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Discussion Starter #1
I read the other post about this subject and thought I'd start a new thread for people to post particulars about the picture quality of the game. I watched via CBS-HD on Dish Network. I have included some simulated images based on the screen captures taken by Larry H. at http://members.home.net/larryh791/ .


First, primarily at the start of the game, there was this strange out-of-focus corner of the image. Very odd indeed.

http://www.spudland.com/10262001-focus.jpg


Second, there was a noticable "red" bleeding effect on the right side of the screen as well on the left. I believe that this could be because of a misaligned CCD. The cameras they use are HDCAMs with three CCD elements. I am guessing that, for the main game camera, the red element got knocked out of place (perhaps the camera was dropped?). Perhaps they smacked the camera around a bit to correct the focusing problem!

http://www.spudland.com/10262001-red.jpg


Thirdly, there was way too much edge enhancement or something on the same cameras used in the angles above. I don't know if it was edge enhancement or what, I don't think anybody at CBS would put edge enhancement on HD...


Last of all, I must comment that all other cameras used (i.e. cameras that were not overlooking the field) seemed to look just great! No weird EE effects or shimmer, no red bleeding, all in focus. Almost as good as the "It's All Here" CBS-HD promo spots (that look positively outstanding)!


Remember these aren't complaints. Just observations. Hopefully the production company will get their stuff fixed by next weekend!


-- Robert
 

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I saw the same and I'm glad (??) to see I wasn't the only one. The only thing I can think of is that there was some.... "crud", shall we say, on the lens of the camera. The image was fine when they used other angles.


What annoyed me the most, though, were the sporadic SDTV full-screen-stretch replays. You get used to seeing plays in normal aspect ratio, and they suddenly change it and make everybody look stubby. Bugs the hell out of me.


The rest of the effects were fine. I was even content with watching HDTV in a subwindow while the score ticker was going. Usually, the loss of screen area results in loss of detail. I guess they just trimmed the HDTV frame to take a smaller area because I could not notice a loss of detail/resolution.
 

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These pictures are from the Alabama/Tennessee game. Yesterday's game (10/26) was Florida/Georgia. Are you saying that the picture you saw yesterday (Fla/Ga) was the same as what you saw during the Ala/Tenn game?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Quote:
Originally posted by mknoebel
These pictures are from the Alabama/Tennessee game. Yesterday's game (10/26) was Florida/Georgia. Are you saying that the picture you saw yesterday (Fla/Ga) was the same as what you saw during the Ala/Tenn game?
I did not see the Ala/Tenn game. Like I said in the post, these are "simulated images based on the screen captures taken by Larry H. at http://members.home.net/larryh791/ "...


This means these problems are the same as what I saw yesterday but simulated based on other screen captures made last week.


-- Robert
 

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I've noticed heavy edge enhancement on the NTSC upconverted cameras. The use of NTSC along with HD cams is very distracting, in my opinion.
 

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I have just updated my web site by adding a new page of shots from the 10-2601 game. I also provide a fair bit of commentary:

http://members.home.net/larryh791/football02/index.htm


To summarize, the CBS game used excessive edge enhancemnt and also reacted very poorly to any motion. The HDNet game was much smoother with regard to motion (I have no shots of the latter). The motion problems might be local to my CBS station.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DevoX



I did not see the Ala/Tenn game. Like I said in the post, these are "simulated images based on the screen captures taken by Larry H. at http://members.home.net/larryh791/ "...


This means these problems are the same as what I saw yesterday but simulated based on other screen captures made last week.


-- Robert
OK. I didn't understand that from the original post. I got in now!;)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I think it's important that we HD'ers make it clear to CBS that edge enhancement is absolutely not wanted and certainly not needed with HDTV. We're fighting this battle with DVD and I can't explain why we're getting the same EE treatment with HDTV when we did not before. I just got CBS-HD here last weekend since I moved so I had not seen an HD football game since the Superbowl in January. Yesterday's game footage was a radical departure from the quality of the Superbowl. Is this what all the games have looked like?


I think it comes down to the people in the production trucks using small 10-12 inch monitors and not understanding what EE is. Assuming that this is EE, which has yet to be determined.


Anyway, the point here is not to complain but rather to point out to our friends at CBS that they need to pass word down the production folks to turn those artificial sharpness settings all the way down! Let those guys in the truck know that while the adjustments make the games look better on their small monitors, it looks awful on real HDTVs.


HDTV football can look as good as the CBS-HD "It's all Here" promo spots! And that's what we're all hoping for. :)


-- Robert
 

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does CBS think we are idiots? they keep doing this crap...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I don't think they are doing it on purpose... at least it appears innocent enough. Like I said, on the production company's small screen monitors, EE probably makes it look "more" high-def than it already is. They don't understand the negative impact of what they are doing. It's the same way with DVD. The folks that make the discs don't know the damage they are doing when they add these artifacts to the image... they think they are making it "sharper", which they are -- for their little 12-inch displays.


-- Robert
 

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Who do we e-mail??


Let's be sure to pass the message along to the correct folks at CBS.


I am sure they will appreciate constructive specific feedback like this from us.


-- Cain
 

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We don't need to e-mail anyone. The other topic regarding this game was started by Bob Ross, an operations VP for CBS in NYC.


This topic only diluted the comments and could possibly prevent Mr. Ross from seeing it. Think of it this way: if you worked at CBS and started a topic asking what viewers here though of the game yesterday, would you bother looking for other topics on the same subject?


As Larry has posted a link for this one on the other topic, I'm going to close this one. Please continue the discussion here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...threadid=88412
 
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