AVS Forum banner
1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,292 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeschmoe007 /forum/post/18134292


Are there movies on cable HD that are not on Blu-Ray yet?


Or, to rephrase it: if movie is available in HD on cable - does it mean that it is most likely available on Blu-Ray too at the same time?

Absolutely not. There are FAR more movies in HD on cable than BD. Everything from recent low-budget horror movies, independent films and classics! (Saw the original WOLFMAN and Tod Brownings FREAKS in HD some weeks back. Tonight the old Doris Day/Rock Hudson/Tony Randall films are running.) With very few exceptions, BD is primarily limited to recent studio films and blockbusters.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
393 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons /forum/post/18134354


Absolutely not. There are FAR more movies in HD on cable than BD. Everything from recent low-budget horror movies, independent films and classics! (Saw the original WOLFMAN and Tod Brownings FREAKS in HD some weeks back. Tonight the old Doris Day/Rock Hudson/Tony Randall films are running.) With very few exceptions, BD is primarily limited to recent studio films and blockbusters.

I see. But does it make sense? It seems to me that the most labor-intensive part in Blu-Ray release is HD transfer (I may be wrong). It is obviously done b/c move is available in HD on cable. So why not release it on Blu-Ray at this time? I don't think people would expect a lot of extras on Blu-Ray for older/less popular movies.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,268 Posts
Just because there is an HD transfer doesn't mean it'll make a great blu-ray. I know Star Wars and LOTR have been on HDTV for ages but wouldn't you rather they take the time to put out a gorgeous state of the art disc?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,292 Posts
There is also the matter of cost. BD discs are more expensive to create than HD-DVD was, for example. (Probably why there was a wider variety of classic and independent films released on that format, with at least one more to come next month). But then, one must also take into account what the financial return would be. Will enough people buy a title to make it profitable?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,808 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeschmoe007 /forum/post/18134515


I see. But does it make sense? It seems to me that the most labor-intensive part in Blu-Ray release is HD transfer (I may be wrong). It is obviously done b/c move is available in HD on cable. So why not release it on Blu-Ray at this time? I don't think people would expect a lot of extras on Blu-Ray for older/less popular movies.

It's not that simple. TV HD versions are dramatically different animals:


1) they are usually interlaced video at 30fps, which is not the optimal way to view film-based content.


2) Many of those transfers were made to older HD tape formats that only supported 1440x1080, as opposed to a full 1920x1080.


3) BD's are usually mastered and compressed from a higher resolution film scan, which looks better in the final disc since it's a cleaner image to start. If you started with a TV transfer, it would be recompressing an already compressed product.


4) For many of those early transfers, the original scans were done with the final TV transfer in mind, meaning you were lucky if most started out as a 2K image. It's common now to work from a 4K or higher scan for BD.


5) Scanning is the least labor intensive part. It's automated. You go have lunch while it's happening. The labor intensive part is the cleanup process that often didn't happen with the TV transfers. Major restoration takes even longer. Next in line for labor is the creation of the menus and the overall layout of the disc.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
20,735 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeschmoe007 /forum/post/18134515


I see. But does it make sense? It seems to me that the most labor-intensive part in Blu-Ray release is HD transfer (I may be wrong). It is obviously done b/c move is available in HD on cable. So why not release it on Blu-Ray at this time? I don't think people would expect a lot of extras on Blu-Ray for older/less popular movies.

Assuming that there is a good HD master somewhere, which is not always the case for HD used for broadcast/cable/sat, it still needs to be compressed and authored for blu-ray, which takes time and money. And a lot of those HD transfers were on old telecine machines 2k if you're lucky etc, and doing that today could be 4k or higher quality, etc. And that's not cheap either.


Then obviously there is probably the rights issues of who owns the distribution rights in what countries/regions etc etc etc.


So it might not be technically difficult to take a broadcast quality MPEG-2 HD version of some movie and stick that on a disc, that's not all it takes. And that's not what we expect. When I see that garbage on a BD, I throw that crap right back, as do all of us. I don't want that. That's crap.


So to get it right costs money and time(sometimes a WHOLE lot of both), and obviously for a lot of small-time stuff is there demand for it yet? Probably not enough to be profitable.


And honestly, while I'd love to see a whole lot more old and small-time stuff, it's more worth it to me to be patient and see it done right. Some studio dumps a crap BD release of a great movie, and it could set us back years before we see it re-mastered all over again.


If it's something like Lawrence of Arabia, I mean hell yes I'd LOVE to have that in my hands today right now. But if getting it right it means I have to wait a few years while it's restored, and transfered, and mastered and compressed to the nth degree, then hell yes I'll wait. I want the best the format and the film sources can provide, not just the leftovers some knucklehead decided to source from a crap print and a crap scan that is run over with DNR and edge-enhancement and done with a half-assed low bitrate encode and lossy audio and stuffed on a disc. Heck, any numbnutz with a computer and a sledgehammer can figure out how to do that...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,948 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisWiggles /forum/post/18144380


And honestly, while I'd love to see a whole lot more old and small-time stuff, it's more worth it to me to be patient and see it done right. Some studio dumps a crap BD release of a great movie, and it could set us back years before we see it re-mastered all over again.

Yes, that usually the biggest problem for catolog titles. I found Tora tora tora in the store a month ago, but I couldnt purchase it because I had no idea what quality the master was in.


