AVS Forum banner

1621 - 1639 of 1639 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
106 Posts
Hi everybody,

I did a new profile yesterday (after probe matching my i1d3 to my i1Pro 2 spectro) with @BlackJoker's Medium patch set (ColourSpace CMS - Next Generation Calibration... Thread) I used the settings recommended in @liberator72's guides except for pre-roll where I went with 0.70 instead of the recommended value 2.3 The profile turned out quite well, the drift seems good given my "hobbyist" hardware:

Screenshot 2021-04-06 145539.png

I then generated multiple LUTs with different gamma setting each, ran verifications and checked the results with @Anger.miki's Genius dE2Kalculator, and they also look great to me.

1617714695044.png 1617714745894.png 1617714787323.png

The numbers for my 2.4 gamma LUT for example are comparable to what I was getting before with the official patch sets (ColourSpace CMS - Next Generation Calibration... Thread). However, profiling with the new patch set along with the reduced pre-roll setting takes me down from ~3.5h to ~2.5h for a full profile, which is wonderful—even for those of us, who do not calibrate daily.

Many thanks to everybody involved in making calibration seem easy and fun for beginners like me!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
611 Posts
Awesome results and great that the tools such like the genius excel sheet for evaluation and also the new Patchsets are helping to reduce the profiling time
 
  • Like
Reactions: Anger.miki

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,623 (Edited)
ColourSpace Beta 1.0.0.1049 (06 April 2021)

Release Notes


Prevented ColourSpace force closing when loading old profiles lacking metadata (Old profiles will not pre-configure Patch Scale & Resolution, etc.) (1.0.0.1049)

Fixed issue with incorrect Manual Measure GUI dE values when ‘Auto’ Min/Max Luma active. (1.0.0.1049)

Re-enabled Preset patch sets updating selected patch with Auto Advance. (1.0.0.1046)

Added additional delay to DVDO AVLab for FW Stabilisation option. (1.0.0.1046)

Fixed crash with Remote Control. (1.0.0.1046)

Corrected Typo in Maths option. (1.0.0.1046)

Added first level changes for 109% Extended range operation. (1.0.0.1046)

Extended Peak White set at 100%, not 109%, as shown in graphs. (1.0.0.1046)

In-built Pre-set Characterisation profiles modified for new Extended 109% operation. (1.0.0.1046)

Patch Scale & Resolution settings recalled when Profile reloaded from the library. (1.0.0.1046)

Modified BenQ integration to add a third calibration slot. (1.0.0.1046)

Updated Plura SDK. (1.0.0.1046)

NOTE: New Download Instructions

Please read about the new download instructions here.

Installation Notes

ColourSpace Installer will completely overwrite any previously installed version, not just update it.

It will not require to un-install older releases before installing a newer version.

Update Notes

While ColourSpace is working in beta, when the users will start ColourSpace, it will not pop-up notification to inform them about the availability of a newer beta.

However, I will update this thread but also refresh the form page with release notes text per each beta.



* IMPORTANT CHANGES ABOUT CUSTOM PATCHSETS / TARGET LUMA *

ColourSpace 1.0.0.1046 release has changed the way the Target Luma is working.

SMTPE Video Legal Levels Signal, in 8-bit values, has 16 as reference black (0%) and 235 as reference white (100% White); when you want to profile/calibrate for video levels, select LEGAL @ ColourSpace patchscale.

When custom patchsets are used, they have to contain 16-235 RGB triplet values.

SMTPE Extended Video Levels Signal, in 8-bit values, has 16 as reference black (0%), 235 as reference white (100% White), and 255 are Super White (109%); when you want to profile/calibrate for extended levels, select EXTENDED @ ColourSpace patchscale.

When users use custom patchsets, they have to contain 16-255 RGB triplet values.

LG OLED users for SDR profiling use EXTENDED patchscale for pre-calibration and profiling.

ColourSpace users familiar with LG OLED pre-calibration know that for SDR Reference (Night - 2.4 gamma) profiling, they will pre-calibrate 109% Super White (255.255.255) for 124 nits, to get ~100 nits in post-calibration verification @ 100% Reference White.

