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I have perfect pitch and can hear some of the mid-range notes (just a few) slightly off key and even distorted at times.

Do they have the option to turn off some of the processing?

IIRC various noise reduction etc processing works in freq bands, which can result in artifacts like you described.



My wife didn't want me to get the behind the ear models which certainly would have been better because she didn't want me to look like an 'old man'. I did go to Costco but I wanted the smallest and best available which they didn't have.

That shouldn't be an issue unless you have a shaved head and ears that stick out.

My Rextons and many others I've seen are small enough to tuck behind the ears and are available in a few colors to match your hair.

The only visible part is the thin clear tubes that run into the ear canal, and virtually no one notices them; people are always surprised to find out I have HA's.
 

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I'm 44 but have had tinnitus basically my whole life. I know hearing aids are in my future. Thanks for all the info.

One question: Do you guys use EQ on your music systems to correct the frequencies you're deficient in? I do. It helps bring the music to life. Turning on the EQ brings me some of the same observations you mention. Obviously not purist but neither is a constant ringing in the ears.
 

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Hi,
I saw a link to here from computeraudiophile and read both this and the other thread on hearing aids for audiophiles. So I joined up here to tell my unfolding story, if it may help others.


I started to notice problems with conversations in noisy spaces about 2 years ago. Got to an audiologist (son of my primary care Doc !) 3 mo. later to learn the deeply depressing news I was starting to roll off fast at 1Khz :eek:. I still enjoyed my canned music and could listen critically to gear & s/w changes. Speech wasn't too much of a problem, so I put off any action. A year later, another test, to the relief I hadn't gotten worse. Now 6 months later, I decided to get a pair of HAs, as i could 'feel' a loss of audio perception. It seemed time.


I had decided my choice of HA from comments in a PSAudio 'Ask Paul' segment. The link is the last one on the very 1st page of this thread. What sealed the deal for me was both that the GHI HA's were the choice of symphony musicians (who would know, or care more?), and it was inexpensive and available.


So a week ago I bought a pair of General Hearing Instruments (GHI) 'Simplicity HiFi EP' aids. I got them online (only) from Walmart (or Sams Club online) since they were a bit cheaper. I paid less then $800 for the pair plus 6% MI sales tax, delivered to my door. Some of the prices mentioned in this thread are horrifying to this poor pensioner :confused:


They are definitely simple: behind the ear with a tube into the canal, where a soft, perforated cone holds it centered and lets sound thru. It has one control, a tiny on-off/volume knob that even with my tiny-things-trained fingers, can't adjust in place :( Oh and the battery pops out for the preferred 'off' control.


The action is simple too, they add missing highs, nothing else. Not only do I apply a strong principle of "Less Is More" to my audio system, but to other aspects of my life. I am very suspicious of uncontrolled expansion of complexity in systems. More and more often it can produce terrible results (Windows, Facebook, modern automobile behavior ???).


I am just in the beginning HA stages, only getting the levels adjusted properly (with help from my audio system :cool: ) a few days back. They are still irritating to wear, so need time and practice. I don't want to comment on hearing changes yet, that needs more time to settle, and my critical listening practice is always for extended (many days) exposure.


So, Cheers for now,
Dave
 

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Thanks for the review, Dave, very interesting.


...they add missing highs, nothing else.

Can you elaborate on the above?

I don't get that from what the GH site says:

"The Simplicity™ Hi-Fidelity OTE was developed to help provide an ideal balance of listening for a wide variety of sounds encountered in everyday life. The wide dynamic range compression/expansion system separates incoming sounds, into low-pitched and high-pitched sounds.

simiplicity-hi-fi-productBass and treble are adjusted automatically and continuously. The sound processing makes soft sounds easier to hear and maintains loud sounds at comfortable levels. The result is pure, clear sound reproduction.

The wide bandwidth eliminates “tinny” sound while providing clearer speech understanding, superior sound quality and the highest fidelity possible. This specialty design protects the sound circuit from very intense sounds that can cause unpleasant distortion.

