Could anyone who has calibrated a Fujitsu 50" 30 series with the DVI using a component input from a Sony ES DVD player, give me some advise as to which chapters are most relevant. I seem to be able to get brightness and contrast OK, but am having problems with the rest of the settings, especially those that require use of the colored filters. Thanks
Calibrating Fujitsu with DVI--Advise
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CTBob,
The settings you get using a calibration DVD via a Component input are unlikely to be correct for the DVI input as well. Each input has to be calibrated separately. In fact each combination of source device and input has to be calibrated separately, although you may luck out and find some source devices will work well with a single set of calibration levels through a given input. But it is asking too much to expect calibration levels from one input to work on another input as well.
If you don't have access to a DVD player with an HDMI or DVI output, complete the calibration of the component input with your DVD player and then watch a variety of DVDs over that component connection to train your eye as to what a calibrated picture "looks like". Now switch to your DVI source, perhaps a cable or satellite HDTV box, and start tweaking the settings for that input by eye to get as close as you can to what you are seeing via the calibrated component input and your DVD player. The "steaming rat" thread here will give you some suggestions of things to look for. Calibrating by eye in this fashion, watching lots of different source content and frequently referring back to the calibrated DVD player as your gold standard, is a time consuming process.
If you can borrow a DVD player with an HDMI or DVI output, by all means hook it up and use it to calibrate your DVI input. Although the settings you achieve might not be precisely right for your other DVI source device, they will likely be a lot closer than just starting with the factory defaults.
Alternatively, you might want to try using the settings I just posted here in the "P50 halo effect" thread as a starting point for your DVI input.
--Bob
The settings you get using a calibration DVD via a Component input are unlikely to be correct for the DVI input as well. Each input has to be calibrated separately. In fact each combination of source device and input has to be calibrated separately, although you may luck out and find some source devices will work well with a single set of calibration levels through a given input. But it is asking too much to expect calibration levels from one input to work on another input as well.
If you don't have access to a DVD player with an HDMI or DVI output, complete the calibration of the component input with your DVD player and then watch a variety of DVDs over that component connection to train your eye as to what a calibrated picture "looks like". Now switch to your DVI source, perhaps a cable or satellite HDTV box, and start tweaking the settings for that input by eye to get as close as you can to what you are seeing via the calibrated component input and your DVD player. The "steaming rat" thread here will give you some suggestions of things to look for. Calibrating by eye in this fashion, watching lots of different source content and frequently referring back to the calibrated DVD player as your gold standard, is a time consuming process.
If you can borrow a DVD player with an HDMI or DVI output, by all means hook it up and use it to calibrate your DVI input. Although the settings you achieve might not be precisely right for your other DVI source device, they will likely be a lot closer than just starting with the factory defaults.
Alternatively, you might want to try using the settings I just posted here in the "P50 halo effect" thread as a starting point for your DVI input.
--Bob
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Okey doke. I use Avia instead of DVE, so someone who is more familiar with DVE will have to point you at the right chapters. But basically the idea is this:
You make the basic color adjustments using only the blue filter. The red and green filter are for making more advanced adjustments such as those related to fixing problems with the color decoder (red push being the most common problem). Fujitsu P50's commonly don't have such problems so you'll only be using the Red and Green filters if you want to double check that's the case.
Using the blue filter what you want to do is to set the color richness or saturation with the Color control so that the same amount of Blue is present in both a Blue area as in a White area. You do this by looking through the Blue filter at a Blue area and a White area on screen at the same time (which of course will make both of them look blue) and then tweaking the Color control up and down until they are the same brightness of blue.
You then want to adjust the color hue with the Tint control to get the same amount of Blue in a Magenta area as in a Cyan area. You do this by looking at a Magenta and Cyan area on screen at the same time, again through the blue filter, but this time you adjust with the Tint control until those two are at the same brightness of blue.
Given that you get these two adjustments right and the color electronics and display elements are properly balanced by the manufacturer (as they are in the P50), then ALL of your colors will be in proper balance at least for that particular brightness of the colors on screen. It's then also the job of the display electronics to keep that proper balance across the entire range of colors from dark colors to very bright colors and for all combinations of red, green and blue. The Fujitsu P50 is quite good at this once you get the basic Color and Tint settings right.
Typically, a color adjustment test screen will include all on one screen a Blue bar a White Bar a Magenta Bar and a Cyan bar, so you can stare at it through the blue filter and make both adjustments at the same time. This is useful because the Color and Tint controls tend to interact. That is you will have to iterate a bit to hone in on the sweet spot since each change of one control will subtly modify the setting of the other control as well.