The old recommendation was to enter as Target Luma 124 nits and then start with pre-calibration of 255.255.255 (aka 109% Super White) RGB Balance.

ColourSpace 1.0.0.1046 changed the way the Target Luma is working, so the users will have to enter 100 nits to Target Luma, since 100% is the reference white, and then the 255.255.255 RGB triplet will automatically target 123.4 nits @ manual measure window, based to their target gamma setting.



In other words, users will have to enter the 100% value they want as a target when EXTENDED patchscale is selected, and ColourSpace will calculate the target Y for levels above 235.

After that new change, when EXTENDED custom patchlist are used for profiling, they have to contain White 235.235.235 / Red 235.16.16 / Green 16.235.16 / Blue 16.16.235 for the proper plotting of RGB Separation chart and general calculations.

When build-in ColourSpace patchsets are used (not custom), then the targets will be re-calculated automatically based on the selected patchscale setting.

According to that change, it makes all previous LG Guide patchlists incompatible.

Users will have to download and use the updated LG OLED REV.4b Guides with ColourSpace 1.0.0.1046 (or newer).

For different (user custom) patchsets for an EXTENDED range of values, it will require additional 235 patches to make them compatible with ColourSpace 1.0.0.1046.



LG OLED Profiling/Calibration Guides

They are available very detailed PDF guides for LG OLED 2018/2019/2020 SDR 3D LUT profiling, HDR10/Dolby Vision calibration for 2019/2020.

LG Guides for ColourSpace (~70 pages) will explain with great detail the required steps; for users to understand what they are doing; to perform the best possible calibration per each calibration mode.

The downloading method for LG Guides has changed.

Now the users can instantly download or check if it's available any updated guide very quickly, without filling any form or sending an email request.

The new LG OLED Guide Download page is here.

The download link is not visible because the form is locked.



The password to unlock the download page is the same password the LG Template users (with approved username) are using to unlock the LG Templates.



The LG Guides release notes will be available on the regular page for a quick check before starting the LG OLED profiling.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
611 Posts
I will update my custom Patchlist to match the latest changes to ColourSpace and will send everyone who purchased them a free copy in the next few days.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
The new beta fixes the graph bug ?
Fixed
thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,626
The new beta fixes the graph bug ?
Fixed
thanks
Hi,

When EXTENDED patches are used, the charts will plot out of the grid for the 236-255 targets; it's normal since the grid is 0 - 1.0.

During pre-calibration of LG OLED, after running a profile of Primary only, it will look like this:



The grid will become 0 - 0. 1.09 in a future build.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,627
I will update my custom Patchlist to match the latest changes to ColourSpace and will send everyone who purchased them a free copy in the next few days.
For the current edition of BlackJoker's patchsets users, they can use ColourSpace Beta 1.0.0.967.

If they don't have this build, I can send them a download link; contact me here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Hi,

When EXTENDED patches are used, the charts will plot out of the grid for the 236-255 targets; it's normal since the grid is 0 - 1.0.

During pre-calibration of LG OLED, after running a profile of Primary only, it will look like this:



The grid will become 0 - 0. 1.09 in a future build.
Thanks for the hands up. I will use 967 with older instruction meanwhile (the next calibration, I want to fix the RGB separation which I didn't do last time as we discussed, so I want the old graphs till it changed)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,629
Thanks for the hands up. I will use 967 with older instruction meanwhile (the next calibration, I want to fix the RGB separation which I didn't do last time as we discussed, so I want the old graphs till it changed)
Hi,

You will have no problem using the latest version; as you can see, it's visible the Gray Line in RGB Separation, above 1.0, so you will have no problem evaluating RGB Separation.

The grid is missing only for above 1.0; it will not affect/impact the procedure since you will focus on Gray Line, not on the grid.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
Hi,

You will have no problem using the latest version; as you can see, it's visible the Gray Line in RGB Separation, above 1.0, so you will have no problem evaluating RGB Separation.

