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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have read many of the posts recently regarding the Mitsu HC4000 vs the Epson 8350, but I have a separate question regarding which one to purchase.


I currently have a Sanyo PLV-Z3 and unfortunately am the sad benefactor of the "blue haze" phenomenon of the LCD panel. The projector has been used approximately 20 hours a week for 5 years. I am not very happy to be purchasing another projector so quickly. For this reason, I am very apprehensive in purchasing another LCD.


Does the "inorganic" LCD panel of the Epson reduce the risk of the LCD degredation?


The current price of the Mitsu is $1295 and the Epson is $1199.


So what do I buy? Again, I really do not want to be dishing out $1200+ every 5 years on LCD's if this degredation continues to be a problem.


The room has almost complete lighting control as it is a bonus room upstairs. My family uses the projector for HDTV, video games, and the occassional Blu-ray movie.


Thanks for your help.
 

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I would say 5 years and all those hours was damn good, whether it's an LCD or DLP. I would guess most people upgrade projectors ABOUT every 3 years. If you think you can buy a projector and use it trouble free for 10-15 years like the tube TV's, forget it. I'd get the HC4000 assuming it will work in your room, and you do not see the rainbow effect with a 4X color wheel.
 

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20 hours a week for 5 years? If it were me I'd be well satisfied that I got my money's worth out of that thing, but each to their own



The LCD's of today are not the ones of 5 years ago, to put it mildly. Today even a "budget" LCD like the 8350 puts out blacks as good as the better DLP projectors from that era.


When you are talking 8350 vs. HC4000 the 8350 wins on:


Price. It's several hundred dollars cheaper than the HC4000, especially if you order it today from several online retailers (Cyber Monday deals).


Picture. DLP vs. LCD is a debate that will never end, but you'd be hard pressed to find a review that finds fault with the 8350's color quality, sharpness, or contrast ratio. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder so I'm not going to claim one is better than the other, only that I imagine you would be hard pressed to notice a difference.


Brightness. The 8350 is as close to a light cannon as you will find in this price range for HT projectors.


Noise: The 8350 doesn't make any. At all. The same cannot be said for the HC4000 with it's spinning color wheel.


Placement: Even for an LCD the 8350 has an exceptionally good zoom range, plus horizontal and vertical lens shift. Combined with the fact that it doesn't make any noise and you can pretty much place it anywhere.


The HC4000 wins on:


DLP. I'm not going to dismiss others opinions on this; some folks just prefer the image DLP produces and there's nothing wrong with that. If this is the case for you then you could do a lot worse than the HC4000.


If not, the 8350 is "Editors Choice" from several leading review sites for a reason. It uses inorganic panels meaning you shouldn't see the image degradation you are worried about. That said, 20 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, 5 years is a lot of use for any PJ - I wouldn't plan on trying to use one for much longer than that, no matter which you buy.
 

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Just be aware of the limited mouting locations of the HC4000. You projector placement is very limited with the HC4000 or any DLP.

The HC4000 may require to be mounted about 12-20" above or below the screen border.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim McC /forum/post/19563902


Some people will say this is a minor thing, but you will have to regularly clean the filter on any LCD projector.

I checked my Sanyo Z2000 filter every 6 months and it was never dirty.

This was in a room with pet traffic and light dust from regular vacuum cleanings.

I kept the door to the room closed when it was not in use.


I guess if you have dust storms in your house or have a LOT of dead skin, the filter may get dirty but cleaning it twice a year is trivial.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Ok. Obviously, my perspective may have some flaws in that I assumed that I would get more life out of my old Sanyo. The usage was maybe a bit overstated, whereas some weeks it would see 20 hours and some weeks maybe none.


Regardless, the blue haze issue started about 2 months after I replaced the bulb for the first time. The haze started to be noticeable around the 4 year mark of ownership. It wasn't bad to start and I didn't pay that much attention to it until it became more obvious.


I appreciate everyone's comments. I have purchased both the Optoma HD20 and the Epson 8350 from the local Best Buy. Since they told me there would not be a restocking fee, I will try them both and see which one works out better.


My fear is that although the Optoma fits in the throw distance range of my current mount, I may have an issue with not having a lens shift when it comes to aligning the lens horizontally.


Price of the Optoma HD20 was $949 and I got a great deal on the Epson 8350 for $1099.


My fear is that the LCD panel will fail quicker than the mechanisms of the DLP. In reading everyone's expectations of both technologies, this may be something I will simply have to get over.


