[TJEli]

Ok guys...


I have gotten some excellent info from some of you and I appreciate it very much. I have been modeling and pouring over data for these 2 drivers all day. I would like to hear your arguments for which one you would go with in this situation.....


plenty of eq to work with.

1000WRMS to the driver

~ 80L of sealed box volume

Sub will be crossed over at 80hz and my mains are run "large" and are strong from 40hz up.

I am most concerned with a stong linear output from 30hz down to 10hz because this setup is mostly used for movies.


The 2 drivers are:


TC Sounds TC-2000 15" DVC

Adire Brahma IV 15" DVC


Cost aside, which would you choose to meet the above criteria?


Also (excuse me for being dumb) what an L/T? Is it an eq circuit?


Thanks for the help everyone,


-Eli

 

[Vinculum]

I've recently been intrigued by Adire's drivers (thanks to Bosso!) I'm considering a couple Tumults to run below my mains.


Here's 2 things that caught my attention


1. The low Le coil.... won't tapper off on the upper end. Might not matter to you if you are mostly concerned with the low end.

2. XBL Linear motor technology. No linear motor on the TC-2000


3 year warrentee on Adire vs. 5 year motor/1 year top assembly on TC. Kind of a toss up!


I hope you are planning on atleast 2 drivers to get "spirited" performance at 10Hz!



Good Luck deciding... its probably harder to do than building the sub!


Dr V

 

[Willd]

He is planning to use an 80Hz xover, so the higher Le is irrelevant.

 

[Vinculum]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Willd /forum/post/0


He is planning to use an 80Hz xover, so the higher Le is irrelevant.

It probably wont be, as I've already said. However I thought it was worth mentioning as plans can change, drivers cannot. Once you buy it, you've gotta work with what you got. The smart thing to do is ask questions before purchasing anything, and thats what he's doing. I myself would like the flexibilty to change to a higher crossover without worrying about an upper rolloff and having to use taboo EQ boost to fix it. It might not really matter with either driver as there are many variables, but its worth the time to pause and think about.


Dr V

 

[Willd]

You're correct, but I'd bet that the TC-2K would work fine with a 100Hz xover as well.


I'd get the SVC and not the DVC, though.

 

[TJEli]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinculum /forum/post/0


I hope you are planning on atleast 2 drivers to get "spirited" performance at 10Hz!


Dr V

I am planning on 2. (2 seperate enclosures)


A few things I have noticed....


The TC-2000 reaches its excursion limits at about 15hz with 800W in my model.

The Adire is still below its limits at 1000W

The Adire has a lower F3 by about 10hz

The TC-2000 is a couple db stronger from 20hz to 10hz.


They both have their advantages and disadvantages.


Wild, why would you go with the SVC? The DVC would allow the amp to see ~ 2 ohm nominal load.


If the Adire would model as well as the TC-2000 below 20hz this would be an easier decision.


Thanks for all the help guys,


-Eli

 

[Willd]

why do you need a 2ohm load?


Also note the xmax is not the final excursion limit. The TC2k is capable of up to 38mm mechanical excursion.

 

[Jose_L]

Have you considered 2 - 15" tumults ?


I'm also looking a similiar sub like yours. ie. 2 - 15" drivers.


I was originally looking at a single 18" LMS5400 but I'm not show sure because they are so new and expensive.


So I'm looking at 2 - 15" tumults for the same price as 1 - 18"LMS ..


My initial prices brings a 18" LMS/2-tumult w/ amp and eq to about $2300 ..


But a 2 driver Brahama w/ amp & eq would be about $1800 ..


I have to factor $500 for a cab. guy to build the box either way..


So I'm trying to get as much info on making this decision as you are.


Is it worth the extra $500 to go to the LMS or Dual Tumults ?? anyone. ?


Question for all.


Do you have to sum the internal vol. when using dual drivers OR can you fudge the volume ? ie. 1.5 x 3^ft = 4.5 vs 6^ft


Regards,

Jose

 

[TJEli]

I am also wondering if these 2 drivers will work equally well in a ported alignment if I decide to experiment some day.


I have made the first round of purchases towards this project so I need to make a decision on drivers very soon.


-Eli

 

[thylantyr]

Cost aside, which would you choose to meet the above criteria?

TC Sounds vs. Adire


You can make a good subwoofer with either product. Flip a coin.

10hz - 30hz for movies


Is there real estate issues that limit the design to a 3 cu. ft. sealed box? If not,

look at a big ported subwoofer, it may be the lesser of the evils design for your

applicaiton.

 

[thylantyr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_L /forum/post/0


Is it worth the extra $500 to go to the LMS or Dual Tumults ?? anyone. ?

What is your subwoofer goal? What amps will you use? There are pros/cons

for using a single monster woofers vs. multiple woofers.


* If you have real estate limitations, a single monster woofer might be the only choice if you want the best.


* If you have real estate for multiple subwoofers, then this is probably a good

choice because


a. if you break one woofer, the other one is still working. Cost to repair or

to replace is cheaper than replacing the monster woofer if you damage it.


b. more subwoofers as a group working together can make the load on

each woofer less.


c. you may need to look at the amplifier issue with multiple subs, you may

need more to drive more subs.


