[BluRay Hoarder]

Hi Guys,



Been reading on here but never posted. I can usually find what I need from previous threads.

Just to give you an idea of my use and purpose.



Just have a few questions. Its prob useful to know what I use it for.


I only watch Movies. Blu Ray with Lossless 90% of the time . Standard 1080i cable once in a while with my wife and apple TV . Something about listening to lossless audio... Once I heard it I couldn't go back. Got a netflix Blu Ray membership 3 at a time and Rip and burn each one. Image for image. No trying to strip audio and shrink the file and get complicated.. 25 and 50gig discs through AnyDVDHD and cyberlink media suite.


TV: Samsung UN65EH6000

Apple TV

Monster Power Center HDP1800. (Rec and sub plugged into High current audio filter. Made a difference)

Monster Powernet 300 and 200 Ethernet Link Hardline Lan to all devices.

Monster 14G cable on the component setup.

1.4v HDMI all around and the TV doesn't support 3d or ARC.

Samsung Cable box



Never listen to music on it at all.


I also have a very strange side and shaped room . high ceilings. long without wall behind couch. Pics should be below. .



Option 1-

I have a Bose V25 Setup which sounds great. AdaptIQ is nice and the UI is really simple and nice for the wife.

Self explanatory setup. Honestly if I knew anyone who couldn't figure out how to set up the bose I would delete them in my phone and chalk them up as a loss....



Option 2- Quintet SL 5 set of speakers ( First step into the world of Audio. Bought 3 yrs ago)

-Brand new Pioneer Elite VSX-53 (used to run a Pioneer VSX- 819H and still do have it but got the VSX-53 on a good deal new and figured if try 7.1 at some point)

-Sony SA-WM40 Subwoofer



I've had forever. Not sure if its good relative to what's out today but I like it for now.


Depending on feedback Im open to anything. Component setup is very different than the Bose, not necessarily good or bad just different. .... This Reciever is pretty hard hard to figure out. Advanced MCACC is cool and works but then you still have a million options and I never know if Its the best settings. or "Optimal" even under the Optimal Surround option.


The manual is 100 pages too of details. Not BS stuff either like " use caution playing in the bath tub and shower" . All detailed audio technology.




Was happy with the Bose I put in a few months back but when I got this VSX-53 I figured I would sell it if I didn't like it or the 7.2 wasn't what I thought . Wife was away today I just set them up next to each other to test switching back and forth . Cables everywhere. .. More I read though the more I kept thinking WHAT IF... What if I add two Decent towers and second sub and set this up 7.2. I haven't noticed much on the Video processor in the new VSX-53 but Im sure itll be noticeable with the right media or 2 new subs if the old one isn't good. . Of course I saw how many people say that Bose is a rip off and a good rec and a half decent set of surrounds you will" blow the bose away" but honestly I have them setup next to each other. quick switch of an HDMI and its not that easy of a decision



So what do you guys think. Which one should I stick with . If I keep the pioneer I would like to go 7.2. If you suggest that route then what do you think I should change. And trust me, If you tell me to throw it all out but the receiver I wont be offended. Just feel like I have too many options and could use advice. .


The room is the most difficult part of surround setup. Its like a half pentagon with no back wall. Hard to define FL FR RL RR. 25 ft pitched ceilings. TV mounted High


If the pics don't come up let me know. First time using this and I can also scan a diagram to scale with position and aim of current setup.


Thanks for the help and I look forward to checking in here later and becoming a more active member now that I have components that require configuration.



After a preview I see some of the photos are during move in and uneccessary but cant figure out how to get them off this thread. Sorry.

 

[dannybenz]

Keep the Pioneer. Sell everything else, comeback on here tell people how many speakers you want, how loud you listen, your budget etc and you will get more replies.

 

[Elihawk]

Bose, or Quintet systems will not fill that space adequately. You need to look at respected speakers with at least 5 inch driver, at the very least!

 

[BluRay Hoarder]



Quote:
Originally Posted by dannybenz  /t/1468063/bought-both-bose-and-com...e-advice-pics-of-difficult-room#post_23198331


Keep the Pioneer. Sell everything else, comeback on here tell people how many speakers you want, how loud you listen, your budget etc and you will get more replies.