The Simplicity Hi-Fidelity EP OTE will allow the user to enjoy the “music of life” once again. Musicians or music enthusiasts will especially appreciate the excel- lent harmonics that give music its richness.

The user adjustable volume control allows the user to make precise adjustments to gain and output. By not amplifying loud sounds the need to constantly adjust the volume control in different listening environments is eliminated."


Also, the last sentence is a bit concerning, as my hearing loss profile need treble boost at all SPL.
 

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Can you elaborate on the above?
I don't get that from what the GH site says:
Ok, maybe I don't understand exactly how the device works. I didn't see the text you quote. I had picked up an impression from the comments in the "Paul Speaks" segment, a couple of graphs in the Owners Manual. That and how they feel to me in the week or so I have been experimenting with them.


One other (big?) factor is most of the information about these, and other devices mentioned in this thread, sounds like techie bs market-speak that most audiophiles should have a strong filter for by now.


Were you concerned about my distrust of (overly) complex technology? Sorry but I can't help you there, everyone should be skeptical on that score.

In fact I know one audiophile with failing hearing that was driven into depression by the wretched performance of his various HAs and his audiologists worthless (at best) advice. I suspect heroic digital 'speech assistance', auto mode sensing/switching and whatever software got too far off the reservation for good 'hearing assistance' ;)


And I'm not talking about those with specific, unusual hearing problems, but the majority of folks whose treble response is dropping off fairly linearly (like mine, and I think the graph that Steve posted).



All of this is IMHO :rolleyes: I have much more to learn...


Dave
 

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Were you concerned about my distrust of (overly) complex technology?

Not at all.

I have two concerns about the GH devices - that they may just be amplifying w/o correction of treble rolloff, and what GH said about not amplifying high levels, which would in effect also result in insufficient treble.

I'm pretty happy with my current HA's so I'm not motivated to investigate further, as the landscape may be very different by the time I need new ones.
 

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Discussion Starter #88 (Edited)
Got demo ReSound hearing aids mid afternoon today. Came home and listened to music not impressed. Didn't seem to do much compared to no hearing aids and I felt dynamics perhaps limited a bit. I was prepared to bring them back tomorrow very disappointed and get the Phonaks I had demod back whichwere excellent! I went out for dinner using the hearing aids and all I started getting was a minor headache. I came back home quite dejected. However, I decided to try again but expecting to be disappointed listening to 2 channel music. Surprising after a bit the sound has opened up and I'm srarting to really like ths music! Popping the hearing aids in and out I am now hearing a marked sonic improvement vs no HAs! Lyn Stanley's new album "London Calling: A Tribute to Julie London" is hitting me off the charts now more than I recall yesterday listening with the Phonaks! Same for another new album "Carpenters with The Royal Philharmonic Orchestra"! Now I'm listening to "Tettero Plays Eddie Harris and Les McCann". Whereas earlier today this not much different than without my new demo ReSound HAs. now its no doubt as nice, full bodied, better across the board especially highs and as good if not better than I remember with the Phonaks.

I had thought that since I had the Phonaks for more than 2 weeks at full frequency correction that my ear/brain would be used to these demo ReSound hearing aids right away. But apparently it took some hours of using the ReSound hearing aids for my ear/brain to start really adapting!
It "looked" like this was gonna be a good example that what you expect, better sonics as ReSound is speced to 9.5 kHz (8 kHz for Phonak) and 116 dB, was simply not the case, thus the folks who argue you must "blind test" don't know jack S--T! But I am glad this is gonna be a contest now!
I've done some internet sleuthing to discover that the latest top line Phonak (the top line Phonak I demod came out in 2015, and the latest line came out a few weeks ago), ReSound and Oticon are speced for dynamic range (ability to process incoming audio) at 111 (this is for the just out Marvel line, the Audeo line I demod is 95 dB), 113 and 116 dB, respectively. And Phonak (the latest Marvel and the prior Audeo) are speced for 8 kHz, whereas ReSound and Oticon are speced for 9.5 kHz. Since Phonak, ReSound and Oticon are all speced dynamic range well above 95 dB, and above 110 dB, looks like they have all moved into 24 bit chips.

