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Completely subjective, but I would get a minimum of 2 subs if I have a $2000 budget. I'm sure the DIY guys are going to chime in big time. I have 2 PC+ 16-46. I smile every time I look at them.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by klipsch
Completely subjective, but I would get a minimum of 2 subs if I have a $2000 budget. I'm sure the DIY guys are going to chime in big time. I have 2 PC+ 16-46. I smile every time I look at them.
OK, since you mentioned it...How handy are you comx?:D


When someone has a budget of $2000 dollars for bass, it tells me one of two things. A.) They have more money than I could dream of, or B.) They want ultimate bass.


If you want ultimate bass I would either go for Infinte Baffle or Dual Tumult -based subs. I'm sure kgveteran will chime in about that.;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I am looking at the SVSubwoofers. Not familiar with them but they seem to be the subwoofer specialist. Does anyone have a chance to compare different subs in the SVS lines?


Here's what I am interested:


PB12-ISD/2 for $899 + $99 shipped
http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pb12_isd_2.htm


PB12-Plus/2 for $1199 + $99 shipped
http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pb12_plus_2.htm


PB12-Ultra/2 for $1999 + $150 shipped
http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pb12_ultra_2.htm


I think I like the Ultra but is it worth the differences? The ISD has very attractive price of $899 with the dual 12" sub. I don't know how much differences between them...


Any one has suggestion for any other brands?


Thanks,
 

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The Ultra has 2 of its TV12 Ultra drivers. Anyone who has compared the 2 says that the sound difference is very noticable. Generally I think they are the folks that like to crank it up and combine that with low loud bass and that is what seperates the men from the boys. It all depends on your room size and how loud you like it if the PB12 ULtra is overkill. You could also apply this to the PB12ISD compared to the Plus.


Personally I would email them and they will tell you what you should get.

They won't oversell you. The PB12 Ultra also has a built in parametric EQ.


As far as other options:


ACI Maestro

Acoustic Visions Denali - I believe there is a forum member who had one of these and sold it for a Maestro..

James Loudspeakers EMB series. Though I'm not convinced that they will hang down low with the above options

Velodyne makes a few. Can't remember MSRP on the DD series subs.

Paradigm Servo 15 v2. MSRP is above 2k but you might get a used or perhaps a discount on a new one


Those are the ones I'd start out with. I don't know if there is any others that can really hang out down low with the Maestro or the SVS. The last Servo and Velodyne's I've heard were not impressive at all to me. The Maestro is intriguing for sure.


If you can do it yourself and go an IB, I honestly don't think there is a commercial setup that will run with an IB. Then again not all of us are perfect candidates for an IB setup. Those people whom I trust who have tried an IB, won't go back to anything else. I personally don't have any skills at all when it comes to DIY, so I'm going premade only. I'm still very uncertain what I plan on doing.
 

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comexpert,

since you are in northern california, you might want to check out the "hardware for sale" section at hometheaterforum.com.

i'm selling a like new PB2+,including bonus gear, for $950 (you pick up). i can say with total confidence that you can not buy a better sub for the $.

pm or email me if interested.

best,

eric
 

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In the $2K range I really like the Dynaudio and REL subs. I have a Dynaudio Adience Sub30A and am about to audition one of the new Dynaudio subs (Sub300 @ $1400, Sub500 @ $1900).


Dean
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by jjdche
Well, I will say this. All the commercial subwoofers mentioned are great units and are certainly among the best available, but look at these two pictures....

15" driver from the ACI Maestro

Adire's 15" Tumult


Now, you can get one ACI Maestro (w/500W amp) for $2100.


OR


You can get TWO Tumults with 2000+ watts of power for well under $2000.



can you see the appeal of DIY?:)
First, How many guys can match the build quality of the Maestro... ?


Second, If you ARE at that level in Craftsmanship, you know it will take quite a few hours to build such a cabinet. If your point is that the labor time to build such a unit is worthless, PLEASE come to my house... I have some work that needs done, and could use some free help ... :)


Third... the amp that comes with the Maestro is quite underrated. The Maestro puts as much clean output at 16 Hz as does a Denali with the twin 18 inch passive radiators. Yes, it was measured. As for sound quality, not one person who heard the Denali and the Maestro thought the Denali was even CLOSE to the Maestro... this included musicians, a speaker designer... etc...


I applaud the talent required to build a DIY design. I also think that, if you enjoy the work, more power to you...


Just don't try to convince a reasonable person that a DIY is a cost effective approach... it IS a good thing for the wood working hobbyist ...


:cool:
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by craigsub
First, How many guys can match the build quality of the Maestro... ?
Well, I can only speak for myself...;)

Quote:
Originally posted by craigsub
Second, If you ARE at that level in Craftsmanship, you know it will take quite a few hours to build such a cabinet. If your point is that the labor time to build such a unit is worthless, PLEASE come to my house... I have some work that needs done, and could use some free help ... :)
Some enjoy the work, some don't. I'm not forcing anyone into anything. Just suggesting...

