[Rgb]

I am using Ubuntu 7.04.


I have several other PC's on the network with XP Pro, all of them with shared drives attached.


I routinely burn DVD's at 4x over 100Mbit Ethernet from one XP Pro machine to another, using Nero or IMGBurn. I burn data and Video DVD's, and data CD's and VCD's.


I tried doing burning a data CD on the Ubuntu 7.04 box this morning. I tried to drag two files from a XP Pro network share into K3B, but K3B responded with an error, complaining it couldn't add files from a network drive.


I then tried Brasero. I was able to compile the disc from the network shared files, but during the burn process, it copied the files locally first, then burned the disc.


This is unacceptable. I burn files directly over the network all the time from one XP Pro machine to another, and even on an old 1999 Win98SE load, burning DVDs on the Win98SE box from XP Pro shares two floors up and over 100 feet of Cat5e and through two switches, no issues. This has never required file copying the files before burning, which vastly increases the time to burn a disc.


Are there any other Linux apps and/or network settings I need to try in order to repliate the direct network share file burning I've been doing on Win98SE and XP?


Any way to get K3B to add network shared files? If so, will K3B burn them without first file copying them locally?

 

[newlinux]

Are the network drives you trying to burn from mounted on the machine you are running k3b on? If not, try mounting the network share and then access the file from the mount point in k3b.

 

[Rgb]

I believe I browsed to the network drive with the files I wanted to burn from the standard Gnome file manager/netwrok browse app, right clicked on the drive with the files, then selected "Mount". Does this mount the drive appropriately?


I then tried to add the files into K3B from this "mounted" drive.

 

[newlinux]

Hmm, I've never used nautilus to mount, I always do it commandline or access shares I have automatically mounted at boot (and I mostly use KDE these days). I found nautilus to be a little unreliable in the networking area. Have you installed smbfs?


I would try the commandline mounting:


sudo mkdir /media/

sudo mount -t smbfs -o username=,password= /// /media/


Which will mount it readonly. If there is no username and password needed you can omit the -o username=,password=...


Read/Write access for everyone can be done by doing:


sudo mount -t smbfs -o username=,password=,dmask=777 /// /media/

 

[newlinux]

I should note I haven't had any problems doing anything with files on windows shares that I've mounted, but I can't recall if I've ever tried burning anything from a windows share... Most of network file sharing is through samba, but mostly Linux to Linux. It strikes me as very odd if k3b can't or won't do it. I'd be unhappy too. Maybe try gnomebaker. Maybe others have ideas?

 

[mym6]

Here's why. GNOME and KDE are actually using smbclient or a method like it to access and retrieve files, it's not actually mounting the windows share. Because of this, it behaves just like IE would on Windows when accessing an FTP site. It *looks* like windows explorer but it isn't, you have to copy files from the FTP site first. So burning items from over the network fails in Linux if you do it this way. You have to actually mount the shares as newlinux is explaining.


Years ago I created some scripts that would work with KDE that would act very much like Network Neighborhood did on Win98. It used smbclient and autofs to automatically create and mount Windows shares by creating special icons as you drilled down. I long gave up on using Linux for day to day tasks like burning CD's and DVD's because of issues like this so I don't have the scripts around anymore.


What you can do if you're Windows shares do not change is create /etc/fstab entries for the shares. This way they can be mounted at boot time.

 

[Rgb]

Then how do the Win98SE and XP Pro boxes automagically find and use all shared drives on any PC in the house, without any explicit, manual mounting process?


Couldn't Ubuntu be configured to automatically do the low level mounting, similar to whatever automatic drive mounting Win98SE and XP Pro does?


If not, is there a GUI front end utility to setup the local mount points and fstab settings to automount the Windows shares at bootup per the above posts?


While I don't have a big issue with commandlines and editing config files, I can see the eyes roll of Windows fanbois and noobie Win->Ubuntu converts who need their hand held every step of the way, and need thier Fisher Price GUI's

I *really* yearn for the pre-Internet days (even the Early Internet years prior to 1998 or so) when you'd be laughed off *any* discussion board for not knowing or be willing to edit a config file, whether on Windows or anything else. We're all racing to the bottom

 

[Rgb]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mym6 /forum/post/0



I long gave up on using Linux for day to day tasks like burning CD's and DVD's because of issues like this so I don't have the scripts around anymore.


.

Wow. That's a pretty drastic indictment.


While I regret having to manually establish local mountpoints to get the network drive burning behavior I'm accustomed to between Windows machines on my network, I still plan to migrate my machines to Ubuntu.


For local files, I don't think there are any issues with burning or other "day to day" tasks in Ubuntu.

 

[newlinux]

I think Linux just does this differently. I don't know any reason why it can't, it just doesn't by default. As mym6 showed with his scripts, all you would need to do is write a script for use with nautilus or some other client to mount. There may be clients out there that do this. I guess for many (like me) it isn't a big concern because my windows shares don't change, and thus I just have my /etc/fstab settup to mount all necessary drives at boot.


Windows doesn't really mount drives in the way that linux does. But the way Linux does it offers a lot more flexibility for the filesystem. Try moving C:\\Windows to another partition or drive (the registry would probably get totally out of whack). Moving /usr to another partition or drive wouldn't be so difficult (you could actually make it transparent when setting up the mount point).


I don't mean to sound standoffish or anything, but I don't think it necessary for Linux to accomodate the way people do things in windows, nor do I think it is Windows job to do so for Linux. They are both their own OS with pluses and minuses. If people started off using Linux they would find the way things are done in windows to be odd.