I've done a lot more music listening in my theater. And some movies/tv. Interesting that with my Sony VPL-5000VW projector on, with the Phonak Audeo I did hear a high pitched whirr which went away after a few minutes, whereas with the ReSound that high pitched whirr usually continues on as a very very low volumewise high pitched wirr through my watching stuff. I watched again some of the 4k disc "Crazy Rich Asians", with a really nice musical soundtrack, and realized that whereas the Phonak Audeo seemed to give more detail from the ground (mid bass) up and even expand the soundstage a bit and make me want to listen only with the hearing aids (HAs) in, that the ReSound didn't do anything to hurt the music, but overall did a good amount less of improvement to the music. And this is what I found in listening to a lot of music as well, that the ReSound did improve the very top end somewhat, but that the Phonak Audeo seemed to give more detail from the ground (mid bass) up and even expand the soundstage a bit, with vocals being more enticing and pulling me in, with drum brushes and cymbal metal sounding being so much more clear, etc etc. With the Phonak Audeo, piano and harp has clearly a bit higher pitch and more enticing, whereas with the ReSound I didn't really feel drawn in any more than without the HAs.

I've been a bit down and out and missed two concerts late last week where I would have demod ReSound with live music, but I'm better now but anticipate from my own two channel music that my reaction will likely be similar tonight when as I am better I will be seeing/hearing Peter White jazz! And I'm following up with my Audiologist this Wednesday.

I think what happened the first afternoon/evening I had the ReSounds, when they initially sounded worse than not using HAs, is that it took me some hours using them to adapt, and that evening music sounded so much better that I thought my ear/brain would continue to adapt and they would hold true to the speced 116 dB and 9.5 kHz specs. But that's not what happened.

Keep in mind that its not only the chipset bits, not only the dynamic range and frequency response specs, but most importantly the software programming and how the combination of everything sounds for music which concerns me as an audiophile. One more observation. I play digital test tones from "Audiophile Speaker Set-Up (2xHD) test disc with frequencies from 16 Hz on up to 20 kHz. With the Phonak Bolero, I could hear test tones up to 8kHz relatively even with the HAs but 8 kHz much lower in volume without the HAs. With the ReSound, I could hear test tones up to 10 kHz but with 10 kHz down some but not half, and I could also hear more vibration in the test tones. Yet as I've said the musicality, the excitement, the "I've got to have them" is far more up the scale for me with the Phonak Bolero vs the ReSound.Whatever Phonak has done with the Audeo I demod makes me happy to plunk down too much $$$ and buy the even newer model Marvel (assuming I can demo them and find they are I assume even better given Phonak's experience in software programming of their HAs).

My Audiologist also has Oticon so I am hoping to demo them as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #89 (Edited)
I've done a lot more music listening in my theater. And some movies/tv. Interesting that with my Sony VPL-5000VW projector on, with the Phonak Audeo I did hear a high pitched whirr which went away after a few minutes, whereas with the ReSound that high pitched whirr usually continues on as a very very low volumewise high pitched wirr through my watching stuff. I watched again some of the 4k disc "Crazy Rich Asians", with a really nice musical soundtrack, and realized that whereas the Phonak Audeo seemed to give more detail from the ground (mid bass) up and even expand the soundstage a bit and make me want to listen only with the hearing aids (HAs) in, that the ReSound didn't do anything to hurt the music, but overall did a good amount less of improvement to the music. And this is what I found in listening to a lot of music as well, that the ReSound did improve the very top end somewhat, but that the Phonak Audeo seemed to give more detail from the ground (mid bass) up and even expand the soundstage a bit, with vocals being more enticing and pulling me in, with drum brushes and cymbal metal sounding being so much more clear, etc etc. With the Phonak Boleros, piano and harp has clearly a bit higher pitch and more enticing, whereas with the ReSound I didn't really feel drawn in any more than without the HAs.

