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Award For Most Amazing Hi-Def Images I've Seen Goes To...

9647 Views 59 Replies 31 Participants Last post by  dprharrison
.....The new Pioneer PDP-615PRO 61" Plasma.


Wow!


I stood there glued to the spot in front of this thing today watching the familiar Hi-Def loops from our local provider. I've seen High Def on some very nice Front Projectors, on most of the plasmas and top consumer direct views, on most of the top LCDs, LCD/DLP/CRT Rear Projection Sets etc. But for me this was the finest HD experience I've had.


I'd mentioned in my Pioneer 5th gen "report" thread that this panel looked promising, but I'd only seen it an hour after it was set up. At that point it looked a little washed out. Judging from today they must have calibrated it or switched to an alternate picture setting because it looked like a new beast. The colors were punchy and rich, yet natural and not exaggerated.

(Although I saw room for further tweaking). The image was creamy smooth - very little noise - and very impressive in clarity. The black levels looked surprisingly good as well.


I compared the image to the various Pioneer plasmas (43"/50" PDP and 4th gen Pro models on display), as well as to all the tube sets, LCDs, DLPs etc. All playing the same feed. The Pioneer 61" just swamped them all in almost every parameter. Despite it's size it looked at least as sharp as the Pioneer 50" model and actually richer in color, with deeper black levels. I'm guessing this must be attributed to the fact the 61" model is based on the 61" NEC model. NEC has often been the plasma brand with some of the better black levels in the industry, not quite as deep as Panasonic but better than Pioneer etc. This really appeared to be the case (as best I could ascertain under the conditions). It really was richer and deeper looking than the 50" panel on that count. And if you've seen the Pioneer 50" models you can imagine the impact a 61" image that is just as sharp but richer and deeper might have. Jaw dropping.


I also found the colors on the display to look more natural than the all-Pioneer-manufactured models (I know, Pioneer bought NEC, but..), rich but not over the top. NEC is known for just that type of color reproduction - color has been one of NEC's strong suits for years. It's hard to know how much of the NEC character I was seeing, vs what Pioneer has brought into the electronics/software of this panel. I believe MarkRubin has the big NEC so it would be interesting for him to see the Pioneer's take on it, to see what if anything Pioneer has brought to the table vs what Mark sees at home.


First there were the loops of CSI and all the Prime Time dramas in Hi-Def.

Looking at shots of actors in the streets of NY (I think it was NY) was like looking through a big store window onto the streets of that city. The image looked solid, smooth, clear - I could read signs down the street, cars in foreground and background passing by was like looking down a city street.


The film-based material was really clear, but still looked appropriately film-like, just missing that last bit of clarity in terms of ultimate realism in some shots.


Then the footage of Thailand came on, shot on Hi-Def cameras. OMG. The clarity and you-are-there realism took another leap. Even under store lighting the dimensionality and realism of color was mind-blowing - the vivid costumes, jewelry and exotic settings jumped off the screen. Sumptuously clear and believably dimensional, as when the camera circled dancing Thai girls. The close-ups were incredible - like you could barely ask for more in an image, in terms of any parameter you want to talk about. I only wished I could have seen the images in lower lighting, which would likely result in even more apparent detail and dimensionality.

And I wish I could see what it does with DVDs. Maybe some day. It looked surprisingly good with SD last time I saw it.


While I usually see pluses and minuses between each display in a store, I found nothing held a candle to the experience and sheer sensuous images that big panel produced.


It has always seemed to me that plasma, at it's best, has the potential for the purest, most natural viewing experience. It doesn't suffer the see-through, reflected image effect of front projected images, nor the beamy, uneven brightness and rear-projected look of RPTVs, nor the size limitations and geometry issues of direct views, nor the uneven brightness and shifting luminance of LCDs. While each of those technologies have certain strengths over plasma, each of those signature effects are, I find, a noticeable departure from the experience of seeing real-life objects.


Plasma, while not the strongest perhaps in any one category, has that combination of life-like clarity, perfect geometry, perfectly even illumination from any angle, natural light quality...on balance plasma removes more of the artificial, electronic signatures to an image than any other display type.


I admit I'm stalking some of these giant plasmas. Whenever I watch movies on a front projection system I come home with image-size lust.

My 42" plasma is pretty much the perfect size for it's room and I keep wondering where else I could one day put a projection system. But I don't necessarily have "image quality lust" with the projectors because, as I said, there's something very addictive and special and "alive" about plasma images. So these giant plasmas, which offer a cinematic size with that plasma-thang quality are as seductive as heck. I can't wait to see Panasonic's mega 65" plasma.


Over 'n out.
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Great review.

How much for this beast? Maybe this level of PQ can be had for under $3000 in 5 years? One can wish I guess.
Hi Rich-


Is the set your referring to the same as the new 61" Elite Pro 1410 HD?


Thanks/cbd
This message makes me very curious to see the new NEC consumer/commercial models that have recently been released. With the increased color depth, decent blacks, and increased panel life, they seem to look good (on paper, at least). I've also read great things from the owners here.


Some of the most impressive plasmas I've ever seen were the 42 and 50 inch XBR950 models from Sony, both based on NEC glass. These observations coupled with what Rich just wrote make me believe that NEC's own plasmas may be worth strongly considering (assuming they live up to the iterations built by their competitors based on their technology). I just wish I could actually SEE them somewhere.


