[steveman513]

Hey guys,

I'm renting a house for this next year and I want a good 5.1 HT setup to complement my new 46" Samsung Series 5 LED TV. Currently I have a 6-7 year old entry level Onkyo HTIB, and I would frankly like to upgrade to something better. My proposed setup would mainly be used for gaming, watching BD movies, and listening to music, especially if we host a party (so techno and bass heavy music). I would like to keep everything under $1000.

Here's what I've been looking at:


Receiver: Onkyo TX NR609, I've been looking at this one because I feel that it is powerful enough to power any system I can get in my price range and any future upgrades. Plus it seems future proof enough to allow me to not have to worry about buying a new receiver in the foreseeable future. Also the deals on them are fairly good.


Front L/R Speakers: My dad is willing to give me a pair of large floor standing speakers that he has had for some time. Either he will give me a pair of Tannoy speakers, or Klipsch Forte speakers. Both are approximately the same size. I dont know much about either one, but from what I have read online it seems that they are fairly highly regarded for sound quality. I just dont know if they would be good for my setup.


From here on I am not so sure on everything else.

Center Speaker: I have been looking at used Def Tech ProCenter 1000s and C/L/R 2002s on ebay. I have no idea whether they would be good for my setup, they just seem to get good reviews and the deals seem pretty good too.


Rear L/R speakers: I have mainly been looking at used Def Tech 800s on ebay. But otherwise, I have no idea.


Sub: Um, I dont really know. I want something that is pretty powerful, but it realistically cant be over $200-$300.


Any suggestions you guys have would be greatly appreciated. Also I have no affinity toward Def Tech, they just caught my eye, so dont be hesitant to suggest anything that is better in the same price range.


Thanks a lot

 

[sholling]

My advice is don't get too elaborate right now. Friends are going to get drunk at parties and start playing with the volume knob. Unless the room is really huge I'd go with a set of Infinity Primus speakers... 3x P163 for mains and center and 2x P153 as surrounds. Lay one of the P163s on it's side and rotate the tweeter 90 degrees and you have a center.

Add a nice factory re-certified but far more capable Onkyo TX-NR708 , and the best $200 subwoofer that you can find. I'm not an expert on $200 subs so I'll leave that to those in the subwoofer forum that know them best. If the room big you can always add a second sub later. I do have some experience buying factory re-certified Onkyos from A4L and both times the transaction and product were flawless.


That's a complete 5.1 system for $1050 including ~$200 for the sub.

 

[Genelec Man]

I would add as much sub as you can to the Tannoy's or Klipsch for a 2.1 system. This will give you good sound for parties etc. Then add a center & surrounds last. In the end you should be pretty happy.

 

[mconno]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Genelec Man /forum/post/20768821


I would add as much sub as you can to the Tannoy's or Klipsch for a 2.1 system. This will give you good sound for parties etc. Then add a center & surrounds last. In the end you should be pretty happy.

I agree. Surround sound has little use for parties and 2.1 set to mono gives drinkers a way to hide in the corner and sleep it off while taking refuge from the loud music. For parties, I feel it's better to set it up like a band with a sound stage projecting to the middle of the room. If you go surround sound, add decent center and cheap surrounds you can deactivate for parties.

 

[steveman513]

Ok all good suggestions but you think college students get drunk at parties??? Noooo not us....

Anyways, as for surrounds, I would still like to setup a 5.1 system for games and movies, thats what the system will mainly be used for. So are the speakers I've been looking at any good for going with the Tannoys or Klipsch's? While those speakers are large, I'm trying to save as much money as I can so I can buy quality components for everything else because that's just two less speakers I have to buy. But, I'm open to any suggestions.

 

[psgcdn]

The Forte would be a killer base for an HT, but you need to match the center speaker with something comparable: a Klipsch from the same era. You'll want to scan Craiglist regularly. Maybe a KLF-C7 or an Academy ?

 

[dookie1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by psgcdn /forum/post/20770085


The Forte would be a killer base for an HT, but you need to match the center speaker with something comparable: a Klipsch from the same era. You'll want to scan Craiglist regularly. Maybe a KLF-C7 or an Academy ?

this.


the klipsch are the better party speaker for sure. but for proper soundstaging with surround, you want a voice-matched center. don't worry so much about the surrounds.

 

[Interspy24]



Quote:
Originally Posted by sholling /forum/post/20768685


My advice is don't get too elaborate right now. Friends are going to get drunk at parties and start playing with the volume knob. Unless the room is really huge I'd go with a set of Infinity Primus speakers... 3x P163 for mains and center and 2x P153 as surrounds. Lay one of the P163s on it's side and rotate the tweeter 90 degrees and you have a center.

Add a nice factory re-certified but far more capable Onkyo TX-NR708 , and the best $200 subwoofer that you can find. I'm not an expert on $200 subs so I'll leave that to those in the subwoofer forum that know them best. If the room big you can always add a second sub later. I do have some experience buying factory re-certified Onkyos from A4L and both times the transaction and product were flawless.


That's a complete 5.1 system for $1050 including ~$200 for the sub.

I think the above is a great suggestion. The primus is a great speaker for the price and still leaves you with room for the receiver and sub. I dont know the exact dimensions, but also consider 5 of the 163s if you have the room. The price is just a little more than the 153s.


For subs in the $200 range, check out the Bic F12. It's more oriented towards ht versus music, but its probably the most slam you will get for $200. Another option are subs from elemental designs. This one for $350 shipped should give you pretty good bass:

http://www.edesignaudio.com/product_...roducts_id=406


Also for receivers consider the RC180. Refurbished from A4L it can be found for $350, its a great deal.

