[Joshua Snyder]

well, after watching the THX1138 re-issue, I have come to the conclusion that it's not just me, but there is something wrong with the picture that my blue tube throws!


Here you can see the all "White" test pattern from the marquee (run @ low contrast) with the red and green lenses covered.

http://homepage.mac.com/macmedics_jo...69276011D9.jpg


now the screen hotspots some, but that's a large effect, the problem (that t I thought was the screen surface, until now) is the collection of small splotches near the center.



at some point, the lens (HD-8) on the blue tube got a rather nasty scratch on the rearmost surface (the surface closest to the CRT). and I am HOPING that is causing the blotches..... But I am not so sure.


as I can see the splotches on the blue when looking into the lens.


the Tube was a new VDC build. it had been run for 105 hours or so by the installer before my purchase. and it now has approximately 280 hours total. so this is not a case of burn. and the visible surface of the crt seems perfect.


I have not yet had the nerve to swap lenses to see if it follows the lens or sticks with the CRT. (got a movie party coming up, and don't want a long re-convergence session.... but wait... that's just an excuse to tinker... so what am I waiting for?)


there are some other pics that I took this morning up on this page:


http://homepage.mac.com/macmedics_jo...toAlbum20.html



Hope this is something "Fixable"



Josh

 

[Clarence]

Swapping the HD8 lense on the blue with one of the good ones on R or G will only take 5 minutes and no reconvergence will be required.


Also, can you post a picture with the convergence grid. While you have the lens removed, too. This would take the lens completely out of the issue... if the fuzz shows up with the lense removed, you've got "fungus".

 

[Curt Palme]

It does look like phosphor issues. Move the set physically. Do the splotches move with the set? If so, it looks like the tube needs changing..


Curt

 

[Joshua Snyder]

How could the tube nead changing after under 300 hours?


I guess I should not have assumed the problem was on the screen when I first started to set up the PJ.


and all this almost 1 year exactly since I took delivery on the PJ, and it's been this way all along. what a bummer. [EDIT] actualy looking at my records, I purchaced the PJ in March of THIS year, making it under 1 year old.


Will I have to lump it as a consequence of trusting that it could not be the "new" expensice equipment I just purchaces, and had to be the fault of my DIY screen.


Josh

 

[Tim in Phoenix]

Josh


The tube packs a one year warranty from VDC, just phone 'em (318 747 0140) with the serial number of the tube (inside the covers on top of the tube bell). I have spare HD-8s cheep if you need one.

 

[secstate]

Quote:

Originally posted by Joshua Snyder How could the tube nead changing after under 300 hours?

Change the lens to eliminate that as a possiblity and move the projector a little to see if the splotches move with it (eliminates the screen if they do). As to how you can have problems with a new VDC tube, it happens. I had a green that developed pinprick phosphor dropouts on the tube face that manifested themselves pink quarter sized circles on my screen. And this was within 150 hours of use. The first 75 hours or so were at reduced brightness and contrast to break it in.

 

[Curt Palme]

VDC will cover the tube. WHat you can do if you're not comfortabel aligning the tube is to send the tube assembly itself to one of us techs that can assembe and align it in an actual set..


The physical re and re of the tube isn't that bad.


BTW, this is a VDC issue. There's nothing that C RTcinema could have done to prevent this. I'm sure that pretty much every reseller has experienced this..however I do understand the frustration...



Curt

 

[Joshua Snyder]

OK.... so I can pull the tube in it's schroud (the box like thing that the e-homes use around the tubes) with all the magnetics and nec boards attached. and send it to you or tim etc.... You could exchange the tube with VDC, install the bits onto the new tube, and ship the mess back, and i would re-install and hook up said tube in the beast.


What would something like that run me?


any chance of such a Marquee wiz in the wisconsin/chichgo aria?


Josh

 

[Doug Baisey]

Guys,

I have seen this before also on a VDC green. Like Curt says. I find it phosphor cure and in some cases looks 'grainy' and uneven and changes over the first couple hundred hours. The projector is on its second one and is doing the same just a different area. The people that retubed it the first time sent a replacement no problem.


Voltages are ok so I dont have a reason to think its anything else. Doug

 

[Joshua Snyder]

Well, the universe is working against me.


I have lost the tools required to pull the lenses, and I tried to get a look at the serial # on the tube, and while there may be something there, I think that I would have to pull the whole tube in order to get a look.


I have sent an e-mail off to the folks at C R T... and so far, no reply.


and I suppose this problem will only get worse. Perhaps I should have stuck with my Sony 1041... at-least no-matter how hard I tried, I could not kill it.


Josh

 

[secstate]

Quote:

Originally posted by Joshua Snyder Well, the universe is working against me. I have lost the tools required to pull the lenses, and I tried to get a look at the serial # on the tube, and while there may be something there, I think that I would have to pull the whole tube in order to get a look. I have sent an e-mail off to the folks at C R T... and so far, no reply. and I suppose this problem will only get worse. Perhaps I should have stuck with my Sony 1041... at-least no-matter how hard I tried, I could not kill it. Josh

I would say you have to assume it will get worse. I hope you have better luck with C R T xxxxxx than others here.