I've been a bit down and out and missed two concerts late last week where I would have demod ReSound with live music, but I'm better now but anticipate from my own two channel music that my reaction will likely be similar tonight when as I am better I will be seeing/hearing Peter White jazz! And I'm following up with my Audiologist this Wednesday.
My observations of using the ReSound hearing aids at the Peter White/Rick Braun Christmas jazz concert last night are similar to my observations in my own two channel setup. First, phenomenal concert. They all sang, too, quite nicely, one song acapella with no instruments! Very 3d presentation which I measured up to 98 dB at one point! I popped the ReSound HAs in and out many times during the show, and uniformly found they added just a tad and that's all. Keyboard and xylaphone sounded pitchwise the same with or without the HAs, whereas with the Phonaks I could easily discern a somewhat higher better pitch to these musical instruments. I think its pretty obvious Phonak made a choice to program their upper tier hearing aids with Autosound and music program to avoid compression but to improve the sonics and apply frequency correction at all levels; whereas ReSound was happy not to compress the existing sound and perhaps make the sound a tad better. Again, interesting as I demod the Phonak Bolero, a 16 bit model with 8k frequency extension and 95 dB dynamic range input processing which came out in 2015, and the ReSound is a 24 bit with 9.5k frequency extension and 116 dB dynamic range input processing and just came out a few months ago. Now would like to demo the latest Oticon, speced at 9.5 kHz and 113 dB; and the latest Phonak Marvel that just came out speced at 8 kHz and 111 dB. Of course I anticipate the latest just out Phonak Marvel will perform even better than the 2015 Phonak Audeo model I demod!
 

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My last hearing test was actually last week. Results are profoundly deaf in right ear & severe hearing loss in left ear. The hearing loss in the right ear was due to a brain tumor, to get to it haad to go through my ear. I do wear hearing aids, Costco, around $1800. Did try other brands audiologist sold or recommended they were anywhere from $4k to $6k. I can still hear but only if up loud, like TV volume control at 98 or any volume indicator up pretty. My neighbor one said you sure like to listen to music LOUD. I can hear it when I go get my mail.
In my particular case, my hearing loss didnt stem from loud exposure to music at the source, although i have attended my fair share of concerts in my younger days, but more of from disease.
Late life hearing loss, is absolutely the worst and most depressing. Mine started around 50, I'm 63 now. It really socially isolates you, in order to hear something, I have to turn the volume up so loud, its uncomfortable for others. Most TV's do not have a way of outputting sound to the tv sets speakers and something external. I go to a movie, I really cant understand it, it could be a silent pic for me. Going out to eat, most dining places are noisy, I cant understand anything at all. I need a really quite place, to hear. Plus sometimes you are concentrating on hearing so much, you miss whats actually being said. Plus walking through a Costco or Publix, its pretty much quiet is very freaky.
When I'm doing yoga, constantly tinkering with my hearing aids. Turning them up for standing poses and down or ff for floor poses to avoid feedback, so it impacts my practice.
$75K worth of audio gear, sits unused most of the time. The bulk of my listening is thru a couple of SONOS 1, that I can place right near me ears.
The best sound I get is from Trekz Air headphones paired up with my iphone
But I'll tell you this much, even with my crappy hearing, I can still tell what sounds good. I can go to friends homes, listen to OTB sound bars & subwoofers, surrounds etc. but when i get home, fire up the Theta & Aerial gear it does sound better. Just so frigging loud
 

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Discussion Starter #92 (Edited)
As of today I am now demoing the Oticon OPN-1 HAs. Speced at 113 dB dynamic range and 9.5 kHz frequency extension. This will be interesting.
 