I'll look around for a client.... though. I agree a client would ease the pain of those transitioning from windows.

 

[newlinux]

maybe linneighborhood? I'm not at my linux machine so I can't try it out...

 

[mym6]

Somewhere there was a tool, linneighborhood could be it. The problem in my mind is that it's *another* tool to use and know. It would be much nicer if it just worked as windows explorer did. Ubuntu 7.04 shows signs of some real progress towards ease of use with tools like the restricted driver manager and the super nice touch of telling you which package provides a certain program and even which apt source you need.


The issue you're running into is a long standing one but it's getting better. Windows allows you to use URI paths to get to items on a network. Linux just doesn't. It mimicks it. Look at OS X. It doesn't, to my knowledge, let you access items via URI either. Instead, it forces you to mount the share. You might not realize it, but that what it is truly doing under the GUI. If I had to guess, I'd say it would take a tweak to the kernel in order to allow Linux to truly be able to use URI paths for burning files because it's a fundamental difference between Windows and Linux.


Now forum rules state we shouldn't argue the virtues of Linux and Windows and I agree, it's a tool and it's whether or not the tool fits the bill. For me personally, I prefer XP for my day to day tasks because I'm so much more of a CLI Linux person that it makes more sense for me to run Windows and use Putty to access my Linux machines. That way I can get everything I like about XP + access my Linux systems so I can grep, awk, vim and CLI all day.


FWIW, I dual boot on my laptop between XP Home and Ubuntu (now 7.04) so that I can run MythTV and watch TV anywhere in the house over the wireless.

 

[Rgb]

In Windows Explorer->Tools->Map Network Drive, is this the Windows equivalent of manually establishing the mount points in Linux?


To clarify, I never do this in Windows. I just have shortcuts to each PC on the network under the "My Network Places" pick in the directory tree in the left pane of my Explorer windows.


For a time, I was adding and removing PC's and drives all over my network, that permanently mapping drives on any given PC would have been futile.


However, in recent months, I've come to see the wisdom of mapping drives on the XP boxes, and organizing files and network shares to improve organization and discipline on my network.


So, in the long run, I guess setting up hard mount points on Ubuntu clients shouldn't be too bad, assuming it enables me to burn files in realtime without file copying, like I've done on the Win boxes all along.


I'll just miss the ridiculous ease with which you can treat shared drives like local drives on any XP client machine, browsing them from My Network Places. The same holds true for any app under Windows, as all file dialogs allow you to navigate My Network places too.

 

[Rgb]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mym6 /forum/post/0


Here's why. GNOME and KDE are actually using smbclient or a method like it to access and retrieve files, it's not actually mounting the windows share. Because of this, it behaves just like IE would on Windows when accessing an FTP site. It *looks* like windows explorer but it isn't, you have to copy files from the FTP site first. So burning items from over the network fails in Linux if you do it this way. You have to actually mount the shares as newlinux is explaining.

THis might also explain why I'm having problems simply double clicking video files from Nautilus and playing them properly in any media player- mPlayer, Totem, etc.


THe player launches, and it appears the file is loaded- I can see the first frame- but then the media player usually freezes/locks up, or if it starts playing and I try to drag a seek bar, it will lock up.


Of course, these files play fine in MediaPlayer Classic on XP double clicked in Explorer under My Network Places (again, no Mapped Drives), and also play fine when copied locally on the Ubuntu machine.

 

[Rgb]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mym6 /forum/post/0



The issue you're running into is a long standing one but it's getting better. Windows allows you to use URI paths to get to items on a network. Linux just doesn't. It mimicks it. Look at OS X. It doesn't, to my knowledge, let you access items via URI either. Instead, it forces you to mount the share. You might not realize it, but that what it is truly doing under the GUI. If I had to guess, I'd say it would take a tweak to the kernel in order to allow Linux to truly be able to use URI paths for burning files because it's a fundamental difference between Windows and Linux.

.

Guess it's time to hound the Ubuntu development team to add URI support to Nautilus. Maybe we have to hound the Linux kernel guys or Debian teams?


I take these issues as opportunities to feed back to the development teams to improve the experience for Win emigrants

.


Even if they had Ubuntu simply ask "Would you like to add this shared network drive as a bootup mount point?" and then do the config file addition(s) if answered "yes", and then request a reboot, would be nice for recent converts.

 

[mym6]

Yea, that is essentially the same thing.


What I do on the Windows side of my laptop is create small batch scripts with the following in them


@echo off

net use m: \\\\servername\\sharename /yes


Where the server and share name's are different. That script is then placed in a folder and I add the folder to my tool bar at the bottom. This way I get a little flyout menu and I select the script I want to run, thereby mounting the share.


You can do something like this in Linux OR you can read up on automount or autofs, I'm not sure what Ubuntu has in this area. I'm an old Red Hat guy and automount was the method used for automounting floppies and cd/dvd drives. The scripts I mentioned earlier "ended" by accessing an automount "directory" which would in turn mount the share.

 

[mym6]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Rgb /forum/post/0


Guess it's time to hound the Ubuntu development team to add URI support to Nautilus. Maybe we have to hound the Linux kernel guys or Debian teams?


I take these issues as opportunities to feed back to the development teams to improve the experience for Win emigrants

.

You could, though Ubuntu is just one (albeit probably the largest) of many Linux distributions that package the GNOME UI. It might be better to go straight to the GNOME devel guys with your thoughts. Like wise with the kernel though I'm sure they'll shoot you down. There are plenty of user-land items that would be done to accomplish this better.