I mentioned I was open to hearing that advice and I don't need to sell the rest to buy what I want first so there is no need to come back later. So now is just a good a time as any to ask what would be a better upgrade. As I mentioned I would like 7.2 ideally but given the space do you think I can pull that off? The actual listening area is not that large. I listed LOUD but need to be able to have dialog enhancement at low volumes when I am with my wife. I would like to skip the hassle of researching a bunch of new stuff and just buy two compatible floor standing FL and FR to add and push the original Quintet ones to the FLWide and FRWide. Or even FLHigh and FRHigh given the ceilings. What do you think about that after seeing the pictures? about a 7.2 setup. My budget is under 1500 for the new speakers IF im goin to pair the current klipsch but I imagine that would be useless to pair with these and might as well just look at a better 5.2 setup instead? If I start fresh , keep the pioneer I would be looking about 3500 budget and get a whole new system. 5 or 7.2 would like floor standings though either way for FL and FR.



Can I ask why you say to sell the rest though?

 

[BluRay Hoarder]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk  /t/1468063/bought-both-bose-and-com...e-advice-pics-of-difficult-room#post_23198339


Bose, or Quintet systems will not fill that space adequately. You need to look at respected speakers with at least 5 inch driver, at the very least!

With Respect Eli, Both fill the space well... seating area is about 15x15. open back but I sit and watch movies only so they aren't filling the room . just hit me in the center of that couch. So after spending some time now with my SPL meter and RTA analyzer, They fill the room quiet well and even. The Klipsch ,after posting impressed me actually with their output just now . All 5 current channels hit my seating position perfectly and I have very little mid range loss from 300-2000 or 2k to 5khz on the klipsch and none on the Bose. Ive come on here and read frequently and people are pretty nice and respectful of others setups whether they are loaded or on a budget but your comment was in accurate and didn't address anything in my questions above. I hope this isn't how all the responses are. I dabble and understand but don't have time so sit and research a lot of new things without some direction. I did just find a similar thread though minus owning bose and there was a very helpful bunch of advice about some klipsch towers to add to the Quintet SL5 speakers making a 7.1 system. I didn't see anyone say anything about them being a non respect speaker?


Can I ask you now what makes you think it would not fill that theatre adequately and why the 5 inch drivers you mentioned would be so necessary ?


What setup do you currently have?

 

[Elihawk]

Both the quintet and the Bose companion system are satellite speaker systems with small drivers- 2.5 or 3 inch driver. Simple physics, those speakers are not capable of filling the space and especially the bass will be lacking (your listening area might be 15 x 15, but high ceiling and open floor plan equal a large footage to fill). First, the Bose system has no tweeters and no real subwoofer, so you are getting a really compromised SQ with most Bose sat systems. So the quintet system is better! However, even Klipsch lovers will tell you that system will not fair well versus decent speakers with bigger drivers.

I have a 20 x 20 room (no high ceilings) and have a EMPtek system in the front (5eti and e5ci center, some SLS surrounds) and a klipsch 12" sub. In my bedroom setup, I have def tech sm450s and a Martin Logan sub in a 2.1 system. My EMPtek system sounds and looks great, but the speakers aren't small (simple physics, small driver move smaller amount of air and produce less sound).

What is your budget?

 

[Elihawk]

Sorry, now I see your budget in the follow up post. Either the Bose or the quintets would be adequate as rear surrounds/ heights. For HT, bigger fronts/center will give you better dynamics and for that space, a 12 or 15 inch sub with good power would be optimal.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk  /t/1468063/bought-both-bose-and-com...e-advice-pics-of-difficult-room#post_23199027


Sorry, now I see your budget in the follow up post. Either the Bose or the quintets would be adequate as rear surrounds/ heights. For HT, bigger fronts/center will give you better dynamics and for that space, a 12 or 15 inch sub with good power would be optimal.