The grid is missing only for above 1.0; it will not affect/impact the procedure since you will focus on Gray Line, not on the grid.
LOL took a while to understand. I saw the picture and graph looks so bad that I thought something else was also wrong sorry for the confusion.

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,631
LOL took a while to understand. I saw the picture and graph looks so bad that I thought something other was also wrong sorry for the confusion.

Thanks
The plotting is looking good because I used a virtual meter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Is it recommended to make any other adjustments other than 2 point white balance when calibrating HDR on an LG CX? Compared to my C8 (which was calibrated by someone else a few years ago), the picture seems a bit desaturated and blacks seem a little crushed.

The C8 has a Colour of 60 whereas the CX is at the default of 50 and increasing it 60 barely makes a difference to my eyes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,437 Posts
Colour should never be 60 on a 2018 LG OLED after calibration in an accurate picture mode (e.g. HDR Cinema). If your C8 was calibrated a few years ago and the result of that was to put colour at 60 in HDR, then it was done incorrectly.

The colour settings needs to remain at its default of 50 for correct colour gamut mapping in HDR. If your CX looks under saturated compared to your C8 then it’s probably because your C8 is wrong.

Also, bear in mind you cannot make the display produce more colour than its native capabilities.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,437 Posts
HDR on the LGs do not work in the same way as SDR. The Brightness, Contrast and Colour settings should remain at their default values. Adjusting Brightness and/or Contrast negatively affects tone mapping. Adjusting Colour negatively affects colour gamut mapping.

On the 2018’s there was the option to reduce OLED Light in HDR slightly to hit 700 nits which gave more accurate PQ EOTF tracking, but that’s about as much as you can do with the manual controls.

Multipoint white balance, and CMS controls should not be used as doing so introduce image issues (usually banding).

Basically, when making only manual adjustments to HDR, the best you can do without negatively impacting something else is a 2 point white balance adjustment. If there was anything more than that, it would be added to the guides.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,636
LG OLED SDR Profiling using ColourSpace and DaVinci Resolve iTPG

I wanted to post some further instructions for DaVinci Resolve users of ColourSpace, as additional info beyond the LG Guides for Profiling/Calibration, to understand how iTPG of Resolve works.

The iTPG of Resolve will receive 0-255 values from ColourSpace with Patchscale @ FULL.

You can see the RGB-Triplet of each patch to the Resolve Dialog window when Resolve iTPG has connected with ColourSpace:



According to the Video Monitoring setting in Resolve, resolve iTPG will scale to LEGAL or retain FULL levels.

According to the Resolve Project Settings -> -> Master Settings -> Video Monitoring -> Data Levels setting:

When Video is selected, Resolve with scale the ColourSpace 0-255 value to 64-940 to the DeckLink output. LG OLED will receive 64-940.



When Full is selected, Resolve will not scale the ColourSpace 0-255 values; it will output 0-1023 values to the DeckLink. LG OLED will receive 0-1023.



Since the LEVEL scaling performed to the output of DeckLink, controlled by Resolve, users have to use FULL patchscale in ColourSpace, use a FULL patchset, and then control the scaling from Resolve's Project Settings window.

Based on this information, when required a VIDEO LEVEL (LEGAL) profiling, it will need to configure ColourSpace to FULL patchscale, use FULL range patchset, and set Video Monitoring to VIDEO Levels @ Project Settings.

LG OLED LUT Capability

LG OLEDs internally have 64-1023 3D LUTs (EXTENDED), with HDMI Black Level @ LOW.

When LG has Contrast at 85, the internal LUT will be 64-1023.

When LG has Contrast at 100, the internal LUT will be 64-940.

LG OLED LUT Profiling Options

They are three methods available to profile the LG OLED with Resolve.

Allow Headroom (WTW) and profile LEGAL:

Use Contrast 85 (or below ...if required to fix Panel Factory Calibration), use FULL patchset, FULL patchscale, Video Levels @ Resolve Settings. Apply Videoscale Sub-Black before exporting 3D LUT DeviceControl File Format.

