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Discussion Starter #1
I was pretty set on the RS1, but with technology moving so fast I am now questioning if black levels and native on/off is enough to make a projector "the best" when there are so many other variables. Aside from the colors, I am pretty determined to get one with good sharpness.
 

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I looked into the same issue a few days ago.Was looking at either the Sony black pearl(have one in the main theater) or the RS-1x for a downstairs theater.Long story short I ended up with the Epson PRO Cinema 1080UB.Some reviews that I have read put the PQ very close to the RS-1 at approx $500. less.Also comes w/mount,extra bulb, 3 yr warrenty and 1 free year of blockbuster total access.I purchased mine through AV Science and also received a promotion they are doing and great customer service. Ron
 

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The RS1 is a superb performer at a great price. The new Epson LCD is also. Probably the VW60 too.


You can spend endless hours pontificating about "whether it's the best" or just get one and start enjoying. There will always be something better down the road...although these projectors would be difficult to noticeably eclipse for a lower price.
 

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According to Art Feierman (Projector Reviews - he owns an RS1) the RS2 (the RS1x is a runner-up) is the best, with the Epson 1080UB is an alternate, in the next lower price class. He said the 1080UB is sharper, but he considers the RS2 to be better overall.


See his comparison summary, bottom line, here: http://www.projectorreviews.com/Best...ardwinners.php .
 

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After reading Art's review on the IN83 this morning, I think he would say it is the best UNDER 5K projector (when considering street pricing anyway). Too bad it's not very placement friendly.....
 

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I'm ready to buy in this space as well. I'm leaning away from single-chip DLP (don't want rbe, even if I turn out not to be sensitive) and Epson (some convergence/quality concerns when it first came out). I'm looking to spend $3-5k. My current leading contenders:


- Sony vw60

+ pretty good picture

+ good/accurate color achievable

+ vertical stretch for anamorphic

- black levels compared to RS1x

- sharpness (?) compared to RS1x


- JVC RS1x

+ sharpness/black levels

- color accuracy concerns

- no anamorphic stretch


I'm building a 2.35:1 screen 120" wide in a bat cave, and I'd love to grab an anamorphic lens at some point during the life of my first projector.


Really, my comparison is:

- RS1x + video processor (for stretch/color fix)

vs.

- vw60


When I look at it that way, I can't justify going to the RS1x. Am I looking at it wrong? Are the colors of the RS1 just fine without a processor for normal person movie watching?


If the RS2 had fixed the color concerns, I'd be all over it. Budget? What budget?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmeyer /forum/post/14260352


Are the colors of the RS1 just fine without a processor for normal person movie watching?

Colors are fine. Way overblown. Most prefer the slightly saturated colors and they are no where near as oversaturated as the RS2 which in some ways is even a better performer
 

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Man.. The RS1 color issue is over blown. Most people really like the extra pop they give.


Same as the HD1 right?


If so, the RS1 throws a mean image PQ wise. (Mean meaning awesome in this case)


I have not got to see an RS2 yet.
 

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If color accuracy, convergence (actually CA errors) and sharpness are important, the JVC would not be my choice.In other areas of peformance it is very good.pojectors at a price point are design compromises intertwined with technology limitations.


the sony's are good but can't touch the native on/off of the JVCs. End results for on/off using the sony DI function is comparable but there are indeed pluses and minuses using the DI.


another very important factor is that Cedia is only a little over one and one half months away. new models will be shown and who knows what you might beable to buy for less or a little more with much better performance. Its the end of the model yea but with no end of the model year pricing.
 

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Discussion Starter #10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryg /forum/post/14260402


Colors are fine. Way overblown. Most prefer the slightly saturated colors and they are no where near as oversaturated as the RS2 which in some ways is even a better performer

So the color issue is worse with the RS2? I thought it was superior to the RS1x across the board.
 

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Thanks for the RS1x 'color issue is overblown' comments. I'll be able to audition a vw60 and an HD1 with my wife, so I'll get a chance to compare.


Assuming the RS1 colors are fine, the vw60/RS1x differences would be cost, v-stretch, sharpness, and black levels. You guys aren't making this any easier...


Actually, reading the projectorreview IN83 review, I may have to put the IN83 in the running, even with RBE... My wife likes a bright picture (she's always cranking up the brightness on my Pioneer 57" RPTV until all the guns are blooming!). 1100 lumens in 'best' mode would be great when I go anamorphic. Very bright, very sharp, good colors. I'll have to keep an eye out for other reviews.


As for Cedia, I'm not sure I can wait. Another coat of paint, some crown molding, carpet, and the front wall panels and I'll be ready to fire things up. Maybe 6-8 more weekends of work. I could probably hold out until Cedia, but not until Cedia announced projectors are actually available... If there is a price drop once the new projectors are announced, though, I could take advantage of that.


Do price drops occur around Cedia, or once new projectors are actually shipped?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomT99 /forum/post/14260454


So the color issue is worse with the RS2? I thought it was superior to the RS1x across the board.


Instead of hypothesizing about it for 59 pages, why dont you just go and see one?
 

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All I can say is my RS1 is sharp enough that I get a nice clear picture with a lot of depth. It never looks soft in my setup so these people using sharpness as a reason not to get an RS1 is just wrong. I have seen plenty of projectors at Home Theater dealers and I can't say I have seen anything sharper. In fact my setup is the sharpest I have ever seen athough its probably because I spent plenty of time making sure it is setup and focused correctly.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryg /forum/post/14260809


Instead of hypothesizing about it for 59 pages, why dont you just go and see one?