Thank you for that . That's just what I was looking for. some logic behind advice and all that made perfect sense. Tuning the 12 inch I have now correctly I thought would make up for the lower mid range that the quintets didn't hit. Meter didn't raise any flags but like you said simple physics is what drove me to post thinking I needed SOME larger ones even if they're just Front towers. The Quintets are not bad for Rear surrounds or for front highs youre saying so at least I don't have to toss them but going on your advice so far, you're suggesting I buy a new front stage . Towers, and a good center. then use the Klipsch to fill the rest of the 7.2. As for my current sub Its an oldie so I don't know how it fairs with todays ones but could I keep it and setup and second 12 inch in another area of the room or get 2 new matching 12s and put them in different spots of the room.


When you saw the space do you see what I mean when I ask if I can benefit from the 7.1? behind me is plenty of space but the core of the sound is in front of me and with new fronts and centers .. the "Front wides" I was originally thinking would be just a few feet between the front and rear speakers seeming useless.


Do you think I should kick the wides and just do front highs given the space and height of the room. Again, this way saves the quintets and I just have to look into better quality ,compatible, and large enough speakers for new FR C and FL. Am I on the same page as you?


do you have any suggestions for a new front stage in that price range I mentioned and are compatible. I can get a set of Klipsch Rf- 62 II floor standings for $250 ea new normally about 400-500 ea. http://www.klipsch.com/rf-62-ii-floorstanding-speaker





The bose is setup to run on their lifestyle system receiver so if I don't use it all I cant use anything. coax connections and stripping those connections and plugging them into a receiver was pretty embarrassing. But they don't sound bad when setup on their proprietary system. Good thing about these going is that I can sell and increase my budget knowing those will be sold once broken down and reboxed and put online.


Thanks for putting in the time Please feel free to jump in anyone who is reading and comment. I will post a birds eye outline of the room size and angles in a few also.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]

I posted a comment back waiting for moderator to approve? meantime I thought youd want to know I paid 1000 for the v25. not retail.

 

[flyng_fool]

I see lots of reflective surfaces which are probably why you cant tell the difference between the two systems. Get an area rug, some curtains, pillows etc. to soak up some of the reflections and you'll see that the Pioneer/Quintet system will have a clear edge over the Bose.

 

[ack_bk]

The Bose V25 is what, $2500 or so? For that money you can get some nice speakers, especially since you have a receiver.


The honest truth is that the Bose speakers have holes throughout the frequency response and you are literally missing things along the way. You could keep the Quinent speakers as surrounds if you would like.


My advice? Go to a couple audio stores and see what $1500 or so buys you. Keep $800-1000 of your budget and set it aside for a good subwoofer you can buy online.


There are also some very good online speaker companies that sell speakers in your price range that would be much better than the V25 system. Ascend, Hsu, SVS, Aperion, etc.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]

I bought the v25 for 1000. My friend is one of the head engineers as Bose is Framingham MA. I'm from Boston originally. Out in CA now. The main thread headline is about the room so I agree but THAT is where I have no idea how to integrate into the whole picture.


Are the reflections going to be an issue no matter what I do going forward? I have a lot of couch space. ALOT of pillows now . Drapes on the right side about 10ft high. Left side is just the stair rail which I can't do much about. AND as you know, behind me is just the abyss for sound.


Would getting more speakers (7.1 or 7.2) with some better quality leave me with just more sounds reflecting horribly making things worse or help the reflection problem?


Sorry for not knowing much but I have little knowledge about reflections other than tuning the sound processor in my car's custom sound system. Reflections from my front two were a pain.







Side note, as I read I rarely hear much about the cubed footage of the area. Always square footage. I KNOW these ceilings cant help me much but how do I consider them into everything. ex. , Make sure I add front Highs...Aim speakers downward... Get a certain type of Speakers/Driver....


Im sure there is no perfect answer to that but curious of any suggestions now that you brought that up.

 

[flyng_fool]

Constant Directivity type speakers can help with some of the reflected sound. You could look at some larger speakers with horns. Be careful of the cheaper Klipsch and BIC speakers, many guys here say they can be a bit harsh and fatiguing. Although the Quintet has a horn, it's a bit on the small side for your space.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]



Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk  /t/1468063/bought-both-bose-and-com...e-advice-pics-of-difficult-room#post_23199985


The Bose V25 is what, $2500 or so? For that money you can get some nice speakers, especially since you have a receiver.