Often the color bars on the colors test screen are broken into two parts, showing the pair of colors you are trying to match in brightness when viewed through the blue filter. This makes it a lot easier to refine the setting since the things you are trying to match are immediately adjacent one above the other.
The Avia test color test screen has a nifty addition beyond this. It includes a patch of the "other" color in each bar and cycles back and forth between that "other" color and the normal color of the bar. That is, the white bar contains a patch that cycles between white and blue, the magenta bar has a patch that cycles back and forth as magenta and cyan, etc. The net effect is that when viewed through the blue filter, the proper adjustment minimizes the flashiness of this patch, since the same amount of blue is there regardless.
So with a little bit of patience, you can get both Color and Tint to settings that produce the correct match of bar brightness for the proper pair of bars when viewed through the blue filter, and that's the settings you want. A good trick here is to set Color clearly too high and then adjust down to the right level. Then set Color clearly too low and adjust up to the right level. If the results are different, set Color to the mid-way point between them. Using that Color setting do the same double check with Tint, again ending up by selecting the midway point. Using that Tint setting, do the both ways check on Color again, and then do Tint again, etc. Each pass should result in smaller and smaller changes -- perhaps no change at all. Eventually you will hone in on a pair of Color settings and a pair of Tint settings that are hard to select between. Try all 4 combos of these and trust your eye as to which combo is best.
There are a couple things you need to watch out for, however. First, your DVD player may be fighting you. Make sure you TURN OFF any "feature" on the DVD player that automatically adjusts colors for any reason whatsoever. Typically this will be labeled a "flesh tone correction" feature. Do this before you begin calibration. In fact it is best to try and set your DVD players controls so that they do the LEAST processing of the image. There will generally be a "picture mode" in the player that is described as doing almost nothing to the image, and the manufacturer's default settings for that mode are usually the ones you want. But do check and make sure they haven't snuck in some feature like "flesh tone correction". Also, use the resolution and cabling that you actually intend to use while watching movies.
Second, all displays have a red or blue bias to their idea of how to display "white". Think of the difference natural objects have when viewed under sunlight, or incandescent lamps, or fluorescent lamps. This bias is due to the relative balance of colors in the light source, and is referred to as Color Temperature.
The Fujitsu allows you to select Color Temperature (in the Precision Setting menu). So even though you have the color balance properly set with the Color and Tint controls, you may still find the image is warmer (redder) or cooler (bluer) than you like. You fix this by adjusting the Color Temperature up or down from "standard".
But the Fujitsu also has different "picture modes" and just what "standard" Color Temperature means is different according to which picture mode you select. In particular, the Dynamic and Conventional picture modes are way too red to begin with, for reasons I won't go into here (the so called "torch" modes). I strongly advise against using either of those.
Personally, I recommend you use the Fine picture mode and calibrate with that picture mode set. As you'll see from my notes in the "P50 halo effect", I prefer the "standard" Color Temperature offered with Fine picture mode.
--Bob
You make the basic color adjustments using only the blue filter. The red and green filter are for making more advanced adjustments such as those related to fixing problems with the color decoder (red push being the most common problem). Fujitsu P50's commonly don't have such problems so you'll only be using the Red and Green filters if you want to double check that's the case.
Using the blue filter what you want to do is to set the color richness or saturation with the Color control so that the same amount of Blue is present in both a Blue area as in a White area. You do this by looking through the Blue filter at a Blue area and a White area on screen at the same time (which of course will make both of them look blue) and then tweaking the Color control up and down until they are the same brightness of blue.
You then want to adjust the color hue with the Tint control to get the same amount of Blue in a Magenta area as in a Cyan area. You do this by looking at a Magenta and Cyan area on screen at the same time, again through the blue filter, but this time you adjust with the Tint control until those two are at the same brightness of blue.
Given that you get these two adjustments right and the color electronics and display elements are properly balanced by the manufacturer (as they are in the P50), then ALL of your colors will be in proper balance at least for that particular brightness of the colors on screen. It's then also the job of the display electronics to keep that proper balance across the entire range of colors from dark colors to very bright colors and for all combinations of red, green and blue. The Fujitsu P50 is quite good at this once you get the basic Color and Tint settings right.
Typically, a color adjustment test screen will include all on one screen a Blue bar a White Bar a Magenta Bar and a Cyan bar, so you can stare at it through the blue filter and make both adjustments at the same time. This is useful because the Color and Tint controls tend to interact. That is you will have to iterate a bit to hone in on the sweet spot since each change of one control will subtly modify the setting of the other control as well.
