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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
TL;DR version: I currently have both projectors setup in my basement. They are shooting on a bare white wall located 12' away. I have 3 weeks to decide which one to keep before the 30day return policy is up. I am susceptible to rainbows on DLP projectors.

Long winded, NFL has now started and I-cant-wait-any-longer-because-I-need-to-choose-a-projector-right-freaking-now-version: I've been researching a projector for my basement for almost a year now. I was convinced I would just spend top dollar and get the Panny 8000 and be done with it. But as someone familiar with the projector market, I know that newly announced projectors tend to show up between Sept-November of each year. So when the time came to pull that $2500 trigger on the Panny 8K.. I couldn't help but read review after review looking to see what new projectors would be announced for 2013/14. As I begin to read review sites (most ProjectorCentral & ProjectorReviews.com) I couldn't help but take note how great the BenQ W1070 performed with a street price around $900. The AVS thread on the W1070 seems to have many satisfied owners. Even though I've owned a DLP projector almost 10 year ago (Infocus X1 & BenQ 6100) and already knew I was susceptible to seeing rainbows. I just had to satisfy my curiosity to see if the color wheel of new single chip DLP's had improved so much in 10 years that where rainbows would no longer bother me. On paper and through every review I read the BenQ was (and still is) that bang for the buck DLP projector to beat. NFL regular season started on Thursday. So I ordered the W1070 on Tuesday 9/3.. with 2-day free Prime shipping from Amazon it arrived right on time.. Thursday 9/5. Straight out the box, the picture was jaw dropping gorgeous. But I immediately saw flashes of red & green and knew issues with rainbows would continue to haunt me. My girlfriend couldn't see them. So she loved the picture.


Knowing I had 30 day return window, I immediately begin researching LCD projectors in the $1000 range and eventually came across the freshly announced Epson 2030. With the W1070 now a year old and still considered the best bang for the buck, the 2030 is supposed to be Epson's answer to the hotly contested $1000 3D capable 1080P projector category. I did locate review on both major projector review sites saying the Epson 2030 was the next "hot-buy" in this category. But both seemed to be pre-production units and no production units were available for street purchase or review. Literally the day after my W1070 arrived, Amazon informed me that the Epson 2030 was now available for purchase & immediate shipping. So on Friday 9/6 I ordered the 2030, paid an extra $10 bucks for next day shipping.. and the 2030 arrived around 2pm this past Saturday 9/7.


I now have both both units up & running in my basement. They are sitting on a simple table stand and shooting about a 120-130" picture that is 12 feet away. I sit very close to where the projector is located. I have everything running thru a 2013 Yamaha 675 AVR, with my HDMI sources being Fios cable TV, PS3 and several bluray movies, Xbox 360, Apple TV and Google Chrome Cast streaming adapter. So far I've watched a few old Bluray flicks to include the Bourne series, Matrix 1 & 2, Ironman and the cartoon movie Ratatouille. On Verizon Fios cable, I've watched several live college & NFL games. For 3D viewing, I've tuned into ESPN 3D on Verizon Fios cable. I also viewed a few 1080P 3D BR rips that range from 2-3GB in size and have quality of what you can expect for an internet streamed movie.


I plan on keeping both projector for another weekend or two, when I have the free time to view as much material & play a few long rounds of Call of Duty: BlackOps2 before deciding which one to keep. This will be the only display in my basement, so eye fatigue, rainbows and factors like input lag will also play a big part into deciding which unit I will keep. I've flipped between the W1070 and 2030 a few times already have made some notes. Be advised, I'm not at all technical with specs.. have no tools to take any professional measurements and have yet to stray from the default settings on both projectors. I have found a few online calibration notes and have ordered the Disney WOW Blu Ray which will arrive this week. From there I have hope to get things tweaked a little bit and have a better understanding to help judge which unit I would like to keep. As it stands these are things that have jumped out to me:


BenQ W1070 pros:

$900 street price

Better overall picture

More contrast range

Better blacks

More "pop" to colors (especially reds)

Less noise

Denser pixel

"Plasma-like" picture

Included pop off lens cover

Vertical lens shift


BenQ W1070 cons:

Can definitely see rainbows

Eye fatiguing picture when sitting close

Only one adjustable 'foot'

Very slow switching HDMI sources

3D is IR based

Cheap, very basic remote control

1 year warranty



Epson 2030 pros:

$1000 street price

No rainbows!!!

Bigger picture from same distance

Brighter picture

Very relaxing & easy to watch picture

3D is RF based (works with cheap $19 Samsung 3D Full HD glasses)

3D glasses sync up very quickly

Better remote

Better menu system

Built in slide in/slide out lens cover

MHL input

Fast HDMI source switching

All three "feet" are fully adjustable

2-year "best in business" Epson instant swap warranty & service


Epson 2030 cons:

Loud fan noise in Dynamic, Living Room setting. (quieter in Cinema, Natural mode)

Less pixel density. Can definitely see pixels when sitting close to screen.

