[jbug]

Months after the launch of 3D, I am still baffled by ghosting and no official word (that I know of) from 3D product manufacturers. And though Samsung has issued no statements it has addressed this problem with software updates. Thus far the problem is still there. One ray of light is that certain movies are virtually free from ghosting/crosstalk (CWACOM, COTT). I just got ACC and was disappointed with the ghosting and especially two scenes where close up face shots of Scrooge and later Cratchett had a doppleganger effect. I was able to dial it down some but I was left shaking my head.


I sure would like to see someone release a statement concerning crosstalk/ghosting. Now when I read user/professional 3D BD reviews the amount of ghosting present has to always pop up. I'm starting to have thoughts of whether or not I can live with ghost now. I'm sure by next generation it will be addressed but I hope the cure will be backward compatible. I'm aware of the risk of new technology but my question is can you live with it for now?


Samsung PN63C8000

 

[Steve P.]

We shouldn't have to, especially when there was virtually none with shutter glasses with the old field sequential tapes and DVDs. Of course we watched those on CRTs, and now on computers. I don't get a lot with my plasma, but it still bothers me.

 

[philnerd]

Ghosting is very distracting to me. Having said that, my DLP doesn't ghost so I'm quite happy with my home 3D setup

As for addressing the issue of current LCD and Plasma TV ghosting, the manufacturers aren't gonna say a word. They've got no incentive to take responsibility for a problem that most people don't notice or complain about. As far as they're concerned, the less they talk about it the better.

 

[pmalter0]



Quote:
Originally Posted by philnerd /forum/post/19507689


Ghosting is very distracting to me. Having said that, my DLP doesn't ghost so I'm quite happy with my home 3D setup

As for addressing the issue of current LCD and Plasma TV ghosting, the manufacturers aren't gonna say a word. They've got no incentive to take responsibility for a problem that most people don't notice or complain about. As far as they're concerned, the less they talk about it the better.

What glasses are you using?

 

[wired1]

You know, I am sure it is there, but I just don't see it. So I guess I AM living with it.


That being said, for those who do see it, it is UNACCEPTABLE.

 

[thebat68]

I use a DLP and have 18 Blu-ray 3D discs and have only seen a small amount of ghosting on one disc, IMAX Space Station. I am pretty pleased with the content thus far.

 

[jeffdom]

Well when Samsung finally releases the new glasses, they should reduce some of the ghosting. They had a press statement about the new glasses coming in December but so far nothing new is out there...


I agree its content related, some movies there is virtually none and others you see some, mostly in the background images.. It really doesnt bother me and all my friends who have watched movies at my place cant even see it, even when I point it out... So I really think once you see it and it annoys you, then you always just "look" for it instead of enjoying the movie

 

[jbug]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffdom /forum/post/19507795


Well when Samsung finally releases the new glasses, they should reduce some of the ghosting. They had a press statement about the new glasses coming in December but so far nothing new is out there...


I agree its content related, some movies there is virtually none and others you see some, mostly in the background images.. It really doesnt bother me and all my friends who have watched movies at my place cant even see it, even when I point it out... So I really think once you see it and it annoys you, then you always just "look" for it instead of enjoying the movie

Jeff, I had to laugh when you mentioned pointing out the ghosting and they still didn't see it. I just imagined you saying "right there, see it?" There are a lot picture related artifacts that I don't see and many here do. I don't see them and ain't looking for them either. I wish I had your friends eyes regarding ghosting though. At least Samsung is trying to address the problem. What about the other manufacturers? Are they doing software updates?


I have six pairs of glasses. It would be nice to do a trade-in or trade-in with a discount toward newer glasses that eliminate ghost or else let's get a priest and holy water.

 

[buzzard767]

Can You Live With Ghosting?


No!


I was really put off by all the crosstalk when I viewed the new 3D TVs available at BB. I could not believe the manufacturers would put these on the market.