Before profiling, set Target Luma 100 nits (Patchscale FULL), pre-calibrate Reference White (255.255.255 RGB Triplet) in Manual Calibration windows) for 100 nits.

After the LUT Generation, apply a Videoscale Sub-Black Filter to map the 940 of your reference white to the 940 of the 64-1023 LUT.

(FULL patchlists are not provided inside the LG REV. 4B, they are available for download as ''SDR 3D LUT FULL Patchsets for Resolve and LEGAL profiling'' ZIP @ LG OLED Guides Page)

Clip Headroom (WTW) and profile LEGAL:

Use Contrast 100, FULL patchset, FULL patchscale, Video Levels @ Resolve Settings, export 3D LUT DeviceControl File Format.

Before profiling, set Target Luma 100 nits (Patchscale FULL), pre-calibrate Reference White (255.255.255 RGB Triplet in Manual Calibration windows) for 100 nits.

(FULL patchlists are not provided inside the LG REV. 4B, they are available for download as ''SDR 3D LUT FULL Patchsets for Resolve and LEGAL profiling'' ZIP @ LG OLED Guides Page)

That method can be used from LG 2018 OLEDs, which are not suffering from factory panel calibration issues; some 2019 LG OLEDs (rarely) affected.

Systems with DeckLink with SDI output that uses SDI -> HDMI convertor can use that method.

Allow Headroom (WTW) and profile EXTENDED:

Use Contrast 85 (or below if required to fix Panel Factory calibration), use EXTENDED patchset, EXTENDED patchscale, FULL Levels @ Resolve Settings, export 3D LUT DeviceControl File Format.

Before profiling, set Target Luma 100 nits (Patchscale EXTENDED), pre-calibrate Reference White (255.255.255 RGB Triplet in Manual Calibration windows) for 123.4 nits.

The 3rd method explained to the LG Guides REV.4, its the recommended method, especially for LG 2020 OLEDs suffering from factory panel calibration issues.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,850 Posts
Discussion Starter #1,637
Allow Headroom (WTW) and profile EXTENDED Profiling Method Setup Explained (Resolve iTPG):

Ideally, the best procedure is to pre-calibrate / profiling for 64-1023 (EXTENDED) and verify the profiling with 64-940 (LEGAL) ...use Resolve with VIDEO @ Project Settings after profiling.

It's the method explained inside the LG OLED PDF Guide REV.4b, and it will require an EXTENDED patchset for profiling and LEGAL for verification. These patchsets and instructions are included.

However, it will require using the method I will explain below about how to generate EXTENDED patches with iTPG of Resolve.

I made this introduction for the users to understand that based on these options of Resolve/ColourSpace, the iTPG of Resolve can generate LEGAL or FULL patterns, not EXTENDED.

However, I found a trick to able to generate EXTENDED patches with iTPG of Resolve.

When using iTPG of Resolve controlled from ColourSpace via DeckLink HDMI output, with a video data project and ColourSpace patchscale FULL (0-255), an LG OLED will receive 64-940 (video level patterns).

For example, using a DeckLink Monitor 4K HDMI output with 2160p24 video monitor setting, LG OLED will receive RGB 10-bit when the SDI4:4:4 is ticked, and YCbCr 4:2:2 10bit with SDI4:4:4 unticked, using LG OLED Black level @ LOW:

Using a regular workflow, DeckLink will generate LEGAL (64-940) with VIDEO Levels @ Resolve Settings or FULL (0-1023) with FULL Levels @ Resolve Settings; you can't generate 64-1023 patches, so users were using a PGenerator or an external RGB bit-perfect generator to generate EXTENDED patches.

However, I have found a method, which has verified with external scopes also to send 64-1023 patches from Resolve iTPG to the LG OLED, but it will work only with a DeckLink card with HDMI output and only when its enabled the RGB output of the Decklink. (SDI 4:4:4 ticked).