As far as box volume, you can do whatever you want, just model the woofer

to get a ballpark idea on performance. If you want to use multiple woofers

in a subwoofer and you have no space restrictions, use one woofer per

subwoofer box vs. two woofers in the same subwoofer box. The seperate

subwoofers allow you can place each subwoofer in different locations in the

room for best sound, plus the box weights less which is easier to move around

the house. If you do make two subs in one box, I'd make two seperate chambers.

 

[TJEli]

I just ordered a couple of the Brahma 15D4s from Acoustic Visions. I guess I made my decision. I hope it was a good one because that was a chunk of change.


-Eli

 

[Willd]

You made Bosso proud..

 

[Jose_L]

Why D4's ? how many amps will you have ?


How will you wire them ? what ohm load are you targeting ?


For me I'd try to stick to 4 ohms, simply because the EP2500 doesn't look like it likes 2 ohm loads.. ie. w/ a D2 you'd wire in series for a 4 ohm load, then run each off a channel of the EP2500..


But I guess you could wire the D4's in parallel and still get the 4ohm load..


thylander,


I'm sort of limited to a single box in the 4-7^ft (internal) size.


I definitely want a sealed box w/ a EP2500 & DEQ2496/QSC DSP-30 EQ.


So looking at what's available I'm left w/ either:


1 - 18" LMS5400

2 - 15" tumults

2 - 15" brahma's


I plan on using a 60hz xover.. and it's 50/50 music/HT application in a 4400cu ft room.. no corner loading because of door locations.


Ofcourse the LMS would be the smallest enclosure, but it's un-tested/reviewed by DIYers.. so who know how it really performs.


Regards,

Jose

 

[kramskoi]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jose_L /forum/post/0


Why D4's ? how many amps will you have ?


How will you wire them ? what ohm load are you targeting ?


For me I'd try to stick to 4 ohms, simply because the EP2500 doesn't look like it likes 2 ohm loads.. ie. w/ a D2 you'd wire in series for a 4 ohm load, then run each off a channel of the EP2500..


But I guess you could wire the D4's in parallel and still get the 4ohm load..


thylander,


I'm sort of limited to a single box in the 4-7^ft (internal) size.


I definitely want a sealed box w/ a EP2500 & DEQ2496/QSC DSP-30 EQ.


So looking at what's available I'm left w/ either:


1 - 18" LMS5400

2 - 15" tumults

2 - 15" brahma's


I plan on using a 60hz xover.. and it's 50/50 music/HT application in a 4400cu ft room.. no corner loading because of door locations.


Ofcourse the LMS would be the smallest enclosure, but it's un-tested/reviewed by DIYers.. so who know how it really performs.


Regards,

Jose

hello Jose, sent you an email...


i'd say if you're going the Adire route, go with Tumults if possible...2x15 would be strong...you should be able to get away with 7ft3...i had one in a 3.3ft3...your qtc. should come in around .65 and of course you could stuff it lower than that...but you'll lose a little output...


remember, we demo'd War of the Worlds with the ep2500 and she never shut down...saw a little clipping but it has continued to perform admirably, given my penchant for sinewave theatrics...tough little amp...i'm wired at 1.4 ohms per channel and it goes about its business anyway...i'll move it to the second box after i receive the QSC in a few days...

 

[TJEli]

The reason I bought D4s is because I am going to run a Crown XLS 602 for power with an SMS-1 in front of it for eq duty.


The 602 is rated for 840 WRMS per channel into a 2 ohm load. According to adire, in an 80L sealed alignment, it takes 800W to drive a Brahma 15 to XMAX.


-Eli

 

[Vinculum]

Congrats on your purchase TJEli. For some reason I keep thinking you used to be an SVS man?


I hope to see some pics and impressions of your project. I'm also curious to see if you get the logos on your dustcaps, like the older Brahmas.



Dr V

 

[Willd]



Quote:
Congrats on your purchase TJEli. For some reason I keep thinking you used to be an SVS man?

It doesn't matter what he used to be, since he is now a DIY guy. And well know they're the coolest...

 

[TJEli]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinculum /forum/post/0


Congrats on your purchase TJEli. For some reason I keep thinking you used to be an SVS man?


I hope to see some pics and impressions of your project. I'm also curious to see if you get the logos on your dustcaps, like the older Brahmas.



Dr V

ROFL,


I am still an SVS man, and a JL man, ect. ect.


I am taking a little side trip back to my DIY days and putting some money in the bank while doing it. (sold some other equipment)


It's a hobby and I am always looking for something new to play with. This time I am trying some DIY because of what I believe will be a good performance per $$ ratio. We had our first child in October and I am cutting back a lot of my spending.


-Eli

 

[Vinculum]

Hehehe... I thought I remembered seeing your website with a few SVS tubes sitting around.


I admit, I'm an SVS man too, looking to DIY. Damn, this is starting to sound like an AA meeting!

I'd love a pair of the new Ultras, but I fear for $3000 (or whatever a pair would cost) I can do MUCH better and not have to wait 6 months.


2 Tumults or 4 Brahmas... Theres a tough one to decide! I'll be racking my brain and making a million models. By then I'll probably go with something else. Bah!


Dr V