[Jive Turkey]

I'm an HD-DVD guy who'd like to buy into Bluray at this point, but I haven't come across a player that'll do Dolby True and DTS/MA (bitstream's fine by me) that I have any confidence in buying...yet. I guess the Pioneer 95 has come the closest in my research; at least it seems there's less griping about issues with it (primary being load times), but damn....$900+ for a frickin' player?


I've tried to buy the Panny 30 and the Sammy 1400, but I research them and I find 20-25% "no recommendation" votes due to problems. Your mileage may vary in your research, but that's as I've found it to be.


Anyone else feel like we're just a bunch of beta-testers that have to pay for the privelege? I'm just venting, but sheesh.....

 

[townofturley]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jive Turkey /forum/post/12870718



Anyone else feel like we're just a bunch of beta-testers that have to pay for the privelege? I'm just venting, but sheesh.....

Then don't buy anything. You're not ready. It's that simple. Sheesh!

 

[miata]

Are you sure you have the intestinal fortitude to be an early adopter?

 

[namechamps]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jive Turkey /forum/post/12870718


I've tried to buy the Panny 30 and the Sammy 1400, but I research them and I find 20-25% "no recommendation" votes due to problems. Your mileage may vary in your research, but that's as I've found it to be.


Anyone else feel like we're just a bunch of beta-testers that have to pay for the privelege? I'm just venting, but sheesh.....

20% say bad things about the Panny BD30? How many didn't read the specs and bought it for internal decoding (which it doesn't support). Looking at amazon it is currently 4.5 out of 5 stars.


Most stores offer a 30 day window. I would stay away from the 1400 but BD30 is worth a 30 day "free trial". Buy one or two flicks, rent the rest and put it through it's paces for 30 days. If is still SUCKS in your mind return it.

 

[sivartk]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jive Turkey /forum/post/12870718


I'm an HD-DVD guy who'd like to buy into Bluray at this point, but I haven't come across a player that'll do Dolby True and DTS/MA (bitstream's fine by me) that I have any confidence in buying...yet.

I'm waiting for the Samsung 5500 (dual format player) to come out this Summer. It may not only replace my ugly PS3 and so-so looking HD-D2, but will clear a space on my rack

List is suppose to be $599 and is suppose to handle all audio codecs both PCM and bitstream (from what I read).

 

[HT Nut]



Quote:
Originally Posted by sivartk /forum/post/12871851


I'm waiting for the Samsung 5500 (dual format player) to come out this Summer. It may not only replace my ugly PS3 and so-so looking HD-D2, but will clear a space on my rack

List is suppose to be $599 and is suppose to handle all audio codecs both PCM and bitstream (from what I read).

The pre release promises are seldom delivered in the for sale product.


I have not heard anything bad about the Panny BD30. My concern is that it is not final profile.


I shall just limp along with my BD10.

 

[cygnusloop]

I think the ability to "repair the device in the home" (via firmware revisions) makes being an early adopter much more palatable than it used to be. This makes it possible for a less than optimum device to be improved over time. Unpaid beta testers? Perhaps. But to me it's worth the ability to enjoy the product until it is, in fact, ready for the masses.


The same is true for just about any piece of HDTV technology. If it is important to you that ALL the kinks are smoothed out before you buy, you have a while yet to wait.


I, for one, am enjoying all my HD toys (my Blu-ray player being one of the better behaved devices). I choose not to worry that some "evil" CE company is taking advantage of me.

 

[k1davis]



Quote:
Originally Posted by miata /forum/post/12871596


Are you sure you have the intestinal fortitude to be an early adopter?

Warning.. Rant ahead...


That's the thing. We should be far past the early adopter stage with Blu-Ray.


This is from the Wikipedia Blu-Ray page:

Quote:
In February 2002, the project was officially announced as Blu-ray, and the Blu-ray Disc Association was founded by the nine initial members.


The first consumer devices were in stores on April 10, 2001. This device was the Sony BDZ-S77; a BD-RE recorder that was only made available in Japan. The recommended price was US$3800.

Here it is nearly 6 years after they formed the BDA and there are still no BD players on the market that can output all audio formats as Bitstream, PCM, and analog. The Profile 2.0 Panny BD50 (announced with no street date or price as of yet) will be the first fully feature complete BD player, AFAIK.


They've been charging too much and taking too long to get their act together. Players like the BD50 should have been the $1000 models - a year ago. Now that would have been something worth adopting early.

 

[tleavit]

I dunno. I have a PS3 and 30ish movies now and they play perfectly on my setup without one problem to date at all. I’m not getting a few formats yet out there but dudes, even receivers that can do things like DD HD and DTS Master didn’t come out until a few months ago (such as the Onkyo 805). Why would a brand make a player that can do such things as DD HD when there isn’t anything out there that even uses it? Now that receivers have gotten out there and their numbers are picking up (but even at that, how many receives that run those formats are really out there(, HD-DVD and BR players are coming out that play them. The tail doesn’t wag the dog.


I can say this, I’m up to 25ish movies also in HD-DVD (Toshiba A30) and that is one format that has nothing but troubles (such as dual format disks not working at all, cheap problematic hardware) and feels like I’m in beta with it. I shouldn’t have to pray that the disk will work every time I get a new HD-DVD. Tonight I watched "inside man" and it ran fine. But I also watched a tier 0 BR disk (Meet the Robinsons) which was a phenomenal disk as far as quality goes.

 

[k1davis]

Good points tleavit.


What I'm saying is that a player that can fully decode the audio formats would have given us the full capabilities of Blu-Ray no matter what kind of receiver we've got. We're only now starting to see those players announced. They're still not here.


