[CINERAMAX]

Yes guys, it has been the most tortured 10 days of my life worrying that the 6101 would in some ways be less spectacular than the 5002.


Well expect every magazine to crown this Baby King Of The Hill. Adios 50 inchers for good.


Black Levels are terrific. The AVM seems improved in picture controls.


No need to seat farther than 7 feet away! This I did not expect.


It even looks good at 4 feet, although you can see pixels. Which are slightly bigger than the 50" but with 5-10% less fill factor. No need to move the seats back , basically.


Projection TV is obsolete under 10 feet wide for me.


The gamma settings have been re-named including two settings named real1 real2. Didn't I label Dynamic 1 and 3 something like that when I first opened up the shop? Is it a coincidence or should I be honored, Trainer Dave, ?!


This is the Plasma to Own. It has exceeded every expectation.


Thank God!


Go see this beauty, and grab the remote.

http://www.groveplasma.com/Sidewalk.jpg
http://www.groveplasma.com/Cove.jpg http://www.groveplasma.com/Paris-015.jpg

 

[doody]

a VERY interesting picture, dude


do we know if they've fixed the DVI "issues" on the 61" unit?


doody.

 

[CINERAMAX]

The lisa will work with it as well as the British pc card. I suspect more cards will come on line.


There is a removable subboard on the input board, that looks to me that could be the way to upgrade to HDCP, whatever.


When Fed component either 480i dvd or 1080i from the Zenith this thing looks like a teranex demo with double stacks vidikrons.


NOTE> The set does seem to come calibrated from the factory.


The rgb settings on the user mode are no longer 255,255,255 but very close to the calibrated settings per C Plavin on the 5002. Of course this is a different beast . But it is interesting to see similar values for the calibrated settings.

 

[doody]

so the answer is "no, they haven't fixed the DVI problem, though you can spend extra money elsewhere to have it fixed for you."


hopefully these guys will get a clue sometime soon.


are they at least informing people in the marketing materials for the 61" that their DVI implementation is broken?



doody.

 

[oferlaor]

Cineramax, whatever you did to those images - you really need to redo it. The pictures look pixelated - use JPEGs, not GIFs.

 

[llogan]

Three words WAR - RUN - TEE

 

[ghibliss]

According to knowledgeable sources the Fujistsu DVI input has nothing wrong with it! The problem is that each manufacturer is utilizng a different DVI format as there is not a defacto standard that anyone is adhering to at this point in time. This is what the Leeza corrects for in its processor.


Regarding calibrated RGB values in the user settings of the 50" vs 61" there is no correlation between these two panels for RGB settings. The 50" uses Panasonic Glass and the 61" uses NEC glass. They both have entirely different phosphors being used and certainly require different Gamma look-up-tables to arrive at proper color settings.


The Progressive Labs CA-1 color analyzer provides specific calibration files for both of these panels so that they may be optimized properly when calibrated. The files instruct the analyzer as to what the primary coordinates for each of the RGB phosphors are to insure calibration accuracy.


To enjoy your plasma display properly you should have it dialed in with a color analyzer as the difference that it makes is considerable to the picture quality. Alan/Jason offer the CA-1 analyzer on the forum which is currently available through a Power-Buy for those that are interested.

 

[CINERAMAX]

Yes Cliff,


Thanks for the DVI explanation.


We agree with your point re the need for actual calibration. The user setting comes in with lower Green and Blue settings, that is all.


Cliff please email me my setting that I lost. Thanks



Two words: Sheep-Skate . Just Kidding!

 

[IUnknown]

CINERAMAX, can I borrow like $17K?

 

[CINERAMAX]

Sell the Porsche!

 

[jlm]

not to be a stick in the mud, but can Cineramax do his thing here on this internet forum and not violate the sacred Fujitsu doctrine?

 

[rogo]

He is not selling anything here. He is talking as a dealer who sells through his store. I have to tell you that Fujitsu's policy of restricting distribution is fine to a point. If someone they were to revoke Peter's dealer privileges for discussing the display here, they would be so far over the line it is not even the least bit humorous.


So feel free to bash Fujitsu if you wish, but I think the new policy is wildly misunderstood. If any attempt is made to muzzle dealers who speak here without any intent to sell, however, then I will not only join the bashing, I will see to it that this becomes a national freedom of speech issue.


Mark

 

[jlm]

there is an active thread specifically about fujitsu, internet use, dealers, etc and the topic is hot. to quote from that thread:


""You can say that you sell Fujitsu if your website is aimed at the local customer. Like ours. " (quoted from Cineramax)


I am sorry, but from what I have been told...you can not even mention them on the site. No line-list mention, no info on product. If you are on the web...you are not just "local". They are looking to stop any traffic you could bring from somewhere else.