I do watch as much 3D TV as I can, however, but my displays are DLPs, both LED and Laser. Read my lips: NO CROSSTALK

 

[TonyDP]

I really think some level of ghosting is inherent in all forms of 3D and its something that we'll have to just live with to a certain degree. I've been into 3D since I was a kid and have seen it on just about every medium: Viewmaster slides, anaglyph, CRT field-sequential, even on the large screen Imax presentations.


For the most part the current crop of BluRays and games keep it down to what I think is an acceptable minimum. Unfortunately, some people are just more attuned to it than others, just as some people seem to be ultra-sensitive to any form of image enhancement such as DNR or edge enhancement.

 

[RickD_99]

I'm trying to train myself not to notice the crosstalk, just as I was able to train myself not to notice the "silk screen effect" on my 2005 Sony SXRD set.

 

[palmeiro]



Quote:
Originally Posted by thebat68 /forum/post/19507751


I use a DLP and have 18 Blu-ray 3D discs and have only seen a small amount of ghosting on one disc, IMAX Space Station. I am pretty pleased with the content thus far.

I was thinking the exact thing last night while watching on my Mit DLP. I finally watched IMAX Space Station and there's a scene right after Cruise mentions something about being in small space like a sardine. Then next scene to the right had some "ghosting" issue. I went "Oh, so THAT'S what ghosting is". I watched 10+ 3D blu-rays so far and that was the first I've seen with ghosting issue. Space Station was still fantastic though.

 

[everyperson]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jbug /forum/post/19507606


Months after the launch of 3D, I am still baffled by ghosting and no official word (that I know of) from 3D product manufacturers. And though Samsung has issued no statements it has addressed this problem with software updates. Thus far the problem is still there. One ray of light is that certain movies are virtually free from ghosting/crosstalk (CWACOM, COTT). I just got ACC and was disappointed with the ghosting and especially two scenes where close up face shots of Scrooge and later Cratchett had a doppleganger effect. I was able to dial it down some but I was left shaking my head.


I sure would like to see someone release a statement concerning crosstalk/ghosting. Now when I read user/professional 3D BD reviews the amount of ghosting present has to always pop up. I'm starting to have thoughts of whether or not I can live with ghost now. I'm sure by next generation it will be addressed but I hope the cure will be backward compatible. I'm aware of the risk of new technology but my question is can you live with it for now?


Samsung PN63C8000

Since you just viewed A Christmas Carol, there is bound to be "ghosting". At least four times!

Seriously...This problem is very slight in most of the new 3Ds and I can live with that. I still believe that it is not the 3D panels or glasses, but the mastering of the actual movie to BD 3D. The Polar Express exhibits very little ghosting, but Space Station has it from the first astronauts glove. I think Avatar should be better. I just hope the early adopters will benefit from new updates to solve the problem. I needed a new panel and the 3D was just a wonderful bonus(Samsung PN58C8000).

 

[thebat68]



Quote:
Originally Posted by palmeiro /forum/post/19508307


I was thinking the exact thing last night while watching on my Mit DLP. I finally watched IMAX Space Station and there's a scene right after Cruise mentions something about being in small space like a sardine. Then next scene to the right had some "ghosting" issue. I went "Oh, so THAT'S what ghosting is". I watched 10+ 3D blu-rays so far and that was the first I've seen with ghosting issue. Space Station was still fantastic though.

That was the same place I saw ghosting as well.

 

[skypilotofhope]



Quote:
Originally Posted by philnerd /forum/post/19507689


As for addressing the issue of current LCD and Plasma TV ghosting, the manufacturers aren't gonna say a word. They've got no incentive to take responsibility for a problem that most people don't notice or complain about. As far as they're concerned, the less they talk about it the better.

Sony has said something about it, however, they refer to the problem as "double images" or "with outlines around the subject..." They suggest tips and then offer optional polarizer filters that fit onto their current glasses as a possible remedy.