Black levels very average

Less contrast range

Less color "pop"

Auto 3D detection.. still nees manual selection between side-by-side & top-and-bottom to activate 3D picture and to deactivate it.
 

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Very nice. Thanks for taking the time to write all this up--definitely helpful to those of us like who are still agonizing over which direction to go with our next upgrade. There is no substitution for being able to A/B projectors side-to-side like that. Sounds like you give the BenQ the definitive edge in picture quality but rainbows tip the scale to the Epson for you. How is the 3D on that Epson?
 

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Thanks!


You seem to be looking at similar projectors as me. I've considered the BenQ W1070, Epson 2030 & 5020ub, Panasonic PT-AE8000U, and Optoma HD25e. I've now crossed out all but the Epson 5020ub and Optoma HD25e, but I'm sure something new will come along.


Mine main question is: if you weren't susceptible to rainbows would the BenQ be you choice?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
1) BenQ definitely has the edge in picture quality. If you arent susceptible to rainbows, its the clear winner in my book. Out-the-box better picture, quieter fan noise, $100 bucks cheaper. About the only nagging drawback is how slow it is switching sources. You will be sitting in the dark for up to 30 seconds while its "seeking source". There's even been a few times when its not found the HDMI source. So lets say I'm switcing from Fios cable to Xbox360. The signal from the Xbox never picks up, I have to switch it to another source first.. then switch it back to the Xbox. Or restart the Xbox to get the signal to show up. Happens pretty regularly. Epson doesnt have those issues.


2) Havent tried 3D on W1070 yet. Needs special IR based 3D glasses. I think 144hz or something like that. They are not expensive, just special.. I believe they are $30 on Amazon ( http://www.amazon.com/SainSonic-reg-SSZ-200DLB-Rechargeable-ViewSonic/dp/B0085JBI6S/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1378743117&sr=8-14&keywords=3D+glasses ). If I start leaning more towards to the 1070.. I'll definitely order them to give them a try.


3) Forgot to add the Epson 2030 just feels a year newer and more up to date on little features. It has HDMI control of other devices, so the remote for the Epson will control BR playback. I also like that when the remote turns off the projector it also turns off the AVR. There are absolutely no HDMI handshake issues with the Epson.


4) Will get around to posting some screen shots sometime this week/weekend.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickoakdl  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23716427


Thanks!


You seem to be looking at similar projectors as me. I've considered the BenQ W1070, Epson 2030 & 5020ub, Panasonic PT-AE8000U, and Optoma HD25e. I've now crossed out all but the Epson 5929ub and Optoma HD25e, but I'm sure something new will come along.


Mine main question is: if you weren't susceptible to rainbows would the BenQ be you choice?

Epson 5929ub?
 

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Just didn't want to think there was something I missed.


I just demoed the 5020 at my local shop, but as a helpful member here helped me figure out, the battery was dying on the 3D glasses they gave in the store, so the 3D effect itself looked horrible. The image itself apart from that looked very nice though. It's a lot more expensive than the others listed here, no? Why narrow the field down to that and the Optima and isn't that Optima much cheaper than the Epson as well?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangled Cable  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23716806


Just didn't want to think there was something I missed.


I just demoed the 5020 at my local shop, but as a helpful member here helped me figure out, the battery was dying on the 3D glasses they gave in the store, so the 3D effect itself looked horrible. The image itself apart from that looked very nice though. It's a lot more expensive than the others listed here, no? Why narrow the field down to that and the Optima and isn't that Optima much cheaper than the Epson as well?

I was actually the guy who mentioned that on your previous thread about the batteries dying. I'm going to resume that convo on your thread though so I don't hi-jack his thread.
 

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Too bad about the rainbows - I have the benq w1070 and I haven't seen any rainbows at all (I have about 300 hours on it already). 3d unreal with the benq IMHO with $40 144hz glasses. Friends have commented on it being as good as imax or better.


I have a $250 elite sable white 1.1 gain 100" screen. Are you using a screen or just the wall? I believe that could reduce the rainbows but not positive.


Also - check the firmware version on the benq. 1.06 is where you want to be as far as hdmi switching. They fixed some handshaking issues with that update. Only about 5 seconds of switching sources for me with 1.06 (from 1.05). Huge improvement. Of course, you don't want to do it if you aren't going to buy it, but wanted to let you know it was improved greatly in the update.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by eah9  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23717278


Too bad about the rainbows - I have the benq w1070 and I haven't seen any rainbows at all (I have about 300 hours on it already). 3d unreal with the benq IMHO with $40 144hz glasses. Friends have commented on it being as good as imax or better.


