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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am looking for opinions (of course I am researching - just looking for others thoughts) on the best projector in this forum (under 5K) for HDTV and DVDs.


I have an idea that the 20HD/PLV-70 would do a real nice job for what I'm looking for, but I'm wondering if there is a projector out there that is less $$ that would give me a nice HD/DVD picture (thinking 104 inches).
 

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The PLV-70 is a fine choice in the LCD category. Also try the NEC HT 1000 in the DLP category. Both are near your $5K price point.


See projectorcentral.com for discussions of both the PLV-70 and the HT1000; they recommend these two machines in this price range.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
rlsmith,


Thanks for the response. But I guess I didn't clearify exactly what I was trying to find out.


Is there a projector for maybe half (approx) the cost of those that would do a real nice job for me with HDTV and DVDs??
 

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Well, the best way is to watch a projector with HD source...and preferably side-by-side with the target projectors.


I can say that the M20X has a reasonably nice HD image. Better then the LCDs I viewed with the same rez. This about 6 months ago though and the choices are wider now.


All in all, the more pixels you can get the better. The higher the fill factor the better too IMHO. This means that DLPs have a slight edge in comparison to the LCD projectors of the same resolution. This is offset by the fact that most LCDs are cheaper than their equivalent DLPs. In this price range you might be able to get slightly greater rez with LCD than with DLP for only a little more money.


16:9 is better than 4:3 for HD. Mine is a 4:3 but with some sources I use an anamorphic lens to let me use the whole panel. With a 1080i source the projector performs the scaling to a 16:9 image that I can't do much with but still looks very nice. With a HTPC and a HD card I can use the full panel and perform a squeeze with the lens.


But seeing is key. The panasonic 75u has very similar specs to my M20X but didn't do nearly as well for HD.


Regards,


Nigel
 

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mknoebel,


If you are serious about HDTV and want to keep your projector for a few years than you must look for one that has native 16:9 and minimum 1280x720 resolution. 4:3 projectors for serious home theatre are likely on their last significant upgrade cycle, with most future focus on 16:9.


If you are looking for a projector that is significantly lower that $5K, then your best option is clearly the Sony HS-10, second best the Epson TW-100 ($2500 and $4000 street approximately). The Sony is currently in very short supply but it sounds like that is picking up.


No current DLP products have 16:9 ratio and minimum 1280x720 native resolution in the below $5 area so LCD is your only option. I hear the new 720P projectors are sweet though.


I would strongly recomend that you do not get a 4:3 projector if you watch mostly DVD and HD, with some regular TV. They are not high resolution enough to be worth it for HD (there is a huge difference between 1366 pixels wide and 1024 pixels wide with HD material) and the constant letterboxing is a pain. (The use of anamorphic lenses and HTPC scalers is an ingeneous kludge, but is becoming less and less necessary with the advent of native 16:9 projectors).


I've got the Sony HS-10 and it plainly looks awesome in HD, and almost as awesome for DVD. 16:9 format, 1366x768 native resolution.


Be aware that the reviewer at projectorcentral.com has a significant bias preferance for 4:3 format projectors for some reason and their recomendations are starting to become a bit dated.


Of course, my response is hopelessly biased :) but it sounds like you watch the same mix of material that I do. Hope this helps.


Dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Dave,


Helps very much. Great info. Thanks for your help!!
 

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i say check out the hs10. it should look quite nice for HD.


I say avoid the m20x nigel mentions....unless you want orange apples.
 

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The HS-10 sounds like a great machine...probably the current best buy in the 2,500-3,000 range.


Whether 4:3 is dead for the next iteration in HT depends on if the average presentation projectors ever move to the 1600x1200 resolution and if the pricing is reasonable for such a machine but given its probably only useful for CAD presentations its not very likely...your average powerpoint warrior doesn't need one. :).


Too bad though...thats about the only path to good but inexpensive DLPs until manufacturers get off their $10K kick for HD2 machines.


Still though...not much beats the ability to generate pixel perfect digital source for a projector...which still requires a high end scaler or a HTPC. An anamorphic lens is still useful in the future to turn a 16:9 native panel into a 2.35:1 image.


Regards,


Nigel
 

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Daveboswell:


Can you tell me why you think the Sony HS-10 is better than the Epson TW100? I would really like to know as these two catch my eye. The only thing that really turned me off about the SONY was the fan noise. Is it that obtrusive? The best thing when comparing the two is the price. What makes the Epson worth $1500 more? Is it the Faraoujda chip inside? Also, would a room that measures 12.5' by 20' be a problem for me if I were to get the Sony because of its 'long throw'?