I can't blame the manufacturers completely for this. Who knew that Fox, New Line & MGM (& Lionsgate, I've heard) would use DTS HD MA instead of the functionally identical Dolby True HD.


If it wasn't for the DTS HD MA thing I'd get a PS3 just like you. You're enjoying your HDM at least. But I don't have $500 for every time the manufacturers decide to inch closer to a fully spec'd player. So I'm waiting.


My point is that the wait should have to be this long.

 

[MRMOTA]

Do I feel like a beta tester I would say no.


HDM is still new. I have both formats and while blu has there evolving profiles you can still find machines that are stable and for the most part do enough to tide a lot of people over until they can afford to get a new receiver, 7.1 setup, 1.3 tv etc.... In time full profile players will be available at cheaper prices. Owning an HDDVD no matter how cheap it is a fact is that hddvd offers no choice for HW. Look at the HDDVD forums and you can see the issues folks have with there HDDVD players. However long term I can see that the choices offered by blu will be a big selling point. At this point it is hard to believe that any CE company can for see making any profit against Toshiba's machines. So why spend R and D cash to try and play catch up. Long term Chinese players and re-badges do not make for a viable solution if all the other mainstream CE companies refuse to play.


Enjoy HDDVD now but I'd say wait on blu....

 

[T-smith]

i have the Panny 30 and I am more then happy with it and Ive had a lot of Bluray and HD players. I also have the Samsung 1400 in another room and the only issue I have with it is the load time is much slower then the Panny 30


I couldnt disagree more about being a beta-tester.

 

[jpmst3]

If you read the inside articles you will see that Blu-ray was rushed to market becasue of the pending release of HD-DVD. So, they did not have time to finalize things like that of HD-DVD. Of course, Blu-ray is/was singnificantly more expensive to produce as well.


The manufacturers are making money. The players all have a profit margin, they did when they were $1500 and do now at $499 or whatever. Only the game console model requires a monetary loss because of the extensive capbilities contained within.


I have a HD-A3 and PS3 and have rented hundreds of movies with 0 problems playing any of them.

 

[Jive Turkey]



Quote:
Originally Posted by townofturley /forum/post/12871561


Then don't buy anything. You're not ready. It's that simple. Sheesh!

No, the products aren't ready. I've been in the audio/video game and have been an early adopter for three decades.


It is obvious that in the HD disc game, neither camp has been able to get beyond the problems of the format. The players have problems with small scratches on the discs and have numerous operational problems.


I believe that HD-DVD and BluRay has been more glitched out than just about any other new product line that I recall. And after several years in the market, you'd think it would be more ironed out.

 

[jpmst3]

I have not had a single glitch of any kind. I had glitches with my SD DVD players rather than any HD format.


I guess if you don't do any research and buy a player that is plagued with problems that is what you will get.

 

[Jive Turkey]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jpmst3 /forum/post/12874374


I have not had a single glitch of any kind. I had glitches with my SD DVD players rather than any HD format.


I guess if you don't do any research and buy a player that is plagued with problems that is what you will get.

Your success is opposite of mine. DVD players have come and gone in this house without issue. I've owned the HD-A1 since it first came out. While I've had good luck with the updates, there have still been many times a movie has been interuppted by a lockup for whatever reason.


No research? I doubt many spend the amount of hours researching and running around before they buy a product than I do. I find it very frustrating not being able to have confidence to spend the amount of money being asked once your research leads you to a particular product.


Oh, I'll end up buying a BluRay player....maybe sooner than later. And maybe I'll get lucky and get a "good one". My point is that the industry should have already made sure I don't have to roll the dice and get lucky.

 

[jpmst3]

Well, the first generation of any product is prone to problems. My first DVD player was a nightmare. If you want to be on the bleeding edge, you will bleed.


I have an A3 and PS3, but I spend an hour reading before I bought anything. An hour well spent, avoiding hours of unhappiness.

 

[Snuffy101]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Jive Turkey /forum/post/12874319


No, the products aren't ready. I've been in the audio/video game and have been an early adopter for three decades.


It is obvious that in the HD disc game, neither camp has been able to get beyond the problems of the format. The players have problems with small scratches on the discs and have numerous operational problems.


I believe that HD-DVD and BluRay has been more glitched out than just about any other new product line that I recall. And after several years in the market, you'd think it would be more ironed out.

I agree totally. Just because you are an early adopter, doesn't mean you have to put up with half-baked substandard crap like what is available for Blu-Ray and HD DVD. I'm always amazed at the people who jump for this stuff and quickly become fan-boys then defend their ill-advised purchase.

 

[jpmst3]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffy101 /forum/post/12874465


I agree totally. Just because you are an early adopter, doesn't mean you have to put up with half-baked substandard crap like what is available for Blu-Ray and HD DVD. I'm always amazed at the people who jump for this stuff and quickly become fan-boys then defend their ill-advised purchase.

Well, I can't think of a single product of any complexity, electronic or not that was not improved upon due to shortcomings/problems with the original.

 

[DavidHir]



Quote:
Originally Posted by k1davis /forum/post/12872568


Warning.. Rant ahead...


That's the thing. We should be far past the early adopter stage with Blu-Ray.


This is from the Wikipedia Blu-Ray page:




Here it is nearly 6 years after they formed the BDA and there are still no BD players on the market that can output all audio formats as Bitstream, PCM, and analog. The Profile 2.0 Panny BD50 (announced with no street date or price as of yet) will be the first fully feature complete BD player, AFAIK.


They've been charging too much and taking too long to get their act together. Players like the BD50 should have been the $1000 models - a year ago. Now that would have been something worth adopting early.

The Blu-ray format as we know it launched here in the U.S. in June of 2006. What was released six years ago is not quite the same.