I have a $250 elite sable white 1.1 gain 100" screen. Are you using a screen or just the wall? I believe that could reduce the rainbows but not positive.


Also - check the firmware version on the benq. 1.06 is where you want to be as far as hdmi switching. They fixed some handshaking issues with that update. Only about 5 seconds of switching sources for me with 1.06 (from 1.05). Huge improvement. Of course, you don't want to do it if you aren't going to buy it, but wanted to let you know it was improved greatly in the update.

I agree, firmware 106 has really improved HDMI switching for the 1070. Very few people seem to see rainbows but if you are one of them you have to go for the 2030.
 

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Hi Daekwan,

I am in the same boat as yours. Sensitive to RBE so need to look into LCD. The 2030 is very interesting to me.

Can you tell me the distance from the bottom of the projected image to the center of the lenses without using keystone.

Is the bottom of the image up for down compared to the center of the lenses? I want to know this since I will place the projector on top of my living room table and need the projector to shoot the image up from the center of the lenses.

Thanks

nphan
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daekwan  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23716480


1) BenQ definitely has the edge in picture quality. If you arent susceptible to rainbows, its the clear winner in my book. Out-the-box better picture, quieter fan noise, $100 bucks cheaper. About the only nagging drawback is how slow it is switching sources. You will be sitting in the dark for up to 30 seconds while its "seeking source". There's even been a few times when its not found the HDMI source. So lets say I'm switcing from Fios cable to Xbox360. The signal from the Xbox never picks up, I have to switch it to another source first.. then switch it back to the Xbox. Or restart the Xbox to get the signal to show up. Happens pretty regularly. Epson doesnt have those issues.


2) Havent tried 3D on W1070 yet. Needs special IR based 3D glasses. I think 144hz or something like that. They are not expensive, just special.. I believe they are $30 on Amazon ( http://www.amazon.com/SainSonic-reg-SSZ-200DLB-Rechargeable-ViewSonic/dp/B0085JBI6S/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1378743117&sr=8-14&keywords=3D+glasses ). If I start leaning more towards to the 1070.. I'll definitely order them to give them a try.


3) Forgot to add the Epson 2030 just feels a year newer and more up to date on little features. It has HDMI control of other devices, so the remote for the Epson will control BR playback. I also like that when the remote turns off the projector it also turns off the AVR. There are absolutely no HDMI handshake issues with the Epson.


4) Will get around to posting some screen shots sometime this week/weekend.

You did a very nice review for someone new in town to reviews. I agree with pretty much everything you said, the Epson 3020 vs. the w1070 was about the same result. Good job...
 

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Good review. So it appears the 1070 still excells in the image quality among $1000 competitors.


Several of your cons no longer affect me.


The slow HDMI handshake - Fixed on firmware 1.06.


Poor remote - Not an issue because I use Harmony so I think it is a wise decision to not spend too much money on the remote.


Adjustable foot - Not an issue on the ceiling mount.


Lense cover - Not an issue due to ceiling mount.


RBE - This is major con and I am also sensitive. But I've never felt fatiguing or headache. I've learnt to ignore it



However, your following conclusions are well deserved. Afterall, image quality is the first and formost factor for me.


Better overall picture

More contrast range

Better blacks

More "pop" to colors (especially reds)

Less noise

Denser pixel

"Plasma-like" picture


And I was a bit surprised that the Benq has better blacks and lower noises - from all I've read the black and noise are the Benq's weak spot. So the Epson is even worse. This is a major con.


I'm really glad that I made the right choice
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotjt133  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23718444


And I was a bit surprised that the Benq has better blacks and lower noises - from all I've read the black and noise are the Benq's weak spot. So the Epson is even worse. This is a major con.


I'm really glad that I made the right choice

This is what I've been saying since I first saw the 3010 a few years back, and after seeing the w1070. Many reviewers have stated that the Epson has a cleaner picture, this is not true. There are scenes that favor noise on an Epson, and there are scenes that favor the noise of the Benq. DLP and LCD are different techs, so it just depends what kind of noise and the specific movie or scene, but from the few times I watched on the Benq w1070 and Epson 3020, the noise looked worse on the 3020. So another ding against pro reviewers, as has been noted many times, trust the pro reviews at your own peril, they are usually dead-flat wrong.


Both the 3010 and 3020 have poor black levels, to the point where at times I felt something was wrong with the gamma, even though it wasn't, it was a lack of contrast. The w1070's ABSOLUTE black floor levels are really not much better than the Epson to be honest, but the thing is that in most of the dark scenes the Benq appears more contrasty overall, because the intrascene contrast in most scenes is better on the Benq.