Thanks again.
 

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The 8350 is still too new to call re: panels but given that they are the same/similar to the inorganic panels found in other models it's doubtful you'll have a problem a few years down the road.


While the HD20 is close price-wise, and is a decent projector in it's own right I'd be surprised if you chose it over the 8350. Interested to hear what you think after you try them both.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by avid10s /forum/post/19564331


Ok. Obviously, my perspective may have some flaws in that I assumed that I would get more life out of my old Sanyo. The usage was maybe a bit overstated, whereas some weeks it would see 20 hours and some weeks maybe none.


Regardless, the blue haze issue started about 2 months after I replaced the bulb for the first time. The haze started to be noticeable around the 4 year mark of ownership. It wasn't bad to start and I didn't pay that much attention to it until it became more obvious.


I appreciate everyone's comments. I have purchased both the Optoma HD20 and the Epson 8350 from the local Best Buy. Since they told me there would not be a restocking fee, I will try them both and see which one works out better.


My fear is that although the Optoma fits in the throw distance range of my current mount, I may have an issue with not having a lens shift when it comes to aligning the lens horizontally.


Price of the Optoma HD20 was $949 and I got a great deal on the Epson 8350 for $1099.


My fear is that the LCD panel will fail quicker than the mechanisms of the DLP. In reading everyone's expectations of both technologies, this may be something I will simply have to get over.


Thanks again.

With those two choices, also pay close attention to the fan noise during quiet passages to see if you can tolerate it.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by avid10s /forum/post/19564331


Ok. Obviously, my perspective may have some flaws in that I assumed that I would get more life out of my old Sanyo. The usage was maybe a bit overstated, whereas some weeks it would see 20 hours and some weeks maybe none.


Regardless, the blue haze issue started about 2 months after I replaced the bulb for the first time. The haze started to be noticeable around the 4 year mark of ownership. It wasn't bad to start and I didn't pay that much attention to it until it became more obvious.


I appreciate everyone's comments. I have purchased both the Optoma HD20 and the Epson 8350 from the local Best Buy. Since they told me there would not be a restocking fee, I will try them both and see which one works out better.


My fear is that although the Optoma fits in the throw distance range of my current mount, I may have an issue with not having a lens shift when it comes to aligning the lens horizontally.


Price of the Optoma HD20 was $949 and I got a great deal on the Epson 8350 for $1099.


My fear is that the LCD panel will fail quicker than the mechanisms of the DLP. In reading everyone's expectations of both technologies, this may be something I will simply have to get over.


Thanks again.

The 8350's panels are much improved from the panels that failed you... And I will be very surprised of you pick the HD20 over the 8350 on picture quality, and I prefer the DLP image over LCD... No offense to HD20 owners/fans, I just find it's PQ to be underwhelming for DLP...
 

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I'm not going to dismiss others opinions on this; some folks just prefer the image DLP produces and there's nothing wrong with that. If this is the case for you then you could do a lot worse than the HC4000.

/QUOTE]

Nice to see someone who has enough sense to realize that not everyone sees the same things or has the same tastes, and there is nothing wrong with that...! Too many people have tunnel vision, and expect the sheep to follow them...
 

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avid10s, you're doing the right thing by trying both. A lot of people don't want to put out the money up front like that. But make sure you're comparing apples to apples. Do a basic calibration of both before deciding which you like better. It won't take long(contrast, brightness, color, tint, sharpness). Comparing both out of the box is worthless.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
You won't believe it when I tell you this.....


Just like the little boy in The Sixth Sense..... "I SEE RAINBOWS" !!! Hooked up the HD20 set it on the table at the same distance the mount would be and BOOM! I watched Dark Knight for less than 20 minutes and can't tell you the number of rainbows I experienced. Guess I am just a DLP wuss. Will the rainbows go away once the projector gets warmed up or am I just out of luck as one of the unlucky few who has this problem?


The best part is that I at least figured it out before I went through the trouble of trying to mount the projector.


The 8350 is still in the sealed box. Seems there is no point in this any further.


Again, I appreciate everyone's opinion. I was really hoping for the HD20 since I was/am skeptical about the life of the LCD.


Regarding the picture, I was impressed with the HD20 (comparing it to the old Sanyo I had). When the movie was in the night scenes, I thought it looked pretty good. Regarding the fan noise, I sat right beside it and didn't find it to be a nuiscance. The Sanyo I had before had just about equal amount of noise.