Thus if you are on the web...you are not just local. For I could find you on the web as a dealer then call you and say I would like unit X and you could say sure! (Not that you would...but could.) It is realy easy to say OK when you have $15000 order you are looking at. (again...not that you personally would.)


My .02



__________________

David Bott

AVS Forum Admin "



regarding Rogo's words:

"...but I think the new policy is wildly misunderstood. If any attempt is made to muzzle dealers who speak here without any intent to sell, however, then I will not only join the bashing, I will see to it that this becomes a national freedom of speech issue. "


i've got no personal problem with fujitsu or cineramax' web policies, but it seems like C is sticking his neck out.

 

[CINERAMAX]

Substance over form.


I have my house in order. The moderators have access to my PM's as well.


If I sell through the internet let the axe fall.


Well deserved Publicity and new knoledge.


IE. How far do you have to seat from a refernece 61" plasma?


This new guy , DEN had it right! No farther away than a 50" on High Def.


And John you just lost your 16.5 % discount!


Just Kidding there was no such thing!

 

[ericbee]

Back to the topic at hand.


I had no questions whatsoever that Cineramax would love the 61", I mean come on was there even a chance he wouldn't't regardless of how it looked?


I actually considered buying it or the NEC 61, that is until I saw it. Wow, it looked bad, so bad that I decided to keep my 50" and pass until the technology evolved and resolution increased. A plasma that is 60" or more with the same resolution as a 50" CANNOT look as good, each pixel is being blown up over 20% in size!


Here's a test to challenge Mr Cineramax. Anyone with a 50" plasma, stand 7 feet from your display and see if you can make out pixel structure. If you are critical you can. Now move 20% closer, about 1 big step and you bet you can see pixels. In any event, I saw it here in NYC at Innovative and at 10 feet it looked like hell, grainy, soft and plenty of pixel structure like postage stamps. (yes, that's an exaggeration)


I guess you people have to see for yourselves, no way me and C can be that far off. Either he is a Fujitsu pusher or I am a Fujitsu hater and I am no hater.


I didn't bother with DVI, I knew the story but I didn't notice any offensive fan noise on the 60" I saw, just offensive image quality.

 

[CINERAMAX]

The Fujitsu blew the Marantz 61 out of the water. Everyone that has seen it says it is mind boggling.


The picture with the zenith is superb. The 5002 pale by comparison. When you lean the plasma against the wall, I can hear the fans resonating at lower frequencies otherwise I cannot. So I think the way these plasmas mount on the Callisto stands REDUCE the SPL of the fans somehow.


I believe Eric that you would be thrilled with this pic q. and suggest you take a second look, with the zenith, and do ask for the remote.


This is so much better than projection.

 

[Brett]

Nice pics!


Just a small question...


Were the 2 displays on different walls? I couldn't help but notice that the wall around the 50 incher is quite lit up, whereas it appears that the bigger panel is in darker ambiant lighting?


If things just keep on getting better and cheaper from here on, Plasma is starting to look like it's in Joe sixpack's future. For now I'll stick to the beer.

 

[KenLand]

Ericbee,


How can the Fujitsu 61" not have enough pixels when projectors with the same or fewer pixels throw images much larger than this without problems.


I have two XGA projectors - a DLP and a LCD. Either one looks looks fantastically sharp at 60"! (I've set them up just this way to help me decide if I wanted a 50" or 60" TV)


I've spent several hours with the 60" Sony GW and as far as resolution goes its as sharp as a tack! (blacks? well...)


The fujitsu has even more pixels in the same area. Now I haven't seen the 61" (spent an hour or so with the 50") so maybe the pixel structure is visible due the cell walls, but there is no way there are not enough pixels to more than adequately fill 61 little inches.


Ken

 

[doody]

ken - your projector excites pixels at a location a fair distance from the screen - the light spreads during that distance (like a flashlight, or a laser pointer) so it covers up some pixellation. in addition, your screen should seek to help cover up pixellation as well.


so that's a tough comparison. if you want to test to see if you want a 50" plasma - projecting a 50" DLP image isn't a great way to test.


my two pennies.


doody.

 

[ericbee]

Did I ever say it didn't have enough pixels? I went back and checked, no I didn't. I said that it has the same amount of pixels as a 50 inch and by increasing pixel size 20% you lose image quality. The differences in plasma and projectors are technology, where pixels are used in different ways.


In any case, I stand by my statement that I found the Fuji 60 to look soft.