It would have been great just to purchase any disc you feelt for, but I have learned to be catious about that.


New releases on the other hand rarely suffers from this regard.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,309 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons /forum/post/18134354


With very few exceptions, BD is primarily limited to recent studio films and blockbusters.



35%-40% of the AFI Top 100 films of all time are on Blu-ray, as are a ton of cult and indie films. Also, HD cable has had a decade of full support using cheap masters, all of which are either lower-rez or interlaced, many upconverted from DVD resolution, or just plain old. Blu-ray has been out for 3.5 years with incomplete studio support for half that time, with many titles remastered and/or re-transferred, only a literal handful of upconverted titles, and a few interlaced nature/opera titles. It's apples and oranges.
Quote:
And honestly, while I'd love to see a whole lot more old and small-time stuff, it's more worth it to me to be patient and see it done right. Some studio dumps a crap BD release of a great movie, and it could set us back years before we see it re-mastered all over again.

QFT.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,267 Posts
Was it just 2 years ago Lawrence of Arabia was released for HDTV? While not quite up to BD standards, it was better than nothing at all.


I have numerous HD recordings of shows, movies and events that may not make it to BD ever. Thankfully my old DVHS player is still working and my HTPC is great at recording broadcast HDTV.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
796 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons /forum/post/18134354


Absolutely not. There are FAR more movies in HD on cable than BD. Everything from recent low-budget horror movies, independent films and classics! (Saw the original WOLFMAN and Tod Brownings FREAKS in HD some weeks back. Tonight the old Doris Day/Rock Hudson/Tony Randall films are running.) With very few exceptions, BD is primarily limited to recent studio films and blockbusters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Clemons /forum/post/18134905


There is also the matter of cost. BD discs are more expensive to create than HD-DVD was, for example. (Probably why there was a wider variety of classic and independent films released on that format, with at least one more to come next month). But then, one must also take into account what the financial return would be. Will enough people buy a title to make it profitable?

What is this 2007?



Bluray has 4-5x the content now, new releases every Tuesday, from a plurality of genres and time periods.


Supplement that with your HD Cable/Satellite and there should be very few complaints.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,364 Posts
Sometimes the cable/ota version is superior to the Blu Ray release.

"Escap from New York" being a perfect example. I'm glad I still have my cable cap and avoided the BD.


Obscure movies/titles may never be released on optical or even in HD, so if you can cap it and it is obscure-you would be wise to archive the HD "broadcast"...........


I have fond memories of the movies "Raise the Titanic" and "Damnation Alley", yet neither ever has, nor will be shown in HD let alone released on BD.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,022 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by qz3fwd /forum/post/18148386


Sometimes the cable/ota version is superior to the Blu Ray release.

"Escap from New York" being a perfect example. I'm glad I still have my cable cap and avoided the BD.


Obscure movies/titles may never be released on optical or even in HD, so if you can cap it and it is obscure-you would be wise to archive the HD "broadcast"...........


I have fond memories of the movies "Raise the Titanic" and "Damnation Alley", yet neither ever has, nor will be shown in HD let alone released on BD.

Are these "superior" OTA HD broadcats Original Aspect Ratio or Pan & Scan cropped versions ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,309 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by qz3fwd /forum/post/18148386


Sometimes the cable/ota version is superior to the Blu Ray release.

"Escap from New York" being a perfect example. I'm glad I still have my cable cap and avoided the BD.

Screenshots? And BTW, "once" =/= "sometimes," especially on a title that hasn't been released in the US.
Quote:
I have fond memories of the movies "Raise the Titanic" and "Damnation Alley", yet neither ever has, nor will be shown in HD let alone released on BD.

I never thought Hardware would be released in HD, either, but it's a SE on Blu-ray. I'm not counting anything out just because it's not well-known.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,399 Posts
The number of Blu-Ray players in peoples homes will explode over the next 3-5 years. I suspect most brick and mortar retailers will simply stop carrying DVD players and catalog DVD titles and you will see Blu-Ray become very mainstream. At that point expect lots of obscure content to get released. I also expect Blu-Ray to be around a good 15+ years. So it has time on it's side as well. I doubt it will ever have the full depth of titles that DVD had, but there will be tens of thousands of movies to pick from.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,286 Posts
Lawrence of arabia was in hd for the longest time. It has been transferred a few times since the late 1980's. but HD than and now is much different.

my oldest copy on highdef laserdisc.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,364 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman /forum/post/18148948


Are these "superior" OTA HD broadcats Original Aspect Ratio or Pan & Scan cropped versions ?

OAR from my memory.

I've got it stored on one of 30 hard drives, but watched it last year.

The BD release was universally panned by reviewers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,286 Posts
I've had some lower res transfers and cropped versions that I prefer, some in detail because of filtering, or just colour rendition on the BD version was dfferent.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
835 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmedia2 /forum/post/18150460


I've had some lower res transfers and cropped versions that I prefer, some in detail because of filtering, or just colour rendition on the BD version was dfferent.

You're not kidding. Perfect example is probably a film that would surprise many. It's a little indie film with some aussie actor named Russell Crowe. Yes, the film is Gladiator and my Bev cap has detail (not to mention color fidelity) that the Blu Ray version can't touch.
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top