They are all good projectors, but DLP takes the lead in the sub $1500 categories. Every year we hear the story that the Epson projectors look better than the year before, but honestly the improvements are barely noticeable. The 8700ub to the Epson 5020 look almost identical in 2D, barely different. The Epson 3010/3020 and now I assume 2030 should look almost identical in 2D, with the overall PQ edge going to the older Epson 8350 due to better blacks.


Nothing new here, another repeat from the last 5 years of Epson LCD projectors.
 

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Hi , pretty much new here (today) , .. From Art Feierman's review between this epson 2030 and the benq w1070 do you personally feel that the 3D is better on the epson "quote" (much better) pop"" and brightness?? I myself (by far) as any would choose the projector with better blacks and contrast, but i am a big fan of 3D and would probably consider sacrificing better blacks and contrast for a better 3D image but only if the difference was substantial, any comments on both of this units regarding 3D would be much appreciated, Thanks

BTB did the sumsungs rf 3D glasses work on the epson, and any thoughts on the optomas hd25e, hd25-lv?
 

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DLP is free of cross-talk and in many ways is always going to be superior on a DLP, LCD is not, it's not a fair comparison. Though the 3D on the Epson is very good, it certainly isn't as clean as a DLP, and the 3D on the Epson starts ghosting more as the lamp ages, something DLP's do not do. 3D Gaming is not very playable on an Epson once you get some hours on the lamp if you care.


If you said the Epson 5020, then at least we can concede the 5020's contrast is much better in 3D for movies, but then it still suffers from some cross-talk more so once the lamp ages. So to answer your question, 3D is just plain better on a DLP overall.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23719278


DLP is free of cross-talk and in many ways is always going to be superior on a DLP, LCD is not, it's not a fair comparison. Though the 3D on the Epson is very good, it certainly isn't as clean as a DLP, and the 3D on the Epson starts ghosting more as the lamp ages, something DLP's do not do. 3D Gaming is not very playable on an Epson once you get some hours on the lamp if you care.


If you said the Epson 5020, then at least we can concede the 5020's contrast is much better in 3D for movies, but then it still suffers from some cross-talk more so once the lamp ages. So to answer your question, 3D is just plain better on a DLP overall.

Cross-talk is the big one for me and many others. I also own a JVC RS45 and I could not watch 3D because of the cross-talk. I added a 1070 and cross-talk is gone and 3D is very good. It does not have the blacks of the JVC but it is more that acceptable for viewing most films.

It is much better than expected for the price and I use it for all of the most demanding viewing even for 2D. I save the JVC for special films because of the high cost of a replacement lamp.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by gogoluna  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23719167


Hi , pretty much new here (today) , .. From Art Feierman's review between this epson 2030 and the benq w1070 do you personally feel that the 3D is better on the epson "quote" (much better) pop"" and brightness?? I myself (by far) as any would choose the projector with better blacks and contrast, but i am a big fan of 3D and would probably consider sacrificing better blacks and contrast for a better 3D image but only if the difference was substantial, any comments on both of this units regarding 3D would be much appreciated, Thanks

BTB did the sumsungs rf 3D glasses work on the epson, and any thoughts on the optomas hd25e, hd25-lv?
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy  /t/1489845/benq-w1070-vs-epson-2030-direct-comparison-yes-i-have-both#post_23719278


DLP is free of cross-talk and in many ways is always going to be superior on a DLP, LCD is not, it's not a fair comparison. Though the 3D on the Epson is very good, it certainly isn't as clean as a DLP, and the 3D on the Epson starts ghosting more as the lamp ages, something DLP's do not do. 3D Gaming is not very playable on an Epson once you get some hours on the lamp if you care.


If you said the Epson 5020, then at least we can concede the 5020's contrast is much better in 3D for movies, but then it still suffers from some cross-talk more so once the lamp ages. So to answer your question, 3D is just plain better on a DLP overall.

I'm going to order the 144hz IR 3D glasses for the BenQ today. Amazon should have them delivered by Thursday. I'll be able to give 1st hand opinion of 3D on the BenQ vs. Epson.


Found these 144hz glasses for $20 bucks a piece on Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/SainSonic-Rechargeable-Mitsubishi-ViewSonic-Projector/dp/B00BVUNZUU/ref=pd_cp_e_0




edit.. Also my girlfriend has just returned from a trip and will be able to give a 2nd opinion on everything I view this weekend. I'll try to include her opinion, with mine, after my weekend update. I made sure to order a 2nd pair of glasses for her.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Also meant to the add the 2030 has a shorter throw than the W1070.


Thats right. To shoot the same size picture, I have to put the W1070 further from the screen. That said, considering BenQ also makes the 1080ST.. it should be no surprise that the 1070 has a longer throw than the 2030.
 
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