See http://www.kb.sony.com/selfservice/m...00%20189737969

 

[Deja Vu]

I've only watched four 3D BD movies so far and have seen no "ghosting" at all. I'm using a 3D DLP projector and feel I may have to stick with DLP due to the lack of crosstalk. I've certainly seen some ghosting on the flat panels at Best Buy and I'm happy to have avoided it so far.

 

[rcandiloro]

Plasma 63C8000 owner. Minimal to no ghosting on all content. It doesn't bother me. However, if it was significant I can see how it would bug me.

 

[Joseph Clark]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyDP I really think some level of ghosting is inherent in all forms of 3D and its something that we'll have to just live with to a certain degree. I've been into 3D since I was a kid and have seen it on just about every medium: Viewmaster slides, anaglyph, CRT field-sequential, even on the large screen Imax presentations. For the most part the current crop of BluRays and games keep it down to what I think is an acceptable minimum. Unfortunately, some people are just more attuned to it than others, just as some people seem to be ultra-sensitive to any form of image enhancement such as DNR or edge enhancement.

Tony,


I don't see how ghosting is even possible on a ViewMaster. Each eye is looking directly at its own film image. Ghosting is caused when one eye perceives a partial image intended for the other eye.


Please explain.

 

[Anthony1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbug Months after the launch of 3D, I am still baffled by ghosting and no official word (that I know of) from 3D product manufacturers. And though Samsung has issued no statements it has addressed this problem with software updates. Thus far the problem is still there. One ray of light is that certain movies are virtually free from ghosting/crosstalk (CWACOM, COTT). I just got ACC and was disappointed with the ghosting and especially two scenes where close up face shots of Scrooge and later Cratchett had a doppleganger effect. I was able to dial it down some but I was left shaking my head. I sure would like to see someone release a statement concerning crosstalk/ghosting. Now when I read user/professional 3D BD reviews the amount of ghosting present has to always pop up. I'm starting to have thoughts of whether or not I can live with ghost now. I'm sure by next generation it will be addressed but I hope the cure will be backward compatible. I'm aware of the risk of new technology but my question is can you live with it for now? Samsung PN63C8000

When I first started reading your post, I assumed you had a Samsung LCD. I have seen some of the Samsung LCD's in action, and the ghosting was definitely noticeable, and troubling. I have a Samsung PN50C680 plasma, and for the most part, I don't see much ghosting. Every once in awhile it will crop up, but I've seen tons of stuff on it that had zero ghosting. I'm guessing it's the way the source material was filmed/processed, whatever...


What bothers me more than ghosting, is the fact that my glasses can momentarily loose sync, and it's very, very annoying. When a scene goes from really dark to really light, (or maybe it's vice versa), sometimes my glasses will loose sync, and "blink" once or twice before regaining sync. It's very, very irritating. I've noticed it with How to Train Your Dragon more than anything. There are lots of dark scenes in how to train your Dragon, and it seems to affect the glasses more.


I've seen alot of movies, and played quite a few games that had basically no ghosting, so I don't think it's a problem with the TV itself. Still, these are the early days of 3D, and not everything is going to work out perfectly. It all likelihood, we are going to need to upgrade to a newer 3DTV in a few years anyway.


Especially if you're a gamer. These current 3DTV's can't do 1080p at 60 frames to each eye, and I know the next Xbox and Playstation will be able to do full 1080p at 60 frames to each eye. I'm going to need a new TV then anyways...

 

[TonyDP]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark /forum/post/19511354


Tony,


I don't see how ghosting is even possible on a ViewMaster. Each eye is looking directly at its own film image. Ghosting is caused when one eye perceives a partial image intended for the other eye.


Please explain.

Maybe my memory is playing tricks with me but I seem to remember some Viewmaster slides where the images did not sync up properly. I still have them lying around somewhere; if I can find them, I'll definitely check it out.