Not answering for TomT99, but for me:


1) Depending on where you live, it's sometimes difficult to find a store to demo them, especially a store that has all the ones you are interested in.


2) I feel guilty going into local brick&mortar stores to demo projectors I know I'm not likely to buy from them, so I try to minimize it.


That wasn't specific to the RS1x vs. RS2 discussion. I'd love to see an IN83, but don't know of anyplace in Austin that sells it.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomT99 /forum/post/14259793


I was pretty set on the RS1, but with technology moving so fast I am now questioning if black levels and native on/off is enough to make a projector "the best" when there are so many other variables. Aside from the colors, I am pretty determined to get one with good sharpness.

Tom,


"Best overall picture" is such a subjective idea, and everyone here has their own opinions based on their viewing preferences.


Have you seen enough projectors and/or flat screen displays to know which image qualities to which you're most sensitive or picky? You're right, there's more than just contrast ratio and black levels when it comes to PQ, and although those factors are important, they're certainly not the only things that make for a good picture. I came from an H79 to an RS1, and although there were things the RS1 did well it is not the "best" projector out there, contrary to what some people may say here. I now have a BenQ W10000 that I'm setting up since I sold the RS1, and it will be interesting to see how the BenQ fares against the RS1. I definitely appreciate the sharpness and lack of convergence issues in going from a 3-chip to 1-chip machine, as well as the color accuracy of the BenQ. However, I do very occasionally notice rainbows and I can already tell that the RS1 had better black levels. Some people are really bothered by the RS1's colors, whereas others see rainbows constantly or get headaches from DLP - in the end you ultimately need to determine what's important to you and then choose the projector that best fits your preferences. People can go 'round in circles about what's better on paper, but often you'll find that the seemingly large differentiators on paper are reduced to trivial points once you see projectors perform in real life with your own eyes.
 

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The tough thing is that even a demo often doesn't tell the whole story. There are plenty of movies where the RS1 colors look perfectly natural. Others will make them really stand out (in a bad way). It could take a lot of viewing to know how much they will bother you.


In my experience, even detecting rainbows in a demo might not be practical. The only time I owned a DLP, I didn't see a single rainbow until I had 14 hours on the bulb. Then I couldn't stop seeing them. Sometimes, all you can do is read as much as you can, make a decision and dive in...
 

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If I had wanted to demo an RS1 in my theater I could have. It was way out of my price range at the time was all.


At worst? I'd bank somebody with one in stock would agree to let you return it if it it didn't work out without a restocking fee if you talked to them about it before hand.


Not sure where the best street price is on one right now.


After see'n the dang thing, I'd say this is a no brainer if you can score one for $3K-ish. Not a great projector for lower end sources than SD-DVD though in my opinion. SD-DVD or better is hella fine on it.
 

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Discussion Starter #18

Quote:
Originally Posted by pmeyer /forum/post/14261179


Not answering for TomT99, but for me:


1) Depending on where you live, it's sometimes difficult to find a store to demo them, especially a store that has all the ones you are interested in.


2) I feel guilty going into local brick&mortar stores to demo projectors I know I'm not likely to buy from them, so I try to minimize it.


That wasn't specific to the RS1x vs. RS2 discussion. I'd love to see an IN83, but don't know of anyplace in Austin that sells it.

Exactly
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmeyer /forum/post/14260352


- JVC RS1x

+ sharpness/black levels

- color accuracy concerns

- no anamorphic stretch

I can't comment on the Sony, but can on the RS1.


I just recently picked up an RSVP2 (JVC's VP).


I don't think any projector has the stretch flexibility needed for a proper scope screen. A VP is mandatory for scope IMO.


Color issue is way overblown. The RSVP2 corrects the color, yet I can barely see a difference when color on the RS1 is set to -12 vs. the RSVP2's corrected colors.


If you really want the RS1 don't let those two things hold you back.


Heres my 3 step program for HT bliss. (I'm on step 2)

-Get RS1 now and just zoom and shift.

-Than get the RSVP2 (or another VP) and use the shrink method.

-Than get a lens.


Each one of these upgrades will get rid of any form of upgraditits, while the rest of these fools gets a new projector every year.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by shamus /forum/post/14262093


I can't comment on the Sony, but can on the RS1.


I just recently picked up an RSVP2 (JVC's VP).


I don't think any projector has the stretch flexibility needed for a proper scope screen. A VP is mandatory for scope IMO.


Color issue is way overblown. The RSVP2 corrects the color, yet I can barely see a difference when color on the RS1 is set to -12 vs. the RSVP2's corrected colors.


If you really want the RS1 don't let those two things hold you back.


Heres my 3 step program for HT bliss. (I'm on step 2)

-Get RS1 now and just zoom and shift.

-Than get the RSVP2 (or another VP) and use the shrink method.

-Than get a lens.


Each one of these upgrades will get rid of any form of upgraditits, while the rest of these fools gets a new projector every year.

Understood on the color issue. It's officially been removed from my list of concerns. It got so much mileage when it first came out it stuck in my brain.


Are you projecting 2.35:1 now? How wide a screen and what gain do you have?


One thing that was making the IN83 look good is the lumens... I know my wife likes a bright screen and I don't have a good feel for how bright a vw60 or RS1 will look when stretched to 120" 2.35:1 on an SMX (~1.2 gain) screen compared to my current Pioneer Elite 610 RPTV.
 
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