Great review as always, Rich...
Ohji - I picked the Toshiba 42HP83 over the Panny's partially for the HD but also because the picture quality seemd pretty comparable to the Panny HD's. Maybe the NEC glass was part of that perception?
Great review Rich


I have the Fujitsu P63 (glass by Samsung) which I still love:


I will try to locate a Pioneer 61 and check it out :)
Rich

You're like a kid in a candy shop, and you make us want to be one too. Don't ever stop. Great review. Thanks.



GO SOX
Here's the MSRP:


"The PDP-615PRO "PureVision" high-definition monitor for home use will be offered at a suggested retail price of 1,869,000 yen (included tax)." (source)

Who has got the current conversion from yen to $.


Something tells me Toronto, must be a hotbed for HDTV, I don't know how R Harkness always gets to see new units first!:)


As for NEC - here's the only place I've seen their models:
(Consumer Plasma Models) or (Business Plasma Models) or (LCD Consumer or Business Models)
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Wow. Sure wish I had room for one of those..


Rich, have you seen the PRO920HD yet? I'm about ready to pull the trigger on that one.
Quote:
Originally posted by markrubin
Great review Rich


I have the Fujitsu P63 (glass by Samsung) which I still love:
Doh! I hit forty and it's all downhill. The younger part of my brain was tugging the older part saying "Hey buddy, doesn't he have a Fujitsu?" I'm doubtless one dying brain cell away from wandering off into traffic in my pajamas looking for my grade one best friend. If I disappear from the forum for a while, someone call 911.


Boy it must be fun watching the Fujitsu! Are you intrigued by the new 65" Panasonic?


Who is it here whose been discussing their big NEC?

Quote:
Originally posted by markrubin I will try to locate a Pioneer 61 and check it out :)
Maybe it was some conjunction of a great feed with the Pioneer that blew me away. But it was the same loop I've seen on countless displays and I've never seen it look more impressive.


The nearby Hitachi 55 also looked terrific - it's in a couple of our stores. In fact previous to the Pioneer it had startled me with among the best HD images with the same HD source. But the Pioneer seemed to do it all, only bigger.


I did notice that the Pioneer looked more like the Sony 61" than Pioneer's typical look. And the Sony uses the NEC glass too, right? It does seem that the basic glass or basic panel contributes a lot to the image, despite manufacturers always saying "It's a total re-design."
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Quote:
Originally posted by cbd0815
Hi Rich-


Is the set your referring to the same as the new 61" Elite Pro 1410 HD?


Thanks/cbd
Frankly I can't keep all these model numbers juggled in my head. The Pioneer I'm describing is their latest 5th generation model, based on NEC glass. Just hitting stores now. To get the model number I just looked at the on-line Pioneer Oct. press release which stated the new 61" was called the PDP-615PRO.
Yes the Sony uses NEC glass


I have the Fujitsu 55 in my office: beautiful display for a brightly lit room: HD is excellent but black levels/ CR are not as good


The big plasmas have a "wow factor" all their own simply by their size and how good they look with HD sources


My next area of interest is 1920x1080 HD LCD displays: I ordered a Sharp LC45GX6U and hope to have it in a few days:


imagine when 60 and 70" high resolution 1920x1080 LCD's become mainstream products at a reasonable price :)
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Quote:
Originally posted by doobie
Wow. Sure wish I had room for one of those..


Rich, have you seen the PRO920HD yet? I'm about ready to pull the trigger on that one.
No, but did you see my "review" of it's 50" big brother? Very impressive. I'd expect that the 43" version would perform essentially the same.
Quote:
Originally posted by markrubin
Yes the Sony uses NEC glass


I have the Fujitsu 55 in my office: beautiful display for a brightly lit room: HD is excellent but black levels/ CR are not as good


The big plasmas have a "wow factor" all their own simply by their size and how good they look with HD sources
Yup. BTW, a local place has the big Fujitsu too which I've often seen playing HD. I've spun a DVD or two on it as well. I'm not sure what they are doing to that display there, but I found there to be noticeably more noise and digital blockiness to picture details on that particular unit. Whereas the Pioneer seemed really clean. What is your experience with the Fujitsu, in terms of image clarity/scaling/noise?

Quote:
Originally posted by markrubin My next area of interest is 1920x1080 HD LCD displays: I ordered a Sharp LC45GX6U and hope to have it in a few days:
I understand your fascination. Some things about the newer LCD flat screens blow me away. The sheer clarity and "directness," as I call it, is something those displays have almost all to themselves. At least in bright lighting.
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" BTW, a local place has the big Fujitsu too which I've often seen playing HD. I've spun a DVD or two on it as well. I'm not sure what they are doing to that display there, but I found there to be noticeably more noise and digital blockiness to picture details on that particular unit. Whereas the Pioneer seemed really clean. What is your experience with the Fujitsu, in terms of image clarity/scaling/noise? "


I have been really pleased with the P63: it is as good as the P50 in every respect except perhaps black levels are not quite as good.


Keep in mind with a much larger plasma you have to increase your viewing distance accordingly
Cool, Mark.


Wow. Fujitsu 63", 55" plasma and a Sharp LCD on the way. Someday you'll have to send your private jet to pick me up at my shack, so I can visit your secret island paradise to see all these toys properly calibrated and deployed. :)
His "secret island paradise" is New Jersey.


No offense Mark, but "paradise" and "new Jersey" shouldn't be in the same sentenence, IMHO. :)


Nice review Rich...so when you getting one? You know it's been a while since you bought a new digital display.
Okay,so now all Pioneer plasmas being released should have this pq if they all use the same glass?I already have the 433cmx but in a few years i was going for a 50 panny but now this changes everything.
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