced the same "problem". (I put the quotes in for emphasis, since even with this "problem" Steve has indicated that he has no intention of returning his 950.)


Many others have not been able to reproduce Steve's results, but it was not clear to me that they performed the same experiment.


-Gary
I have had a 950 for a number of months and never noticed any hiss at all, ever. Still, after reading Steve's post, I too put my ear to my tweeter and could detect a hiss for up to a few inches in front of my tweeter. At 4 inches or more, nada, nothing silence, regardless of where the volume control was at.


Being the curious type, I went to a local dealer and did the same thing with a few more systems at the store. Sure enough, that same hiss was heard in both a system using a Rotel 1066 and one using a Krell preamp and CD player.


Since then, others have commented that his type of volume unrelated hiss may originate in the amplifiers rather than the preamps.


I don't know and I really don't care what is causing this "ear to tweeter" hiss. I seldom listen to music or a movie with my ear pressed to my tweeters, so, for me, any hiss of this type is irrelevant.
Quote:
Originally posted by merc


Being the curious type, I went to a local dealer and did the same thing with a few more systems at the store. Sure enough, that same hiss was heard in both a system using a Rotel 1066 and one using a Krell preamp and CD player.


I don't know and I really don't care what is causing this "ear to tweeter" hiss. I seldom listen to music or a movie with my ear pressed to my tweeters, so, for me, any hiss of this type is irrelevant.
I agree with Merc on this...I can detect the described hiss from my Newcastle pre/pro when my ear is right up on the tweeter as well but it is not noticeable from any normal listening position. From my experience, I have never heard any system that didn't have this hiss including an out of my immediate reach Jeff Rowland system so this is would not be an issue in my decision.
Quote:
Originally posted by merc
I seldom listen to music or a movie with my ear pressed to my tweeters,
merc,


Perhaps you meant "I never listen to... ". :)


Anyway, any thoughts yet on the Sony P9K analog preamp. Maybe as it compares to the 950 analog bypass. I imagine the P9K would be in conjunction with the ICBM.
merc and j albert morgan,


i thought that's what headphones were? pressing your ear right up to the speaker! that's what i've been doing all along for my headphones. :D
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