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As of today I am now demoing the Oticon UPN HAs. Speced at 113 dB dynamic range and 0.5 kHz frequency extension. This will be interesting.
I don't think you mean 0.5?
 

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Discussion Starter #95 (Edited)

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FWIW:

I grew up in L.A., and from my teens thru my 20s spent waaaaayy too much of my time in clubs and at concerts, all with punishingly loud (some ear-bleed) sound levels. I was, however, somehow smart enough to be fiercely protective of my hearing from the very beginning: right before going into any club/concert, I would tear a 1" wide strip off a square of toilet paper and tightly pack one in each ear. Everything was pleasantly muffled. Sometimes not that easy to hear people talking, though....

I went to the Chinese theater in Hollywood a couple of times recently where the previews were ear-shatteringly loud. I quickly made a beeline for the restroom to make my earplugs; with them in the sound was just right. I marveled, though, at how it didn't seem to bother anyone else in the theater, or if it did how they just put up with it. Didn't see anyone with their fingers in their ears.

Anyway, I haven't had my hearing tested lately, but a few years ago I was able to hear a 'mosquito' ringtone on a cellphone, so I think my hearing's pretty good. An ounce of prevention.....
 

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Discussion Starter #98
I think my hearing may have changed a bit in the positive direction even without hearing aids recently. In listening to test tones, 8 kHz was perhaps about half of 6 kHz, and I couldn't hear 10 kHz. Now, 8 kHz is closer to 6 kHz, and I can hear 10 kHz at abut half of 8 or 6 kHz. Why?

I think I know the answer. It will surprise you. I was just hospitalized from Thursday - Monday for a ruptured appendix. A drain was inserted, appendix not removed yet, the abdominal bugs identified and IV antibiotics given. Since hospital release, I report daily for a dose of IV antibiotics. I follow up with doctors (Infectious Disease, General Surgeon, Primary Care). The drain will be removed AFTER the CT scan confirms all the gook is gone from my abdomen AND lab work confirms infection eradicated. Here's the catch. I think my appendix ruptured like 18 months ago. This is when I moved all components off three racks, moved racks away from the wall, and my custom installer installed my in ceiling Dolby Atmos/DTS-X speakers. Install completed Thursday. Friday I put everything back. An hour or two later, I got real sick, nausea, throwing up, with abdominal pain moving over to right side, next to my right hip replacement, severely. I laid in bed and couldn't move, the pain was so bad with any movement. I got up in the morning maybe 50% better, and as I got out of bed, I had a terribly painful muscle spasm at the right upper thigh, I could see the muscle spasming and moving down the right upper leg. I assumed I did too much physical activity, and in a few days I was fully recovered. Over the next 18 months, I had occasional (about every several months) flareups of some pain at right abdomen which went away in a few days. My family doctor a few times wrote this off as muscle spasm (I'm ditching him for sure, he never ordered tests, and 10 days ago saw me and did nothing). About two weeks ago symptoms came back and did not go away, hence I ended up in the ER last Thursday. By the way, when I initially reported to the ER, my temperature and blood pressure were in normal range. The ER doctor said she had seen this once before, where the patient was very strong and walled off and controlled the infection from a burst appendix for some time! For some time I have had some headaches daily, particularly watching movies/tv or reading. Since they administered antibiotics in the hospital, the headaches have practically disappeared. Right now I feel better than ever! But I surmise this may have affected my hearing at least some.

I will continue to demo hearing aids, and when I select a pair to buy, I will ask my Audiologist to give me a new hearing test first, to see if the results differ from earlier at all, and then to program the hearing aids for my then current hearing loss!

I am wondering if I should be in Ripley's Believe It Or Not! However, I can only surmise when my appendix ruptured, I don't have actual medical proof!
 