Often the color bars on the colors test screen are broken into two parts, showing the pair of colors you are trying to match in brightness when viewed through the blue filter. This makes it a lot easier to refine the setting since the things you are trying to match are immediately adjacent one above the other.
The Avia test color test screen has a nifty addition beyond this. It includes a patch of the "other" color in each bar and cycles back and forth between that "other" color and the normal color of the bar. That is, the white bar contains a patch that cycles between white and blue, the magenta bar has a patch that cycles back and forth as magenta and cyan, etc. The net effect is that when viewed through the blue filter, the proper adjustment minimizes the flashiness of this patch, since the same amount of blue is there regardless.
So with a little bit of patience, you can get both Color and Tint to settings that produce the correct match of bar brightness for the proper pair of bars when viewed through the blue filter, and that's the settings you want. A good trick here is to set Color clearly too high and then adjust down to the right level. Then set Color clearly too low and adjust up to the right level. If the results are different, set Color to the mid-way point between them. Using that Color setting do the same double check with Tint, again ending up by selecting the midway point. Using that Tint setting, do the both ways check on Color again, and then do Tint again, etc. Each pass should result in smaller and smaller changes -- perhaps no change at all. Eventually you will hone in on a pair of Color settings and a pair of Tint settings that are hard to select between. Try all 4 combos of these and trust your eye as to which combo is best.
There are a couple things you need to watch out for, however. First, your DVD player may be fighting you. Make sure you TURN OFF any "feature" on the DVD player that automatically adjusts colors for any reason whatsoever. Typically this will be labeled a "flesh tone correction" feature. Do this before you begin calibration. In fact it is best to try and set your DVD players controls so that they do the LEAST processing of the image. There will generally be a "picture mode" in the player that is described as doing almost nothing to the image, and the manufacturer's default settings for that mode are usually the ones you want. But do check and make sure they haven't snuck in some feature like "flesh tone correction". Also, use the resolution and cabling that you actually intend to use while watching movies.
Second, all displays have a red or blue bias to their idea of how to display "white". Think of the difference natural objects have when viewed under sunlight, or incandescent lamps, or fluorescent lamps. This bias is due to the relative balance of colors in the light source, and is referred to as Color Temperature.
The Fujitsu allows you to select Color Temperature (in the Precision Setting menu). So even though you have the color balance properly set with the Color and Tint controls, you may still find the image is warmer (redder) or cooler (bluer) than you like. You fix this by adjusting the Color Temperature up or down from "standard".
But the Fujitsu also has different "picture modes" and just what "standard" Color Temperature means is different according to which picture mode you select. In particular, the Dynamic and Conventional picture modes are way too red to begin with, for reasons I won't go into here (the so called "torch" modes). I strongly advise against using either of those.
Personally, I recommend you use the Fine picture mode and calibrate with that picture mode set. As you'll see from my notes in the "P50 halo effect", I prefer the "standard" Color Temperature offered with Fine picture mode.
--Bob
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Here's a link that shows what the Joe Kane color bars should look like with DVE. Title 12, Chapter 6 (12-6). http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/...tialsDVDr2.php
I was just playing around with my P50 using these color bars and the color filters. Using the blue filter everything looked good with Color and Tint of 0. However, with the red filter, red was a little "off", and with the green filter, green was even more "off". I could make red look good (making the line disappear on the blocks in between the dark blocks and making the end blocks - top lef, bottom right - blend into the background) by taking Tint negative. However, by doing this, green got worse.
So I experimented for a while to try and come up with settings that kept blue correct and minimized the error in red and green. The best to my eyes comes up with Color of +5 and Tint of +5. Also, bumping color had an effect on my brightness. I had to increase black level in the precision settings (Fine mode) by 2 ticks to make the "Morse Code" green lines disappear again on the black bar pattern. This with Standard color temp too.
larry
I was just playing around with my P50 using these color bars and the color filters. Using the blue filter everything looked good with Color and Tint of 0. However, with the red filter, red was a little "off", and with the green filter, green was even more "off". I could make red look good (making the line disappear on the blocks in between the dark blocks and making the end blocks - top lef, bottom right - blend into the background) by taking Tint negative. However, by doing this, green got worse.
So I experimented for a while to try and come up with settings that kept blue correct and minimized the error in red and green. The best to my eyes comes up with Color of +5 and Tint of +5. Also, bumping color had an effect on my brightness. I had to increase black level in the precision settings (Fine mode) by 2 ticks to make the "Morse Code" green lines disappear again on the black bar pattern. This with Standard color temp too.larry
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