Time to box up the HD20 and return it back to Best Buy. I am grateful to them that they committed to no restocking fee. Also, I purchased their extended warranty. In print, it states that during the four year period it covers dust and the likes. ALSO, it states that it will pay for one bulb replacement. Seeing how I only paid $239 for the warranty and the bulb is probably around the same price, this was a great deal. It's basically like I am buying the bulb now instead of later and still have a warranty in case something happens.


I will let you know my thoughts on the 8350.


Thanks again!
 

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The rainbows will NOT go away. Well, that saved you some time anyway. I normally don't buy ext. warranties, but I do on projectors. I wanted to be covered for 3 years, so I bought a 1 year ext. warranty for $79, when I bought my HC3800. You should consider an ext. warranty(depending on how long you want to keep it).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim McC /forum/post/19566383


The rainbows will NOT go away. Well, that saved you some time anyway. I normally don't buy ext. warranties, but I do on projectors. I wanted to be covered for 3 years, so I bought a 1 year ext. warranty for $79, when I bought my HC3800. You should consider an ext. warranty(depending on how long you want to keep it).

Thanks for all your help Jim. I purchased the four year warranty on the 8350. It was high ($240), but like I said it includes one bulb change so it's like I am getting a bulb with a free warranty.


Obviously, although I have had my theater for 5 years, I am still a newbie when it comes to the technical aspects. Can you please tell me how to best calibrate the projector?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by avid10s /forum/post/19566435


Thanks for all your help Jim. I purchased the four year warranty on the 8350. It was high ($240), but like I said it includes one bulb change so it's like I am getting a bulb with a free warranty.


Obviously, although I have had my theater for 5 years, I am still a newbie when it comes to the technical aspects. Can you please tell me how to best calibrate the projector?

You can download free calibration test patterns here. Go to the "Display Calibration" section here and look for "AVS-709 test patterns". You can also buy a HD cal. disc such as Spears and Munsil or DVE. They talk about those in that section also. You can also go to the thread here for your projector for advice, tips.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ix /forum/post/19562822


I'm not going to dismiss others opinions on this; some folks just prefer the image DLP produces and there's nothing wrong with that. If this is the case for you then you could do a lot worse than the HC4000.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahamay17 /forum/post/19565934


Nice to see someone who has enough sense to realize that not everyone sees the same things or has the same tastes, and there is nothing wrong with that...! Too many people have tunnel vision, and expect the sheep to follow them...

Many people have distinct and opinionated preferences due to having a high degree of satisfaction index over their particular choices. Yes, some are quite adamant in their beliefs, and express them in no uncertain terms, but seldom is there any "Sheep Herding" going on....except by those who sell the Hay the Sheep feed on.



Most frequent Posters offer sage advice based on personal experience and the collected information found on AVS and elsewhere. Yet even then there are critics who feel such offerings amount to someone forcing ideas and beliefs down gullible throats.


The deciding factor is the motives and motivation behind those who simply make such comments about other peoples comments, and those who bother to offer up actual helpful comments. Therein lies a big difference as to what is to be valued and what is to be discounted.


In this case, it's fairly obvious the HD20 is much more a "budget PJ" option than the 8350, which is to be considered a real value on a great many fronts.


The list pro-offered above: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post19562822 ..... of "Pluses" on the 8350 far outweighs that of the HD20. "Rainbows" notwithstanding. Yet there will still be DLP die-hards that will strongly disagree.
 

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The HD20 is truly a budget 1080p DLP. Maybe fine for sports watching in ambient light, but wouldn't be my choice for movie watching in the dark. Heck, I'm a DLP fan and I'd probably chose the 8350 over the HD20 (I also owned an Optoma before, so no love lost for me).


I own the HC3800 DLP (paired with a small gray screen).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan /forum/post/19567017


The list pro-offered above: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post19562822 ..... of "Pluses" on the 8350 far outweighs that of the HD20. "Rainbows" notwithstanding. Yet there will still be DLP die-hards that will strongly disagree.

Well, the 'pros' list on that link were of the 8350 vs HC4000 and I personally don't agree with all of them. Also, that person doesn't seem to have compared them both, only going by what he's read (and I'm guessing he's an 8350 owner).


Put the HD20 in that comparison and you will find that I will disagree far less in that case.


There are posts from those who've had the 8350 and HC4000 side by side and returned the 8350. Same with the 8100 vs HC3800.

i.e. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post19444845
 
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