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I think my hearing may have changed a bit in the positive direction even without hearing aids recently. In listening to test tones, 8 kHz was perhaps about half of 6 kHz, and I couldn't hear 10 kHz. Now, 8 kHz is closer to 6 kHz, and I can hear 10 kHz at abut half of 8 or 6 kHz. Why?

I think I know the answer. It will surprise you. I was just hospitalized from Thursday - Monday for a ruptured appendix. A drain was inserted, appendix not removed yet, the abdominal bugs identified and IV antibiotics given. Since hospital release, I report daily for a dose of IV antibiotics. I follow up with doctors (Infectious Disease, General Surgeon, Primary Care). The drain will be removed AFTER the CT scan confirms all the gook is gone from my abdomen AND lab work confirms infection eradicated. Here's the catch. I think my appendix ruptured like 18 months ago. This is when I moved all components off three racks, moved racks away from the wall, and my custom installer installed my in ceiling Dolby Atmos/DTS-X speakers. Install completed Thursday. Friday I put everything back. An hour or two later, I got real sick, nausea, throwing up, with abdominal pain moving over to right side, next to my right hip replacement, severely. I laid in bed and couldn't move, the pain was so bad with any movement. I got up in the morning maybe 50% better, and as I got out of bed, I had a terribly painful muscle spasm at the right upper thigh, I could see the muscle spasming and moving down the right upper leg. I assumed I did too much physical activity, and in a few days I was fully recovered. Over the next 18 months, I had occasional (about every several months) flareups of some pain at right abdomen which went away in a few days. My family doctor a few times wrote this off as muscle spasm (I'm ditching him for sure, he never ordered tests, and 10 days ago saw me and did nothing). About two weeks ago symptoms came back and did not go away, hence I ended up in the ER last Thursday. By the way, when I initially reported to the ER, my temperature and blood pressure were in normal range. The ER doctor said she had seen this once before, where the patient was very strong and walled off and controlled the infection from a burst appendix for some time! For some time I have had some headaches daily, particularly watching movies/tv or reading. Since they administered antibiotics in the hospital, the headaches have practically disappeared. Right now I feel better than ever! But I surmise this may have affected my hearing at least some.

I will continue to demo hearing aids, and when I select a pair to buy, I will ask my Audiologist to give me a new hearing test first, to see if the results differ from earlier at all, and then to program the hearing aids for my then current hearing loss!

I am wondering if I should be in Ripley's Believe It Or Not! However, I can only surmise when my appendix ruptured, I don't have actual medical proof!
Not that uncommon. The body has a way of protecting itself and in such a case most likely caused a loculation and walling off of the infected area. Many people can walk around for some time without realizing their precarious position. That infection could have easily seeded upwards into the liver causing hepatic abscesses a potentially fatal disease if not caught early. They probably put you on a high dose of Rocephin and flagyl which would cover the usual players. That said, considering your symptoms I would have ordered an ultrasound early on which is noninvasive with no radiation plus if you experienced pain when they were pushing on the area this would have alerted us to do a further workup. Months later when you were feeling fine bloodwork would have essentially come back normal. Glad you're feeling better. Happy New Year!!!
 

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Not that uncommon. The body has a way of protecting itself and in such a case most likely caused a loculation and walling off of the infected area. Many people can walk around for some time without realizing their precarious position. That infection could have easily seeded upwards into the liver causing hepatic abscesses a potentially fatal disease if not caught early. They probably put you on a high dose of Rocephin and flagyl which would cover the usual players. That said, considering your symptoms I would have ordered an ultrasound early on which is noninvasive with no radiation plus if you experienced pain when they were pushing on the area this would have alerted us to do a further workup. Months later when you were feeling fine bloodwork would have essentially come back normal. Glad you're feeling better. Happy New Year!!!
Yes - Within weeks after the first bout I saw my family doctor and mentioned this and he did nothing! Fortunately all seems to be well and my surgeon took out the drain this afternoon!!!!

Now, back to hearing aids, or adverse health affecting hearing as well!
 
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