 

[Curt Palme]

Yes, check with Tim to make sure he'll do it for you, HOWEVER... call VDC first at 800-241-5005 and talk to Brenda BArrett. I'd tell her that for all intents and purposes that the tube was bought from Eric's company, and that they are out of business. I'd say that if they question the warranty issue, the bill of sale from Eric should suffice to get warranty, I'm sure he bought MArquee blue tubes every other week.


I'd get a new blue tube yourself, if there is any warranty issue with that one, it will be a lot easier to deal with than trying to deal through Tim or I down the road.


You might also inquire if you could send that whole tube envelope to them to realign, it might end up being faster and easier. No idea what their rates are though..


Curt

 

[techman707]

Quote:

Originally posted by Doug Baisey Guys, I have seen this before also on a VDC green. Like Curt says. I find it phosphor cure and in some cases looks 'grainy' and uneven and changes over the first couple hundred hours. The projector is on its second one and is doing the same just a different area. The people that retubed it the first time sent a replacement no problem. Voltages are ok so I dont have a reason to think its anything else. Doug

I've seen this SO MANY times with VDC rebuilds that I just won't use them. If you're re-tubing your own projector and get one or two bad tubes and send them back for replacements, that's one thing. If you're doing it for a living and keep getting bad tubes after going through an entire setup, who is going to pay for the time lost? You can't charge the customer (unless they insisted on VDC rebuilds ) and VDC isn't going to pay, so it's YOU that gets stuck. VDC should have "some" quality control and if a bad tube gets through, it should be FREE!

 

[Joshua Snyder]

Update:


called and left a message @ VDC

(Anyone have an e-mail address for Brenda Barrett @ VDC ?)


Started a e-mail dialog with the current incarnation of CRT Cinema.


Due to finances, if I can get this doen at all I will probably be doing it myselfe!!! (Scarry)



and the never ending saga continues...


Josh

 

[eledhel]

If you are looking for a quick (cheap) alternative, I have a blue OEM 180DMB22 tube already mounted in the Marquee sleeve (all electronics included). It has light wear, but had sharp focus when it was previously installed.

 

[Joshua Snyder]

Keith

You have a PM


Josh

 

[Joshua Snyder]

Ok, I am pissed...

Had some time a 5:00 am so I took off the lenses to get a better look...

the splotches are IN the blue tube, and ALL 3 tubes are showing significant wear (not burn (brown), but more like the phosphor is just getting thinner or something), the blue splotches are in-fact spots of NON wear.. or perhaps PROPER wear.


And the blue tube in addition to this thinning, also has remnants of a 4x3 screen, and perhaps even a windows task bar...


I have NEVER run this PJ at 4x3, and never with windows!


take a look :
http://homepage.mac.com/macmedics_jo...toAlbum22.html


and it looks like I will get no warranty help from C R T Cinema... they will give me all the phone support I want... but labor, and new tubes... that's $$ and VLC sounded dubious about replacing the blue... I am sure that it's going to be real GREATE trying to get all 3 done! not to mention that I REALLY don't want to go mucking about in there. That's why I bought the PJ from a place with a warranty! I could have saved a big pile of $$ going with some e-bay crud... but NO.. I go with a LOCAL dealer...



Oh ya.. I have UNDER 300 hours on these tubes... mostly running at under 40 for Bright & Contrast


(well about 25 hours of HD because of it's crushed black levels, the Bright has to go over 50)

 

[Joshua Snyder]

Oh, and for any who look at the pics... it looks MUCH worse in person... the way the Blue look in the pictures, is the way the GREEN looks in-person and it's the best of the lot as far as the "Wear" is concerned.

 

[Curt Palme]

OK, before you go loading the shotgun....


1) The 4:3 image you see is very classic of a rebuilt tube. THat shadow or whatever you want to call if is burnt into the glass itself. I've seen that on tubes here before. As long as it's not apparent in the image, don't worry about it.


2) I guess it is possible that the tubes were not actually conditioned for 100 hours, so you might do that again NOW.


3) I've seen that shadow effect happen on new tubes as well. I bought a set of 600 hour tubes from Tim a while back, and while they didn't have burn per se, you could see a 4:3 shadow sort of like your tubes on the face of the tubes. I got supreme crap from the customer that sent on about me misrepresenting the tubes, but this is NORMAL out of high lumen sets. I've also seen it on NEC and Barco sets. So as long as there is no discoloration on the screen, don't worry about it.


I put 100 hours of conditioning on my personal NEC PG Xtra, and ran it for about 200 hours. You could see the 4:3 pattern on the VDC tube, but you couldn't see the wear on the screen.


4) There's no question your blue tube is bad. I had a Barco green do it this weekend, worse than yours after about 200 hours of use. Get that back to VDC ASAP.


Curt

 

[Joshua Snyder]

well, I am picking up a lightly worn OEM blue with all magnetics this weekend, so I will just be able to do a clean swap... then start the disassembly process on that VDC. Hopefully Wednesday I will be able to swap the tubes.


what is the recommended conditioning method? Run a defocused wight field at low C & B for 100 hours? what levels of focus& phosphor coverage are used?


j