I don't have an adaptor (SDI -> HDMI) to verify that this method is working when users will send RGB from SDI with an SDI -> HDMI convertor. It will require to use 4:4:4 SDI and a resolution which supports 444 with SDI, for example, the 1080p24 of DeckLink Monitor 4K.

For DeckLink Monitor 4K to able to send RGB from HDMI, it will require to tick the SDI4:4:4 setting with 2160p24.

You can confirm that LG gets RGB using HDMI Diagnosis hidden menu.

As you can see, when SDI 4:4:4 is unticked, LG will receive YCbCr 4:2:2 (10 bit...LG doesn't count the bits. 4:2:2 subsampling doesn't send General Control Subpacket to describe the color depth, so while you see 8bit, it's 10 or 12 bit in the real world.)



When SDI 4:4:4 is ticked, DeckLink 4K will send RGB 10-bit to the LG OLED:



When you want to calibrate LG internal SDR 3D LUT, ideally, you need to use RGB 64-1023 patch generation to match the internal LUT range.

For Resolve iTPG, to able to send 64-1023 patches, you have to set FULL Levels @ Video Monitor Data Levels @ Resolve Settings, set from ColourSpace EXTENDED patchscale, Resolve will receive 16-255 patches from ColourSpace (set LG OLED HDMI black level @ LOW.)

Using these settings, iTPG of Resolve will work in 0-1023, and the ColorSpace due to EXTENDED patchscale setting will send 16-255, so LG OLED will receive 64-1023 patches.

About the Pre-Calibration / Profiling using these settings, for the LG OLED to receive 64-1023 patches. (Resolve SDI 4:4:4 ticked, Full Data Levels Video Monitor Setting, EXTENDED patchscale and LG OLED Black Level @ LOW)

Use the REV.4b Guide patchset for profilng.

After loading the 3D LUT correction to the LG OLED, set patchscale to FULL and verify the calibration using the verification patchset from SDR 3D LUT FULL Patchsets for Resolve and LEGAL profiling'' ZIP @ LG OLED Guides Page), set Resolve Video Monitoring at Video, so the verification will be performed to 64-940 range. (TV HDMI black level is at LOW.)

After the end of the verification, keep the Resolve Video Monitoring to VIDEO @ Video Monitoring Settings.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
If I did pre-calibration and profiling with Luma Target 100 and Auto unchecked in Luma profile, I need to do verification with Luma Target 100 and Auto unchecked or I had to do everything in the process with Auto checked in Luma profile (which means I have to run profiling again)?

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,437 Posts
Luma Targets within the ColourSpace GUI are for graph population and dE calculations only. They have absolutely zero effect of the measured data saved within the profile, and zero effect on the LUT generation process.

LUTs are generated from the actual measured data (measured XYZ values tied to specified RGB stimuli). It doesn't matter what the actual target peak luma states in the menu, it is a visual target only, the LUT will be generated from the measured peak luma (unless you Limit Peak Luma during LUT generation, of course).

If Auto is unchecked and you want the graphs to populate with the correct dE values, just click the "^" above the Auto checkbox. It will update the "Target Luma (nits)" section with the "Profile Luma (nits)" data which is the exact measured values from within the profile.

If the actual profile was made with the correct pre-calibration steps, and the correct patch scale/resolution settings, then there is absolutely no need to run the profile again.

Here you see full display profile with Auto unchecked, Luma Target 100 nits. Note how some of the points change their dE colour after clicking the "^" button. This is a graph change only, it does not alter the measured data in any way.

3123428


Same applies here, only this time with a verification profile. Auto has been left unchecked and the Luma Target is that from the main display profile loaded previously. But obviously, the verification profile is run in Legal Range as opposed to Extended, so the peak luma will be lower than that of the 109% target value in the settings.

3123435


Note how the graphs change to reflect the updated Luma Target after clicking "^". Again, the measured data has not been altered, only the peak white and black values from which the dE values are calculated from, and thus how the graphs are plotted.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dreamer2018
1621 - 1639 of 1639 Posts
Top