[DaddyDC650]

I have DirecTV w/HD and I noticed that during certain HD programs (mainly during TNT/ESPN NBA HD Playoff games) that the colors change? It's as if my HDTV changes the color temp from cool to warm every second or two. Last nights broadcast of the Warriors game on ESPN HD had this problem. I decided to watch the game via Bay Area FSN HD and the problem was nowhere to be seen. I own a DirecTV H20 HDTV Satellite Receiver btw.

 

[Smthkd]

Color change ????

Im confused!

 

[DaddyDC650]

Well, it's kind of hard to explain. For example, if someone's face is displayed on the screen, it'll appear more red than usual for a second or two and then the natural color will come back. It'll repeat this process numerous times. It's kind of annoying.

 

[coyoteaz]

Technical explanation: D*'s encoders are hardwired to 30 frame GOPs and don't employ scene detection. Therefore, on a scene change, you could have up to 29 frames referencing an I frame that has nothing in common with the current one. Due to their bitstarving, this results in off colors and bad blocking.


Nontechnical explanation: D*'s encoders are ancient and don't detect when a new scene is on so you get up to a second's worth of video that is based on the wrong thing. Combine this with the low bitrate and it looks like crap.

 

[Dinger23]

I was watching the Sox/O's game last night and saw what looked like if you changed the color settings on your TV from cool to warm. I just thought it was NESN not D*

 

[DaddyDC650]

Dinger, it seems as if you experienced the same thing that I did. It does seem as if my HDTV changed the color settings from cool to warm every second or two on certain programs. Yesterdays ESPN HD broadcast of the Warriors vs Utah game was a prime example. Yet, when I changed to the same broadcast via Bay Area FSN HD instead of ESPN HD, the problem was nowhere to be seen.


Coyoteaz, do I have to live with the problem or can I do something about it??? Btw, I own a DirecTV H20 HDTV Satellite Receiver.

 

[petergaryr]

Oddly, I did some experimenting and I've found that component connections (in my case), tend to give a more consistent color balance that HDMI (using a D* HR20-700). I can switch back and forth between outputs pretty easily and quickly to verify.

 

[DaddyDC650]

petergaryr, both HDMI and Component display the same problem. I was thinking, can it be possible that my dish might be having problems with certain HD broadcasts? ESPN HD and TNT HD in particular.

 

[petergaryr]

I don't think that would account for color shifts.


I can think of two possibilities (there may be more).


One would be simple carelessness on the part of the station where someone just has messed with the controls.


The other is that some TVs have circuitry in them that attempt to maintain a certain "flesh" tone (different from the user adjustable controls for things like "cool" which tend to give white especially a slight bluish tint or "warm" which tends more toward red).


That circuity tends to work better on some sets than others.


You know, I said two, but there is another one. A show like NCIS for as long as I can remember has had a reddish cast to it. It was really bad in the earlier seasons, and still tends to get that way at times. It is possible that what you are seeing is just "artistic" license in some shows.

 

[DaddyDC650]

petergaryr, I doubt that it is the fault of my HDTV since other HD channels look fine and SD channels also do not display the problem. It's mainly TNT HD and ESPN HD that are the culprits. I notice the problem big time during NBA Playoff games. Like I typed before, I was watching the Utah/Warriors Playoff game last night on ESPN HD and the problem was there. I decided to watch the game via Bay Area FSN HD which was also airing the game and it looked great, no problems.

 

[TVOD]

Does it change suddenly from one state to the other or gradually. A gradual change back and forth between two states is often called "breathing".

 

[petergaryr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyDC650 /forum/post/0


petergaryr, I doubt that it is the fault of my HDTV since other HD channels look fine and SD channels also do not display the problem. It's mainly TNT HD and ESPN HD that are the culprits. I notice the problem big time during NBA Playoff games. Like I typed before, I was watching the Utah/Warriors Playoff game last night on ESPN HD and the problem was there. I decided to watch the game via Bay Area FSN HD which was also airing the game and it looked great, no problems.

Well, then I'm stumped. I haven't seen anything like what you describe on either TNT or ESPN on either the Mitsubishi RPTV (using a D* HR10-250 DVR)I have in the HT, or the Sony KDF50E2000 (using an HR20-700) I have in the bedroom.

 

[DaddyDC650]

TVOD, it changes every second or two. It's pretty annoying.

 

[TVOD]

A sudden change back and forth (like a switch being thrown) every second second or so would be consistent with a 30 frame GOP. A gradual change back and forth would not seem to. What display is the D* receiver connected to? Do you have another display or TV you could connect it to? Even a SD TV might be of use for this purpose.


The fact that someone else has seen something similar would indicate that it might be source related.

 

[DaddyDC650]

TVOD, the display is a Sony KV-30HS420 CRT HDTV. The problem isn't there whenever my HDTV is displaying SD content or certain HD content. It's mainly TNT HD and ESPN HD. During NBA Playoff games is when it's at its worst.

 

[TVOD]

Just to rule it out, you might try lowering the contrast on your TV some. I've seen CRT based sets cycle on color if a color channel overloads. There may be level differences between the stations, and those two might be different. Just a wild guess, but not out of the question. BTW I've seen this on very expensive professional Sony CRT monitors before - it's the beam current regulator oscillating. As mentioned if you have a SD TV you might check the SD video output to it, or to the HDTV.

 

[mkinn]

See if the problem occurs on camera changes and cuts. If it happens during a single camera feed, it is not due to differences in camera calibration at the source.

ESPN and TNT sports have a high ABL (average brightness level) compared with other sources. I can only recommend borrowing a friend's D* receiver to verify the problem 1st. You could also buy a used HD D* receiver for $50.00 or so.

This problem is usually caued by the TV itself, which would be a free fix , if it's still under warranty. I'd try to duplicate it on the DVE or AVIA DVD's which you can rent from a video store. I'd suspect intermittant problems in the video output IC's on the C (CRT drive) board. Alternately, changes in the G2 voltage caused by a bad flyback FBT transformer can cause this. The only other likely cause is the AKB circuit inside the jungle IC, which maintains correct greyscale as the CRT ages. Also, do not leave the set in Dynamic picture mode. This causes premature failure of the CRT, since the contrast is at 100%. Pick PRO, Movie, or Standard mode, and see if the problem goes away.

 

[TVOD]

All those auto modes drive me crazy on consumer equipment. I wish there was a single manual mode button to disable them all. Just let me see the image as it was created.