The honest truth is that the Bose speakers have holes throughout the frequency response and you are literally missing things along the way. You could keep the Quinent speakers as surrounds if you would like.


My advice? Go to a couple audio stores and see what $1500 or so buys you. Keep $800-1000 of your budget and set it aside for a good subwoofer you can buy online.


There are also some very good online speaker companies that sell speakers in your price range that would be much better than the V25 system. Ascend, Hsu, SVS, Aperion, etc.

Do you mean I should shop what 1500 buys me for all new speakers plus 1000 for a sub or just 1500 on towers and Center. Most of the time I shop at an AV store the salesmen are pretty ignorant. No idea what theyre talking about and if I happen to find a shop they know what they're talking about... They are commissioned and just get technical thinking I wont understand and in the process they show me they haven't listen to my needs/situation and want to sell me what they think is right with little to no idea what I need


That's why my budget isn't really set in stone. Im flexible . I know that makes advice harder but that's why I am trying to just keep it to a step or 2 above a beginner setup. With a mid-range budget. Im not the guy who wants an awesome system for $600 and expects the world and on the other hand I am not the guy who wants to drop thousands per speaker and spend 7k on a system. I'm happy having some of the core pieces being pricey like fronts and center ( or whatever others on here advise are the more important pieces).


I can buy now though and sell the rest later on . I'm not dependent on that income which should make this easier for me. I can get speakers installed in here and test them or today if need be and if they don't pan out I'll just return them and try again.



I have a hook up at Bose which I know no one likes and I have a hook up at Fry's Electronics also. They re no magnolia but I bet they'll carry something useful to me .



What do you guys think about that Klipsch reference 62 II set I posted earlier?



Thanks again all. I know im not making things easy for you all to advise me on but if this was easy, we wouldn't need this site

 

[ack_bk]

For your, you have to add height x width x length to get your total cubic footage. And you need to do this for your the entire space if it is open. Especially for your subwoofer, you really need to factor in the sheer size of the room.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]





Here is the layout I found and hand drew some stuff to help with the photos. One is just layout if anyone wanted to doing a little Microsoft paint work themselves and the other is my bose placement with V speakers. you can see how it is hard to decide where the fronts should go OR where to put the rears . Ive tried other options but go back to this eventually because it looks better placed on than in the middle of a walkway on a stand. Also no wall behind me to bounce anything off of.



Sub has been in that corner. next to fireplace and behind couch . All were great but fireplace area lost some power it seemed. I only put it there to plug it into the high current slot on my power center without an extension cord



Fell free to edit. ;-)


Thanks

 

[BluRay Hoarder]

Thank you,



I was wondering where cubed footage came into play. Square is all manuals talk about. How do I account for that pitch ceiling angle when calculating. Its not a normal high flat ceiling


Ill go measure some stuff and get back to you guys.

 

[BluRay Hoarder]



Quote:
Originally Posted by flyng_fool  /t/1468063/bought-both-bose-and-com...e-advice-pics-of-difficult-room#post_23200331


Constant Directivity type speakers can help with some of the reflected sound. You could look at some larger speakers with horns. Be careful of the cheaper Klipsch and BIC speakers, many guys here say they can be a bit harsh and fatiguing. Although the Quintet has a horn, it's a bit on the small side for your space.

The Klipsch towers I mentioned earlier I can get at half price new are the beginning size of their higher end series. They have horns as well and for lows I am almost certainly going to get two 12 inch subs since this rec has 2 preouts for it.



Any idea why there are two HDMI outs on this rec? Just to run a second display?

 

[chashint]

I recommend getting this http://www.sounddistributors.com/buynow.asp?action=detail&prid=814&crid=305&cat_name=HOME+THEATER+BUNDLES (put Tv15) in the coupon code field in the shopping cart.

And then get this http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-2mk4.html to go with them.

You will not have trouble deciding which is better between these and the Bose.

Use the Quintets for surrounds.

 

[Elihawk]

At the very least, get a set of decent bookshelf or tower speaker and HEAR the difference between a mire full range speaker and the satellite system you have.

On recommedation...the ascend acoustic cmt340 or 170! I don't own them, but gave extensively heard them and they are a great speaker...and for 900 dollars for the L-C-R, that is a great speaker for the price!