Thanks for any info you can give me regarding the advantages/disadvantages between these two
 

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I still can't seem to find this info. Does showing an HDTV cable signal on a 800x600 pj (X1) look any better than, say a DVD? I understand there aren't enough pixels for that resolution, etc but will the picture be superior to any other input or no? THANKS
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by rlindo
i say check out the hs10. it should look quite nice for HD.


I say avoid the m20x nigel mentions....unless you want orange apples.
I agree, the HS-10 should be a nice looking box...I hope to see it in this area soon.


While the m20x does have orangish reds it doesn't affect apples which have a deeper red (in fact these seem quite accurate) but the very saturated/bright reds. Its real easy to see with the red K-Mart F1 car in SpeedVision but you'll notice that the Snap-On Tools red appears to be the same on the M20X in comparison to LCDs. Its generally not noticable in most normal viewing as mentally you correct for color inaccuracy without another source nearby to compare things with.


DLPs do suffer from color (the M20X more than some) in comparison to LCDs but generally do better in blacks and contrast. Wish the DLPs were cheaper too. The X1 looks to be a great machine too but falls far short of the HS10 in terms of resolution. Were it 1024x768 with a 3X wheel it would be the perfect budget DLP for this generation of technology (at the same under $2K price :) ).


Regards,


Nigel
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Gregg Brent
I still can't seem to find this info. Does showing an HDTV cable signal on a 800x600 pj (X1) look any better than, say a DVD? I understand there aren't enough pixels for that resolution, etc but will the picture be superior to any other input or no? THANKS
It does look much better on 1024x768 which is also not enough pixels for HDTV. Much of it depends on how well your projector will scale 1080i as well. I would expect pretty decent things out of the X1. Hope to demo one sometime soon.


Regards,


Nigel
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by rlindo
I say avoid the m20x nigel mentions....unless you want orange apples.
True if you don't tweak the projector. I have posted settings to get totally red apples and just about all other reds. It does cost an extra $35 or so for a filter and you won't get the peak brightness with a filter, so your tastes may vary. I personally prefer to keep the brightness and have everything be red except for the very brightest reds, which move towards orange as they do on most DLPs. As others have stated, there are tradeoffs with anything down in forum. Actually there are tradeoffs with all of these, no matter the price.


--Darin
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by darinp
True if you don't tweak the projector. I have posted settings to get totally red apples and just about all other reds. It does cost an extra $35 or so for a filter and you won't get the peak brightness with a filter, so your tastes may vary. I personally prefer to keep the brightness and have everything be red except for the very brightest reds, which move towards orange as they do on most DLPs. As others have stated, there are tradeoffs with anything down in forum. Actually there are tradeoffs with all of these, no matter the price.


--Darin
About the only other thing wrong with the M20X is the white segment of the color wheel doesn't seem to turn off. Hmmm...not even in cinema mode or at least not as noticably as it does on some other projectors.


I agree with Darin though...I prefer to live with slightly orange reds and no filter.


Regards,


Nigel
 

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I should also mention that a lot of this depends on screen size. On my 116" wide Hi-Power screen I've had LCDs up to 1280x720 (TW100) and a person would almost have to be blind not to see the 'dirty screen' or 'fixed pattern noise' that you get with these. Basically, this means that the image will have depth, but only with looking through something that looks like it is static (kind of like screendoor, but not exactly) while the image moves. This is the main reason I have kept my M20x over these. I get to see that depth of image without distraction from it. This effect from the LCDs doesn't seem as bad on smaller, less gain screens.


--Darin
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by nigel_ht
About the only other thing wrong with the M20X is the white segment of the color wheel doesn't seem to turn off. Hmmm...not even in cinema mode or at least not as noticably as it does on some other projectors.
Nigel,


The downside to the colors for me was mostly that I had to spend hours coming up with a balance that I liked. Now that I spent the time I think they are pretty good (not perfect). On some other projectors I wouldn't have had to invest all that time.


I agree that the white segment doesn't completely shut off, but something I think is strange is that it does shut off on the 260, but we measured a lower contrast ratio on the 260 than on the M20x, even when we had the 260 in a mode where it wasn't supposed to use the white segment. While the 260 was brighter, it's blacks were also much brighter than the blacks on my M20x. Of course, this is only a sample of one.


--Darin
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
This discussion is very helpful and what I am looking for.


Thanks to all for the good information.
 
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