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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey all -


Well given that the Bravo was $179 I decided to go ahead and TRY the world of DVI and the 5500 despite the fact that so many here have said that is a beatdown.


I don't have the firmware upgrade (yet) and I have been REALLY loving this projector for the last year with a Panny RP82 over component. Just awesome.


Anyway - I hooked up the Bravo and WHOA! Holy cow that's a nice image! It really was amazing - sharp, bright, colorful and SMOOTH AS GLASS. Unbelievable.


Well of course then I was like - OK - better start looking for the problems (jeez - thanks guys! ;) )


I watched about 4 hours of sample flicks - T2 Extreme disk, The Matrix, Rushmore, Master of the Flying Guillotine etc. and then sat down and watched the Two Towers.


I did not see a single tear.


Finally on the Two Towers I started to see what folks have been talking about with the "judder" on slow pans...but, for us normal humans out here in HT land - I must say I didn't mind AT ALL. I watched with my girlfriend - she noticed NOTHING. She was impressed by how crisp the picture looked - but I was kind of ooohing and ahhhing (esp. during the gollum sequences) so that's cheating.


I just wanted to mention that for casual viewers (I know that's not the majority of the viewers on this forum) you MAY find that the Bravo D1 over DVI to the Hitachi 5500 is AWESOME. For $179 you might risk it - I'm glad I did!


I am sure some disks might be better than others but I tried about 10 - some with great encoding and some cheapo disks - all loaded fine, looked amazing and did not tear. I did not notice judder at all except during the slow pans on Two Towers, and frankly after the first few times I stopped looking for it and did not notice it anymore - even though I am sure it was there. I guess I found the judder "unobtrusive" to a normal viewing experience.


Well - I don't want to encourage folks to go out and blow $179 on something that will drive them crazy - I wanted to mention how much I liked using the Bravo D1 and the 5500 together. It really looks great and I enjoyed watching movies with it.


Just one simple man's opinion!
 

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I love my 5500 when I had it. At that time we did not have the D1 so I did not get a chance to see this combo but I do remember my picture and I think the 5500 has better blacks and contrast than the JVC SX.


Anyone out there have any experience with both that care to comment?


ddemay I glad your enjoying your system. Thats what its all about.
 

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Alan


I had the SX21 for a week. I found its contrast, color and black level much better the the 5500.
 

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ddmay,


I completely agree with you about the Bravo D1 and the Hitachi 5500. Friends to whom I have described judder are the only ones who have noticed it. And they are usually too busy enjoying the movie to care about it. There is also no tearing in the picture.


A DVD played through DVI on the Hitachi 5500 has less haze, more stability , more natural colors, more detail, more depth, and a smoother and more filmlike picture than when played through a player with really good component outputs.


The improvement in picture quality of DVI over good component is not subtle - especially on larger screens.


The Momitsu is a very good alternative to the Bravo if judder is too much to bear. Since the Momitsu also sends out RGB at the same time as DVI, an RGB-DVI adapter can be used to send RGB to the Hitachi. If the 5500 has the firmware upgrade, then there will be no judder through the RGB inputs. The RGB from the Momitsu is very close in picture quality to DVI.


Both the Bravo D1 and Momitsu V880 have the same great picture quality through DVI. Their lack of HDCP is another important benefit for 5500 owners. A DVI DVD player with HDCP will not show a picture through a non-HDCP DVI input on a projector. Unless one has an HTPC or is allergic to judder, the Bravo/Momitsu is the best inexpensive way to view DVD's on the Hitachi 5500.


Noel
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I spent the afternoon rolling through the options with HItachi and the Bravo - and doing an A/B to the Panny82 over component.


There really isn't much comparison in PQ between the Bravo DVI and Panny 82 over component - DVI wins hands down.


I will say this - judder may bother you A LOT - if it does - I would say overall the "experience" of watching with the Panny 82 is better, even with the softer image.


If you don't know what judder is and ask your average viewer to compare I think they'll say DANG that Bravo player looks AMAZING! What's judder? ;)


I think I am getting the best image (all things considered) running DVI 480p with Bravo set at 4:3 Letterbox to a full screen 4:3 setup on the Hitachi.


480P Bravo set to 16:9 and the hitachi on 16:9 looks basically identical.


720P BRavo set to 4:3 and Hitachi set to 4:3 seems to induce slightly more judder - looks pretty darn good though - possibly a little better than 480P but hard to say.


720P Bravo set to 16:9 and Hitachi at 16:9 - INTERESTING! Seems to resize and rescale whole image - possibly closer to a 1:1 because it looks quite nice. I detected possibly slightly more judder than 480P though - I would be tempted to run this mode but will test some more.