 

[Looneybomber]



Quote:
Originally Posted by sholling /forum/post/20768685


Lay one of the P163s on it's side and rotate the tweeter 90 degrees and you have a center.

1. For best sound, don't lay the speaker on it's side. Keep it upright.

2. If laid on it's side, rotating the tweeter 90deg will accomplish nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Interspy24 /forum/post/20772766


I think the above is a great suggestion. The primus is a great speaker for the price

Not great, but good.

 

[tony123]

Get the Forte' as it is a great HT choice regardless of budget. For the sub, I would build something DIY for cheap and potent. Would also consider the used market. I just sold a Velodyne that was $1500 10 years ago for $300. You can get much more quality and performance on the used market.


Best of luck.

 

[steveman513]

Ok I'll take a look at the F12 and the Primus speakers. As for the center speaker, I understand that if I'm going to use the Fortes I need a quality center speaker to go along with them, but the two that have been suggested, the KLF-C7 and the Academy are both in the $300 range used. Is there any other center speaker that I could use that would not be as expensive as those, but wouldn't be much worse in regards to sound quality? You have to remember that I'm coming from a 6 year old entry level Onkyo HTIB system, so pretty much anything is going to sound better than that haha.

 

[psgcdn]

Then use a phantom center (i.e. no center at all). Honestly, the sound will only be as good as the cheap center speaker you put in there for movies, decreasing the enjoyment you'll get from the Forte. Put the whole speaker budget on the sub for a much better 2.1 system. I'd say $300 on a receiver and $700 on the sub.

 

[crazyrob425]



Quote:
Originally Posted by psgcdn /forum/post/20774866


Then use a phantom center (i.e. no center at all). Honestly, the sound will only be as good as the cheap center speaker you put in there for movies, decreasing the enjoyment you'll get from the Forte. Put the whole speaker budget on the sub for a much better 2.1 system. I'd say $300 on a receiver and $700 on the sub.

x2

 

[tony123]



Quote:
Originally Posted by psgcdn /forum/post/20774866


Then use a phantom center (i.e. no center at all). Honestly, the sound will only be as good as the cheap center speaker you put in there for movies, decreasing the enjoyment you'll get from the Forte. Put the whole speaker budget on the sub for a much better 2.1 system. I'd say $300 on a receiver and $700 on the sub.

x3 Do a Phantom center and you'll love it. With no center, might you put a little more into a sub? That would have more impact than a center anyhow. You can put something dirt cheap as surrounds for awhile. I used a $50 pair of used Paradigm bookshelves for about 10 years and they were great.

DO NOT consider passing on the Forte's for the Primus. It's a whole world of difference in theater performance.

 

[sholling]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Looneybomber 1. For best sound, don't lay the speaker on it's side. Keep it upright.

There isn't always room for an upright center. It actually works quite well with some speakers. But if you have some documentation that it doesn't with the P163 I'd love to see it...

Quote:

2. If laid on it's side, rotating the tweeter 90deg will accomplish nothing.

You might want to look at the picture before coming out with a statement like that. The P163's tweeter has a wave guide that needs to be rotated.

 

[Looneybomber]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sholling You might want to look at the picture before coming out with a statement like that. The P163's tweeter has a wave guide that needs to be rotated.

Yes it has a small wave guide, but if you did take a look at them, you'd notice they're conical, meaning they have a constant radius like a tire. They're not squished vertically and spread horizontally which would need rotating.


See the difference...

 

[sholling]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Looneybomber Yes it has a small wave guide, but if you did take a look at them, you'd notice they're conical, meaning they have a constant radius like a tire. They're not squished vertically and spread horizontally which would need rotating.

It's enough that the tweeter should still be rotated.

 

[Looneybomber]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sholling There isn't always room for an upright center. It actually works quite well with some speakers. But if you have some documentation that it doesn't with the P163 I'd love to see it...

Polar response of a 2way design. Notice the forward lobe (Vertical) works well when placed in the upright position and on a speaker stand. The suckout stays above head level. When placed on the side, that suckout is then located horizontally and will be heard if sitting in that suckout. Which could be at the chair in the corner or edge of the couch.

I'm not saying it won't work, I've used a beta-20 on it's side under a TV, but I understood the compromise with the design.

 

[Looneybomber]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sholling It's enough that the tweeter should still be rotated.

Again, it's a perfectly round waveguide, producing equal amounts of loading vertically and horizontally. Rotate it if you want, but it's a waste. The woofer is also conical. Rotate it too if you want.

 

[skidawgz]

I would suggest you try to match your center to your dads speakers to the best of your ability. Everyone has already told you this, so no news here. This will give you good sound for your games and movies when there is no party going on.


I would go cheap on rear speakers, is your Onkyo HTIB still useable? I would hook the rears from that up for my back speakers. If not find a set of bookshelves that cost as little as possible without sounding like crap.


... while the guys are arguing about tweeters I'll add some things I would be thinking about.

Have you considered a receiver with Airplay for the parties? In college I networked everything together but there was no Airplay at the time. Also Droid/Apple friendly receivers allow you use your phone as a full remote. I've experimented with this on the Pioneers and Denon/Marantz. Pioneer has the best network remote control app.


Do you have neighbors above, below, or next to you in the same building? I wouldn't spend much on the sub this time around if so. You should get a quality sub, but you will never use it if you have close neighbors. No neighbors? Get something nice in your budget, it will sound great for music.