Quote:
Originally posted by craigsub
Third... the amp that comes with the Maestro is quite underrated. The Maestro puts as much clean output at 16 Hz as does a Denali with the twin 18 inch passive radiators. Yes, it was measured. As for sound quality, not one person who heard the Denali and the Maestro thought the Denali was even CLOSE to the Maestro... this included musicians, a speaker designer... etc...
I'd like to see the numbers on the Maestro...


I'm not sure that it is physically possible for the Maestro to outduel dual Tumults in an SPL contest. SQ may be another story.

Quote:
Originally posted by craigsub
I applaud the talent required to build a DIY design. I also think that, if you enjoy the work, more power to you...


Just don't try to convince a reasonable person that a DIY is a cost effective approach... it IS a good thing for the wood working hobbyist ...


:cool:
I'm not going to fault someone for buying a commercial design, but everyone should know that DIY is out there.



PS I'm a basshead, not a woodworker.:cool:
 

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The Denali only has one Tumult, and twin passive radiators. I can tell you that several VERY good DIYers have mentioned the only way to handle the Tumult is with a quality 1000 watt plate amp, use a sealed design, and have an outboard eq ...


When you look at the level of plate amp that REALLY will work.. such as the Adire Audio HyPex-A1500 (700 watts into 8 ohms), you will have a little under $1400 in the plate amp and Tumult driver... So the $700 difference has to get you all the materials, hardware, and labor to finish the subwoofer...


For me, the expense of the materials needed, my labor, insurance deductible when I cut off my fingers, etc... are just TOO expensive...

:p
 

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What's the best sub for under $2000 new or used?


Thanks,

_______________________________________________________


A good contender to add to your short list would be the PB12-Ultra/2 imo. After just switching over from three 25-31CS+'s to the PB12-Ultra/2, I have no regrets. It's definitely not the only choice to consider, but it is one heck of a sub. The PC-Ultra and the PB12-Plus/2 are also nice considerations if you would rather hold your budget back a bit.
 

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I've been using Tumults for over two years and the only drawback is the "backorder". Other than that they really do the job, and I'm very hard on them. I'm not driving them hard but at high levels I can detect the least bit of distortion,cone bottoming , and all other forms of clipping.These things drive well and they do it with ease.It's just tough getting them.
 

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Check out the Klipsch Referance Series RSW15. They can be had for $1300 and are extremely nice. Well bult, punchy and tight 2-15's and a BASH 1200 watt amp. Other nice sub comapny's are SVS, Velodyne, Rel and M&K.
 

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Quote:
The Maestro puts as much clean output at 16 Hz as does a Denali with the twin 18 inch passive radiators. Yes, it was measured. As for sound quality, not one person who heard the Denali and the Maestro thought the Denali was even CLOSE to the Maestro... this included musicians, a speaker designer... etc...
Lets compare apples to apples here shall we? You're comparing a sealed design to a PR'd design.....an alignment with the best group delay and an alignment with the worst group delay. The Kilimanjaro (sealed single Tumult) has almost the same output down low as the Denali but is sealed and thus has a different sound quality to it, probably much like the Maestro.

Quote:
When you look at the level of plate amp that REALLY will work.. such as the Adire Audio HyPex-A1500 (700 watts into 8 ohms), you will have a little under $1400 in the plate amp and Tumult driver... So the $700 difference has to get you all the materials, hardware, and labor to finish the subwoofer...
Adire ADA1200 I dont know about you but I see one there for $499 meaning you are at $1000 for the driver and amp.....$1100 after the preorder still a full $300 below your quote above. BTW, all new Pinnacle series subwoofers are going to be using these amplifiers, including the Everest. Also, I'm sure those that heard the Everest at CES last year may disagree with your statement about the ONLY way to handle the Tumult and that was only with 250w per driver.


I'm sure the Maestro is a great unit and ACI is a great company, but lets not bash on the Denali which you picked as your winner earlier this year against some very tough competition. Could it be just the fact that you prefer sealed subs? A very good possibility...while others may prefer a vented or PR'd design/sound as I have previously mentioned.


Besides, I thought you sold the Denali LONG before the Maestro arrived. Maybe I'm mistaken? Or is everybody that listened going by their memory, and we all know how accurate of a ruler memory is.....:rolleyes:
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by drguayo
I think a used pair of M&K MX-350 mkII thx would do the trick. They come in at $3700 MSRP but $2000 used.


Don't underestimate M&K . Have a real listen if possible.
Heartily second this.


M&K play loud and clean, and very very low.


I've had a MX-200 for about 7 years now, paired with Dynaudios in the other 5 positions. Dyns don't go very low, so when the pipe organs start playing, the M&K has major work to do. It fits perfectly in the system with the Dyns.


I'd buy M&K again in a NY min.
 

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Go with the PB12-Plus/2 for $1199 + $99 shipped. That's what I am buying and for the money they are fantastic. If you have the money the PB12-Ultra/2 for $1999 + $150 shipped is the ultimate but just depends on whether you want to spend the extra money and how large your room is.
 
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