1080i Bravo = no sync on Hitachi - sigh


The Bravo and the Hitachi are basically the bomb! I can easily forget about the judder while watching a movie - although I am sure there are those who it would drive completely nuts. All I can say is that I ain't telling anyone unless they ask - cuz no one but me seems to notice it! ;)


Alan - I only saw the SX 21 in action once and it looked VERY NICE - and I would say that the blacks are a little better - the contrast I don't know, but seems likely the SX 21 is a little better.


I must admit that I love the fact that you can fall in love with a projector all over again upon getting a new DVD player. I really thought the DVI thing was going to be HORRIBLE - but for me its great and judder is hardly a distraction. I am sure every once in awhile I will notice something, but overall its going to be hard to go back to my Panny! Maybe to disguise those really bad disks that have bad encoding that DVI really shows off a little more than analog. ;)


Alan - you are so right that its about how you like to watch stuff. Things that don't bother me really bug others and vice-versa.


I would love to hear some other opinions about the Bravo and the Hitachi 5500 or 5600.
 

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OK OK OK


You guys sold me....


I'm gonna get a Bravo to go with my 5500...


Not having the firmware upgrade isn't goning to be a problem is it?


Riz
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by noelm
ddmay,



The improvement in picture quality of DVI over good component is not subtle.

Both the Bravo D1 and Momitsu V880 have the same great picture quality through DVI. Their lack of HDCP is another important benefit for 5500 owners. Unless one has an HTPC or is allergic to judder, the Bravo/Momitsu is the best inexpensive way to view DVD's on the Hitachi 5500.


Noel


So, when I get my new Samsung HLN467w (with HDCP) the new Bravo D1 dvd player will work with the Sammy, even though the D1 does not have HDCP?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by kmil
So, when I get my new Samsung HLN467w (with HDCP) the new Bravo D1 dvd player will work with the Sammy, even though the D1 does not have HDCP?
Yes
 

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I owned the 5500 for a year before I hooked up the DVI with the Bravo and the image was greatly improved. The judder bothered me so much that I ended up replacing the 5500 with the JVC SX21. The SX21 has better color and contrast. I suspect my 5500 could have been tuned to improve the color I just was unable to get it as good as the SX21.


But believe it or not I now see tearing on 16:9 images with my SX21 using the Bravo D1. The tearing appears near the bottom of the image. You can not see it on 1:85:1 or wider movies. I've contacted Vinc and AVS (whom I purchased the SX21 from) to help me resolve the tearing issue. Has anybody else seen this? It is noticable in movies like Ice Age or Spiderman.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by William Wallace


But believe it or not I now see tearing on 16:9 images with my SX21 using the Bravo D1. The tearing appears near the bottom of the image. You can not see it on 1:85:1 or wider movies. I've contacted Vinc and AVS (whom I purchased the SX21 from) to help me resolve the tearing issue. Has anybody else seen this? It is noticable in movies like Ice Age or Spiderman.
What settings are you using for the Bravo D1 and the SX21?


Is the tearing in the active picture area?
 

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On 1.78 format movies the tearing is on the active picture area, just near the bottom. I've tried 720P and 1080i on the D1. I also did the firmware upgrade.


The tearing appears like the bottom 20 or 30 lines is lagging behind the rest of the image by a split second.


For the JVC I am using 16:9 screen, Aspect or Panel. Both settings cause the tearing. I have not been able to get the custom settings working on the D1 so the 1:1 mapping image is not sized correctly with 720P or 1080i.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by William Wallace
I have not been able to get the custom settings working on the D1 so the 1:1 mapping image is not sized correctly with 720P or 1080i.
Some one with PowerStrip could help you with the custom settings for the Bravo D1 and SX21. Try a request on the HTPC Forum.
 

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Hi Guys,


What DVI cable did you use? DVI-I or DVI-D, single or dual link? Can one splice the cable "in the field" without losses? If you are feeding DVI input - can you adjust picture width like in RGB mode 1 and 2?


Thanks,
 

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DVD-D, single-link only. I wouldn't try and splice one together if I were you, it's a very finicky transmission medium.
 

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Thanks Michael, - I may not have the other choice...Tuesday Ernie is coming to hook-up his D1 and if I prefer the DVI with tearing over components without - I may hove to try to splice the cable because I did not provide big enough conduit. Digital domain - 0 or 1 right? It is a cable with overall shield - right?


Do you have the answers to the rest of the questions...?


Thanks,


Jacek
 

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Jacek,

Just curious, why not RGB without the tearing instead of DVI with tearing or the rather crummy component output?


I user the RGB exclusivly (with the firmware upgrade) and have been very happy with all video (DVD, HDTV, SDTV).



Thanks,

Marcus
 
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